The first Schrade 8OT with bone scales. 1959 - 1961 ?

Discussion in 'Schrade Knives Collectors Forum' started by koldgold, Mar 2, 2015.

  1. koldgold

    koldgold

    Jul 2, 2010
    I found my Every Day User back in 1973; it was a Schrade 881. Since then I have collected many Schrade 4" knives.

    The "FIRST" 8OT Old Timer has always been a must have for me. However, what was the first 8OT and when was it made.
    Why did this early 8OT have a different "Old Timer shield" with jimping on the rear brass liners?
    Did they first come in a wooden box? How lone did they make them? Where did they all go?
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    Last edited: Mar 3, 2015
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  2. Larry303

    Larry303

    Jul 28, 2005
    G'day Ken, that looks a tad familiar...lol.... I hope this thread has many collector contributions in the future..on the early 8OT's both bovine bone and Meerschaum..to draw all the current conclusions/guesstimations into one thread..
    I see there is a 'collector' down Texas way who sells on the popular site that insists in his selling descriptions that delrin was not the meerschaum that Schrade described in its flyers. The 1964 <dated> Schrade flyer describes Meerschaum as "unbreakable plastic" yet he states Delrin was not available until some years later....to follow that argument Schrade somehow made bovine bone examples <the earliest which you show above> and then made unbreakable plastic handles in 1964 and then made Delrin handles later.....I reckon that's all hogwash.....
    I reckon Schrade made Bovine Bone 1960/61 then changed to Delrin <unbreakable plastic> but marketing wise decided first to describe as Meerschaum Bone <synthetic material in either case> after the original bovine bone...and then in 1964 described as just 'Meerschaum' handles in its dated flyers however it followed with the statement Meerschaum was unbreakable plastic.....
    I believe I was the first to pick up on the identification pointers for authenticating the earliest 8OT's..namely the swedge goes up and over the longpull matchstrike to within the last 3 or 4 matchstrikes.....and the Matchstrike nail nique contained 17 pointers within the matchstrike.plus 8OT was on the pile side of the master stockman blade..later models the swedge was much shorter and the nail nique had 16 matchstrikes.. and 8OT went to the mark side of the tang...then of course no matchstrike but a nail nique later...Hoo Roo
     
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  3. tongueriver

    tongueriver Gold Member Gold Member

    Dec 28, 2007
    Larry, I think you are spot-on with your comments, except I think the bone ran out a mite earlier. We are talking months, here, I reckon. I have one of the first ones, cedar box, paper with yellow string, etc. It does not have milled liners and I have never heard of one of these knives with milled liners. I would like to see an ORIGINAL example with that feature. I have seen slightly later examples, with the first use of the Delrin, which had MORE pronounced "teeth" in the match-strike pull than my bone example. I suspect the swedge grinds varied somewhat with the cutler at the grinder, and the pulls varied a little, as well.
    But really, what is the REAL question here? What is Ken's EDU, to which he refers, above? Is it an Elucidative Didactic but Unblessed lesson for the Unwashed? I suspect there is more to be learned on AAPN, but who am I to say (who indeed!)? (Just havin' fun) ;):)
     
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  4. thawk

    thawk

    Oct 28, 2006
    I agree with Larry's assessment, and wow what a knife, two of them I guess. I had one of these once, in a wooden box, without milled liners. It was not near as pretty as this one. This examples saw cuts are really prominent. I've seen 2OT's both with and without milled liners, so it does not surprise me there are both varieties in the 8OT as well. I don't think there ever was a true meerschaum material, just marketing terms for "not bone". I'm not sure if those non delrin composites with the goldish dust in the handle had anything to do with Delrin or not. That is the first oval shield on an 8OT in the wild, but it shows them with that very shield in some of the catalog illustrations.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2015
  5. tongueriver

    tongueriver Gold Member Gold Member

    Dec 28, 2007
    Here is one of them. The box is cedar, not paper.

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    btw, I wipe my tinypics from time to time, so save anything of interest from me when you see it; it may not be there, tomorrow.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2015
  6. koldgold

    koldgold

    Jul 2, 2010
    First lets clear up my EDU is my (Every Day User).
    The first knife above (with the sharper-ended shield) has mild liners.
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    My other 8OT has the same shallow match-strike as the one shown by Tongueriver.
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    I found reference to imitation bone used by Ulster in the lated1950s and they also used that sharp-ended shield, on their Old Timer.

    Could this top knife with the other shield, have been a salesman's sample, wit milled liners?
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2015
  7. tongueriver

    tongueriver Gold Member Gold Member

    Dec 28, 2007
    Yes, quite mild, but very nice! Thanks for posting. Is that the knife featured in the OP? Great thread, Ken! Makes me want to send out some #8s to Herman for embellishment!
     
  8. thawk

    thawk

    Oct 28, 2006
    This is the 8OT I had for awhile, and still know of it's whereabouts.

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    The front side of the handles appeared to not have held the dye. Like I mentioned before, no milling.
     
  9. koldgold

    koldgold

    Jul 2, 2010
    The first 8OT is for sale on AAPN the second 8OT "Old Mate Larry" sold it to me, and there is only one more sleep before my Postman puts it in my mail-box.
    I have an 885UH with that same milling, that I would also like to know more about.
     
  10. koldgold

    koldgold

    Jul 2, 2010
    I know this is off topic; this is my sons 8OT Every Day User, that Dale Vincent did for me in bone.
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  11. crbauhs

    crbauhs

    Dec 2, 2007
    I love this thread. The 8OT in bone is my grail knife. Though I would be fairly happy right now for a nice Walden version with matchstrike pulls. Soon... Maybe...
     
  12. ea42

    ea42 Gold Member Gold Member

    Jan 1, 2006
    Here's my example, a little more worn than those other fine specimens! This one seems be of the same vintage as Hal's knife. No milling on this one either:

    PS, images might be HUGE, if so stand by........

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    Eric
     
  13. Saddlebum

    Saddlebum

    323
    Jul 6, 2014
    WOW!......Just, WOW!! Great knives, guys! Good info too, thanks......WOW! :D
     
  14. koldgold

    koldgold

    Jul 2, 2010
    What’s in a name?
    Schrade used names to describe the material use for their knife handles.

    The first time the word “Dalrin” was used, is listed in the registration papers dated 18 August 1953, by E.I. Du Pont De Nemours and Company.

    Schrade used “Meerschaum Unbreakable Plastic” and “Black Plastic” in some of their 1961 and 1962 listings.
    They also used “Unbreakable Staglon” in the late 1950’s – “Staglon” was resisted by The Imperial Knife Associated Companies, in April 1961.

    In 1970 when Schrade made some “8OT Old Timers” for John Primbel; the handle material was called “Genuine Saw Cut Staglon”
    It would appear, that after the first 8OTs came out using bone handles; some 8OTs were made using Black Plastic Handles (made by Du Pont maybe - Delrin?). Note the pull and the shield.

    These 930 Old Times are identical to the early 8OT in every way.
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    Last edited: Mar 3, 2015
  15. thawk

    thawk

    Oct 28, 2006
    I used to own that black 8OT with the oval brass shield. Note the factory honed blades, like the razor blade series. I think they were stainless steel blades, and there was no stamp on the back of the master blade. The handles were definitely delrin. I've never seen another one just like it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2015
  16. Larry303

    Larry303

    Jul 28, 2005
    I believe my Post Number #2 in this thread would indicate the blade on that yellow handle stamped 8OT is one of the very earliest..swedge goes up and over and the long nail nique contains 17 pointers within the long matchstrike, plus the 8OT stamping is on the pile side of the Master Stockman blade....anyways read the post.....very nice 881 shown in the previous post..well done...Hoo Roo
     
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  17. Codger_64

    Codger_64 Moderator Moderator

    Oct 8, 2004
    Thanks! We really wish you would hang out here more and share! Always appreciate your knowledges!
     
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  18. black mamba

    black mamba Gold Member Gold Member

    Oct 21, 2009
    Larry, I just got this one off the bay, sounds exactly like the one you posted (but the pics are all gone).

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