"the officer noticed a knife"

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John_0917 said:
My understanding is that the initial stop was for the knife, and he took off running and they caught him. As to why he ran, well we can't exactly ask him, but my sense is that it was because he was a young black man in Baltimore City being approached by police. I can't personally relate, but I can't say I really blame him, encounters like those don't tend to end well for people like him.

You need to understand though that the focus of policing and also the one guided by politics in Baltimore, and many other cities, is one that is very focused on "taking guns off the streets" and knives tie right into that. So to the police and the politicians in an environment like that, stopping him for a knife is VERY good reason for doing so.

As to your claim of "police brutality", there is no evidence at this point to support that in any way, shape or form.
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Well let's see.
They broke his spine.
Refused to get him medical attention.
They had no way of knowing it was spring assisted. This is up for debate, legally if an officer sees it he can inquire about it and check to see if it is. The video shows that he was clearly injured and people even said that to the officer and they ignored him.
 
Not so! The seafood is really good! I've only experienced that as a visitor. Spent a couple of days there - the best part was the food.

Charlie Mike said:
The only reason anyone should ever go to Baltimore is to score heroin.
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This is the wrong place to get into political debates. It's a touchy subject and not everyone shares the same opinion of whatever happened to this individual before he died. Making guesses as to what happened is natural, but it is a catch 22. Keep on topic, if not then we have no choice but to clip the wings and lock this down. Thanks!
 
RevDevil said:
This is the wrong place to get into political debates. It's a touchy subject and not everyone shares the same opinion of whatever happened to this individual before he died. Making guesses as to what happened is natural, but it is a catch 22. Keep on topic, if not then we have no choice but to clip the wings and lock this down. Thanks!
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Thank you!

To briefly sum up the legalities at play for knife carry in Baltimore City, state law applies obviously and then add to that bans on: autos, ballistic knives, and any type of electric stun device. This among the most restrictive of any municipality in the state, except Ocean City, which bans assisted openers and "fighting knives", which include any knife with serrations...
 
mnblade said:
Interesting article here from The Village Voice of all places: Freddie Gray Arrest Exposes an Antiquated Knife Law Similar to New York's.
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That's a good read, thanks for posting. The Village Voice is has an interesting approach to knife law related stories it seems, and isn't what I would expect. The paper has traditionally been oriented on a readership made up of mostly left leaning people (Manhattanites, the LGBT community etc.), but they pretty clearly have a contemptuous view of the NYPD's approach to knives. Just an observation...I have to say I never thought that I would agree with their views on anything really, but I generally do in this case.
 
The State's Attorney has formally charged the officers with several crimes this morning, including false imprisonment (also known as arresting someone who didn't break the law). Of note to us here on BladeForums, the SA declared that the knife Gray was carrying was lawful to carry in the state of Maryland. I will transcribe below but I encourage you to find the video of Mosby reading her statement.

"Officers Miller and Nero then placed Mr. Gray in a seated position and subsequently found a knife clipped to the inside of his pants pocket. The blade of the knife was folded into the handle. The knife was not a switchblade, and is lawful under Maryland law."

"Lt Rice, Officer Miller and Officer Nero failed to establish probable cause for Mr. Gray's arrest, as no crime had been committed by Mr. Gray. Accordingly, Lt Rice, Officer Miller and Officer Nero illegally arrested Mr. Gray."
 
Homicide and false arrest. What I learned from this is in Baltimore, you may get stopped for having a legal pocket knife and end up dead while the perpetrators of the crime lie and attempt to cover it all up.
 
Another reason why I will never go there.
 
crom said:
Homicide and false arrest. What I learned from this is in Baltimore, you may get stopped for having a legal pocket knife and end up dead while the perpetrators of the crime lie and attempt to cover it all up.
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Append "if you're black" to the end of that and you may have the beginnings of a rational conclusion. The aforementioned McGuigan case was also white officer arresting a black man for a legal knife.
 
As a black man who has carried a pocket knife since I was a kid (I am old enough to have grown up when carrying a pocket knife was seen as normal,) I am very glad that the states' attorney ruled that the knife was legal. From what I have read so far, it may been an assisted opening knife. First of all, I feel for the family of Fred Gray because their son died for nothing. Unfortunately, recent research has shown that in Baltimore, 20% of all arrests are without probable cause. For the purpose of Bladeforums, and for me in particular, it us good to see one handers reaffirmed as legal EDC.
 
Same thoughts here living in Atlanta we can carry anything however when I travel i check the local laws and restrictions. I will never use a pocket clip again. Being black with a "perceived" weapon can and could get you killed. I can say this forum is a fresh air from a terrible situation all round.
 
Sadly I'm predicting a lot more arrests like this coming, regardless of whether the person is black or white. The police aren't legally required to know the laws that they attempt to enforce, meaning you can be arrested for carrying an illegal knife, even if your state has no knife statutes.
 
The fact they they initially called it a switchblade shows that the cops either know nothing about legal one-handers/AO, or did know and trumped it up by calling it a switchblade. We may never know what model knife it was, unless it's shown as evidence during a televised trial.

This may sound insensitive, considering what happened, but at least I'm glad the subject of "legal" as opposed to "illegal" pocket knife is being discussed in the media.

Jim
 
James Y said:
We may never know what model knife it was, unless it's shown as evidence during a televised trial.
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It's surprising the DA has not released the model of the folder. At the very least it'll be educational for others in that area to know. I'm guessing it's a Kershaw/ZT SpeedSafe Assisted Opening.
 
James Y said:
The fact they they initially called it a switchblade shows that the cops either know nothing about legal one-handers/AO, or did know and trumped it up by calling it a switchblade. We may never know what model knife it was, unless it's shown as evidence during a televised trial.

This may sound insensitive, considering what happened, but at least I'm glad the subject of "legal" as opposed to "illegal" pocket knife is being discussed in the media.

Jim
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That's what I thought. Clarifying knife law is minor in the extreme compared to someone dying, but I am glad that the legality of assisted opening folders was reaffirmed.
 
anthony cheeseboro said:
That's what I thought. Clarifying knife law is minor in the extreme compared to someone dying, but I am glad that the legality of assisted opening folders was reaffirmed.
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Given his neighborhood and likely income, a ZT is pretty unlikely. I am guessing a Kershaw that could be bought at Wal-Mart.
 
anthony cheeseboro said:
Given his neighborhood and likely income, a ZT is pretty unlikely. I am guessing a Kershaw that could be bought at Wal-Mart.
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Agreed. ZT knives appeal mostly to a a relatively narrow market of knife buyer; more likely it was one of the China-made, or cheaper US-made, AO or manual models.

Jim
 
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