The super steel rat race

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mitchnola

mitchnola

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My first few years getting into knives I was all about reading up on the next hot new steel but I have to admit, I’m completely over what steel I’m getting on any particular knife. It’s to the point that I don’t even consider or pay much attention to what steel I’m buying these days. If I like a knife I buy it. If I support certain makers, I buy them regardless of steel. At this point I know if I’m spending x amt of dollars Im getting a good steel.

The whole super steel rat race has just become ridiculous to me. It almost seems gimmicky to me so that people feel the need to own every pm2 in the next newest hottest steel for example.

There’s still no steel out there that wont dull, isn’t too hard or too soft and won’t be needed to be sharpened at some point. It will never exist until we figure out how to put a laser edge on a knife or come out with lightsabers.

I also find it amusing how quickly and suddenly the greatest steel ever becomes antiquated. It may only take a year or two. Magnacut will just be the next super steel to become antiquated. I really wonder how much all this steel innovation is solely just to sell more knives? It definitely seems to be the easiest innovation in the knife world, even more so then locking mechanisms.

So I’m just curious if I’m the only one and where or how I’m totally wrong. But otherwise I’m out the rat race. Just give me a great knife with a sharp edge that I can and will sharpen.
 
Everything that has been produced since the invention of currency has been done so to sell a ware.

I'm not one to chase the super steel dragon, but to me, innovation is always a good thing. I personally can't keep up with the various compositions and alphabets of the various steels. I still enjoy a good carbon steel or something as pedestrian as VG-10. I am glad that my high end OTF knives come with an expensive steel for what they cost, but the newest steel I have become smitten with is Cruwear when it comes to a work knife.

However, I'm glad there are super steels out there for others to enjoy. If we all settled for what is available, we'd still be driving car that got 12 mpg and we basically scrap after 100,000 miles. If allowing folks to clammer about to snap up the newest and the greatest means we continue to innovative, I'm cool with that. It doesn't bother me any.

The good news is that for every wonder steel rolling off the line, there is still some dude with a hammer, a rock, and a hot piece of mild steel cranking out something interesting. For me, the type of steel a knife is made from takes a third or fourth seat to the other attributes such as build quality and pride of ownership. I actually prefer a softer steel to a harder simply because I enjoy sharpening my knives with an Arkansas stone, a steel, and a strop.
 
For me it depends on what I’m using them for and the materials I’m cutting. I’m also able to sharpen them and don’t have any problems doing so. I’ve just recently got two knives in Magnacut and so far I’m impressed with how well they perform.

I know there are some who don’t need the extra edge holding steel in their usage and they don’t have the patience for sharpening the harder steels or the skill or whatever reason.

Forty some years ago I found myself in a situation with a medium sized stockman with a decent steel for most light to medium duty chores but this time it was more than the usual light stuff and it didn’t stand up to the hard usage, it dulled all three blades and I didn’t have a sharpener with me. It was a bit of a desperate situation and fortunately was able to find a rusty set of side cutting pliers to finally get the mess cut . I learned then how important it was to have a good knife that would hold an edge and to keep a sharpener handy.

Edit, Looking back on that time I think how good it would have been to have the steels we have today.
 
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I pretty well like most steels, given a decent heat treatment. I'm highly impressed by Magnacut. It seems to incorporate the best aspects of several steels, being easy to sharpen, tough, stainless, able to take a very fine edge and hold it way past my expectations. I suspect it will be around for a long while.
 
mitchnola said:
My first few years getting into knives I was all about reading up on the next hot new steel but I have to admit, I’m completely over what steel I’m getting on any particular knife. It’s to the point that I don’t even consider or pay much attention to what steel I’m buying these days. If I like a knife I buy it. If I support certain makers, I buy them regardless of steel. At this point I know if I’m spending x amt of dollars Im getting a good steel.

The whole super steel rat race has just become ridiculous to me. It almost seems gimmicky to me so that people feel the need to own every pm2 in the next newest hottest steel for example.

There’s still no steel out there that wont dull, isn’t too hard or too soft and won’t be needed to be sharpened at some point. It will never exist until we figure out how to put a laser edge on a knife or come out with lightsabers.

I also find it amusing how quickly and suddenly the greatest steel ever becomes antiquated. It may only take a year or two. Magnacut will just be the next super steel to become antiquated. I really wonder how much all this steel innovation is solely just to sell more knives? It definitely seems to be the easiest innovation in the knife world, even more so then locking mechanisms.

So I’m just curious if I’m the only one and where or how I’m totally wrong. But otherwise I’m out the rat race. Just give me a great knife with a sharp edge that I can and will sharpen.
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It's been my long held thought that the vast majority of knife knuts couldn't tell the difference between one steel and another if it wasn't written on the blade. That's not always true of course, but for every guy that is using a knife as a daily tool there are several others that have a pricey piece of pocket jewelry.

There is nothing wrong with that of course, but I suspect it's true.

For non-knife knuts... Forget about it, they don't know, don't care and think that quality cutlery can be purchased next to the pork rinds and pickles at the local quickie mart.
 
I haven't made a knife with M4 yet.....
But I love M2.
M4 is "supposed" to be better, but I already like M2. Hard to believe I'll like it More?
I'm willing to try though.

Same with magnacut.... I Love 3V, and so far with Cruwear.
Why would magnacut even be needed? To me, it's not fully proven

I agree with people not being able to tell the difference.
Idk if I could, even?
Usually I just notice things when/how I'm sharpening. With how it responds.

It's pretty Awesome that we have so many choices.
 
In my experience, hardness tells how much stress the edge can take before it fails, steel composition tells us HOW it will fail. Higher end steels fail in a way that can keep on cutting a bit longer. They will all wear down eventually. It's not really that simple, of course, but it makes sense to me.

I appreciate everyone who tests steels, I don't have the extra at this point in my life to buy all the steels to compare, I do the research and choose accordingly.
 
mitchnola said:
My first few years getting into knives I was all about reading up on the next hot new steel but I have to admit, I’m completely over what steel I’m getting on any particular knife. It’s to the point that I don’t even consider or pay much attention to what steel I’m buying these days. If I like a knife I buy it. If I support certain makers, I buy them regardless of steel. At this point I know if I’m spending x amt of dollars Im getting a good steel.

The whole super steel rat race has just become ridiculous to me. It almost seems gimmicky to me so that people feel the need to own every pm2 in the next newest hottest steel for example.

There’s still no steel out there that wont dull, isn’t too hard or too soft and won’t be needed to be sharpened at some point. It will never exist until we figure out how to put a laser edge on a knife or come out with lightsabers.

I also find it amusing how quickly and suddenly the greatest steel ever becomes antiquated. It may only take a year or two. Magnacut will just be the next super steel to become antiquated. I really wonder how much all this steel innovation is solely just to sell more knives? It definitely seems to be the easiest innovation in the knife world, even more so then locking mechanisms.

So I’m just curious if I’m the only one and where or how I’m totally wrong. But otherwise I’m out the rat race. Just give me a great knife with a sharp edge that I can and will sharpen.
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Clearly Sir, you have not experienced Cruwear with Spydercos heat treat 😁.
 
I can see where the OP is coming from. When I started getting into high end knives it was still a pretty big deal to have M390 steel. Now folks find it “boring”… lol
I appreciate a steel that will hold a decent edge and is stainless. But yeah, the blade thickness and BTE are going to have a greater impact when it comes to how it will perform in my opinion.
 
I've enjoyed playing with supersteels over the years, but I've started moving away from them more recently in favor of carbons that can be run hard and keep a stable edge at low edge angles.

26c3 is some pretty wild stuff around 65HRC at a low angle, and is easy to maintain. This is a small edc I made from it, and its .003 behind the edge at the plunge lines and .007 at the tip. Dont have a goni to measure the exact edge angle, but its lower than the stock Spydercos in my collection. Literally flies through cardboard and cardstock like it's not there, and will cut through plenty of it before needing a touch up. Thin geo is just more fun to me while doing work, and I have my doubts that most of the high alloy steels would do well being run this thin.

I'm glad that we all have a nice variety of steels to play with though, as a lot of us have different needs and interests in what we want our cutlery to do.IMG_20230810_170738_HDR.jpg
 
tony281sc2 said:
I can see where the OP is coming from. When I started getting into high end knives it was still a pretty big deal to have M390 steel. Now folks find it “boring”… lol
I appreciate a steel that will hold a decent edge and is stainless. But yeah, the blade thickness and BTE are going to have a greater impact when it comes to how it will perform in my opinion.
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I love me some M390 and some Elmax!
 
All steels have their own optimal use cases. I find most interesting the ones with finer microstructure, the edge that can be put on it will also be finer and the steel is tougher also. I welcome improvements in this direction. Any additional desirable attributes also, like high hardness and corrosion resistance ofc. And while 420HC or 14C28N might be good enough for most users, there will always be areas where progress is needed. The success of Magnacut proves exactly this. Also, I am fascinated by the edge holding of Maxamet, very happy it is available.. As Sal Glesser put it - "All good, just different.".
 
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Once upon a time I would gripe and say
Stop making everything in 3v
Now magnacut is here and I'm
Stop making everything in magnacut
And there will be something "better" than magnacut and I'll hear myself saying
Stop making every knife in that steel
At the end of the day, people spend way too much time steel flexing and not enough time using the tool, which it is--- a tool
And a weapon, by definition; and you cant take its definition away
 
I value edge retention the most. I honestly don't see the greatness of Magnacut. Yes it balances pretty good toughness with decent edge retention and corrosion resistance, but I gotta be honest, after looking over the knife steel nerds charts, I'd rather have XHP. I have experience with it, it keeps it's edge a good long time, but is not too hard to sharpen. I'll come straight out and say that corrosion issues baffle me. Maybe it's because I don't sweat unless it's above 90°F and that I usually clean and dry my blades if I'm doing a messy task. It's pretty humid here in the summer, being a mile from a lake, and 35 miles from lake Michigan, but even in a year of sitting in a case while I was in the hospital for 9 months, none of my knives rusted. CPM-M4 included.

While I do enjoy trying some of the super steels, I still like what I know when it comes to really beating on a knife.

Thus far I've enjoyed S125V and am looking forward to testing out S390, though neither of these steels are on the mainstream radar. Then again, I'm not interested in the mainstream.
 
Steels have different properties and some do better than others with respect to particular properties. That's real. Now, can people get silly with minor improvements on one versus the other, especially when a difference in heat treatment could make a bigger difference? Sure.

MagnaCut actually does seem special. It's not just a great balance among those properties. That would be accurate praise regarding just the level of toughness per the level of edge retention. However, it accomplishes that in addition to almost maxing out on corrosion resistance.

By contrast, steels like S45VN and SPY27 (that had the misfortune of being released just prior to MagnaCut) do seem like minor or questionable improvements. I'm not saying those are bad steels, just that they fit better with the topic assertion.
 
Yeah...

I have blades in MagnaCut, S90V, CPM-154, S35VN, 20CV, S30V, S110V, S45VN, 20CV, etc., etc., etc.


...and I think I'll just stick to cutting with my 420HC, and straight-up beating on my 1095 and 3V.


Your mileage may vary. Flame, flame away! 😍
 
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