The Hollow Grinds terms and conditions

jill jackson

jill jackson

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A friend of mine ordered an knife from The Hollow Grind. It is to be shipped free as it's over 99.00 dollars. I was looking at their site and found this. under terms and conditions. "POINT OF OWNERSHIP" "The ownership and risk of loss for such items pass to you upon our delivery to the carrier". http://www.thehollowgrind.com/terms-conditions/info_3.html

Okay so they are saying once they hand it over to the carrier, if it doesn't make it too bad. I suppose they don't use insurance on these high priced knives? They take paypal, do they think paypal won't make them make good on undelivered purchases, paid for with paypal? I've read only good things about them here and was surprised they state once they hand over your high priced knife too bad if it's lost.
 
I've bought from Dave before, it went smooth. The code I used didn't work, but oh well. I had an issue with another knife I bought elsewhere and when I emailed him some questions, he responded quickly and had good answers. I guess if people use paypal and something does go sideways, it will be interesting to see what plays out.
 
Paypal will refund the buyer's money and charge them for it. There's no getting out of that. This isn't the first time I've seen a dealer state that they aren't responsible for delivery. Even credit cards would refund for undelivered merchandise.
 
That's an awesome policy!

I would hope they ensure everything to full value, because with a policy like that, you are really putting your customers in a bad situation if something should go missing during delivery.

I personaly would have a hard time buying a knife from anyone unless they took full responsibility until it reached my hands.

Exceptions being any deal I made to transfer reesponsibility to myself, or customs issues.
 
jill jackson said:
Paypal will refund the buyer's money and charge them for it. There's no getting out of that. This isn't the first time I've seen a dealer state that they aren't responsible for delivery. Even credit cards would refund for undelivered merchandise.
Click to expand...

This is a great point, but as a retailer, why not just try to be good at customer service?
 
I would suspect with a no liability policy like that they certainly don't insure. At least that's what I've seen before from another dealer, with a like policy.
 
Hi everyone... I'm glad I got here before this snowballed out of hand.
We ship EVERY SINGLE ORDER with FULL insurance. FULL FULL FULL FULL INSURANCE.

AND, if anything happens during the shipping process, if it gets damaged, lost, stolen, disintegrated, beamed to another planet, buried, and left for dead we will cover the refund for the original price paid.

The policy is there so we can under-promise and over-deliver. The policy also discourages those who would like to engage in fraudulent activity.

After looking at the website, it does not state anything about shipping with insurance; so I will change that so it is clear that we DO actually ship with full insurance.

UPDATE:
I deleted that section of the point of ownership; it is not how I have been conducting business.
I will always do my best so that my customers are not SOL on any purchase.
 
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Thank you for the information and with full insurance included you certainly should make that clear, as the policy did seem to mean you are not responsible for delivery. Not something my friend was thrilled to find out after placing his order for a 330.00 dollar knife. (which btw he could not find ANYWHERE else, so :thumbup: for having hard to find items and changing the wording on your terms)
 
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Except that insurance is designed to protect the seller, not the buyer. In fact, there's no obligation on the seller's part to use the insurance proceeds from a lost shipment to make the buyer whole. The buyer isn't even a party to the contract. That's why a buyer should NEVER pay for insurance.

There's a lot of confusion on this point. But the fact is, if you purchase something and it doesn't get delivered, the seller is responsible for refunding your money. Here's what you need to know:

http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0221-billed-merchandise-you-never-received-heres-what-do
 
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Good policy and explanation. I have heard good things about them, and would not hesitate to order from them, especially now, seeing the quick response and clarification.
 
gte217e said:
Hi everyone... I'm glad I got here before this snowballed out of hand.
We ship EVERY SINGLE ORDER with FULL insurance. FULL FULL FULL FULL INSURANCE.

AND, if anything happens during the shipping process, if it gets damaged, lost, stolen, disintegrated, beamed to another planet, buried, and left for dead we will cover the refund for the original price paid.

The policy is there so we can under-promise and over-deliver. The policy also discourages those who would like to engage in fraudulent activity.

After looking at the website, it does not state anything about shipping with insurance; so I will change that so it is clear that we DO actually ship with full insurance.

UPDATE:
I deleted that section of the point of ownership; it is not how I have been conducting business.
I will always do my best so that my customers are not SOL on any purchase.
Click to expand...

Thank you for clearing that up so quickly, that is excellent customer service!
 
bld522 said:
Except that insurance is designed to protect the seller, not the buyer. In fact, there's no obligation on the seller's part to use the insurance proceeds from a lost shipment to make the buyer whole. The buyer isn't even a party to the contract. That's why a buyer should NEVER pay for insurance.
Click to expand...

Dead on regarding the insurance. No place on the paperwork to designate a third party as the beneficiary of the insuance.

But the fact is, if you purchase something and it doesn't get delivered, the seller is responsible for refunding your money. Here's what you need to know:

http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles...-heres-what-do
Click to expand...

Yes. Confusion. Here is the law in all fifty states. UCC 2-509:

(1) Where the contract requires or authorizes the seller to ship the goods by carrier

(a) if it does not require him to deliver them at a particular destination, the risk of loss passes to the buyer when the goods are duly delivered to the carrier even though the shipment is under reservation (Section 2-505); but

(b) if it does require him to deliver them at a particular destination and the goods are there duly tendered while in the possession of the carrier, the risk of loss passes to the buyer when the goods are there duly so tendered as to enable the buyer to take delivery.

(2) Where the goods are held by a bailee to be delivered without being moved, the risk of loss passes to the buyer

(a) on his receipt of a negotiable document of title covering the goods; or
(b) on acknowledgment by the bailee of the buyer's right to possession of the goods; or
(c) after his receipt of a non-negotiable document of title or other written direction to deliver, as provided in subsection (4)(b) of Section 2-503.

(3) In any case not within subsection (1) or (2), the risk of loss passes to the buyer on his receipt of the goods if the seller is a merchant; otherwise the risk passes to the buyer on tender of delivery.

(4) The provisions of this section are subject to contrary agreement of the parties and to the provisions of this Article on sale on approval (Section 2-327) and on effect of breach on risk of loss (Section 2-510).
Click to expand...

So what does this mean?

Almost always when we buy a knife from a merchant, the deal is that the merchant is to have the knife delivered by a carrier to our address - a "particular destination." So the risk of loss passes to the buyer only on delivery to that address UNLESS the contract was otherwise. For example, if the merchant says, "When you buy from me, risk of loss passes to you, buyer, when I deliver the knife to UPS/USPS/FEdEX, then by paying you have agreed to those terms and the risk of loss passes to you on delivery to the carrier.

The language at the linked site is incomplete and misleading at best, but what do you expect? It's the government trying to sound consumer-friendly.
 
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I bought 3 microtech from him. Good dealer in my book. So good I'm willing to pay the sales tax I wouldn't have to with out of state dealers. I expect terms or no terms Dave would do right regardless...
 
I've purchased several MicroTech & ProTech folders from Hollow Grind and have been very satisfied.
 
Dave is a good guy, I've bought a few Microtechs and made a Hinderer trade with him. He was very helpful and offered pretty good terms on the purchases and decent prices.
 
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