The Thrill of Victory and the Agony of Defeat!

Daniel Fairly Knives

Daniel Fairly Knives

Full Time Knifemaker
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I've been using W2 steel lately, the W stands for water hardening.

I'm using a brine solution which is great for hamon potential and getting the most hardness out of a water hardening steel. It is tough to get right and easy to lose a blade from the abrupt temperature change but the results are worth the risk in my opinion. You win some, you lose some! :D

Clay on a tanto ready to go...
003-15.jpg
 
First off... check out the dramatic upward curve in the blade. This is known as "sori" in Japanese and is seen a lot in traditional Japanese blades. The blade curves upwards during quench giving them the shape we all know. With most steels the shape is ground or forged in but with water hardening steels a straight blade can gain a serious curvature.

Also check the big cracks, I heard two pings during quench and have two big ones... this one goes in the "forge later" pile.

010-15.jpg
 
I should mention, that was the second heat treat, the first almost went well!

I did an interrupted quench the first time which usually works great with brine. I then spent a good while sanding and etching the blade and determined it was only hardened on the tip half of the blade. I could see the clouds of a nice hamon appearing but they faded away to nothing... a quick file test confirmed my suspicions so it went in for round two. (round two knockout, lol!)

The next one will be even better... :D


Here are some that did make it! They are more likely to make it through a brine quench because of the simpler shape and overall thicker shape.

I tried three different styles of clay on them and see potential in all. I can't wait to get them polished up and start the etch/polish process. I'm not sure on these dashis but I would have spent an entire day etching and polishing the tanto to make the hamon pop from just a wavy line to clouds. (if I was lucky!)

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2 big arrows - point to cracks

small arrows - point to possible hamon potential


The clay was applied in a x pattern but that was in hopes for a very traditional looking hamon.

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Shouldn't the steel be folded/forged before quench? or is that not necessary anymore with new cold/hot rolled stock?

I'm sure you will get it figured out, and when you do...a tanto in Onobuki Zukuri style please, 10"+ blade, at least 17" overall. :D
 
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gooeytek said:
Shouldn't the steel be folded/forged before quench? or is that not necessary anymore with new cold/hot rolled stock?
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In Japan iron bearing sand was collected then smelted over days in a carbon rich environment to form tamahagane or "pure steel." This steel varied greatly in carbon content and was divided, tested then assorted depending on the carbon content. Everything was stacked then repeatedly drawn and folded to insure uniformity.

W2 on the other hand is pretty close in composition to a lot of the traditional steels with a bit of vanadium added to refine grain size. The grain and composition is more uniform so no folding is necessary. (with any modern steel unless you buy a chunk of tamahagane)

Both steels are simple in composition, clean, high carbon and shallow hardening. Only a shallow hardening steel can show a hamon as you are seeing the boundary line between fully hardened, semi hard and somewhat soft.

As an interesting note W2 is a tool steel and has to be made to higher standards than a simple steel like a 10xx series.

I should add that hamon potential has to do with the depth of hardening which is usually controlled by the manganese content. As an example some 1075 can have a hamon and some can not. As a note only water hardening steels can have a hamon.
 
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gooeytek said:
I'm sure you will get it figured out, and when you do...a tanto in Onobuki Zukuri style please, 10"+ blade, at least 17" overall. :D
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Sounds great! I really like that style. I recently had one started that was also a fail, lol. It had a nice wrought iron guard too!


I have actually been really lucky so far, I hear about 1 in 3 break. I had done about 6 in a row since the last broken one, a smaller wakizashi. There are lower risk ways but the hamon isn't as cool in my opinion.
 
For a real cool explanation check out Jesus Hernandez' website www.jhbladesmith.com he does some amazing work. Builds his own tatara and collects his own ore, plus his blades are some of the most bad ass out there!


-Xander
 
DAMN YOU,Xander!!!! I checked out Jesus Hernandez's website (the cut test vid) and now I NEED a sword. Jens car is a goner!haha.
 
Haha, just don't tell her I had anything to do with it! The last guy in the tameshigiri video is Jesus, when he cuts the tatami mat and then cuts the fallen piece again before it even falls over is just awesome!

Here's a handy little tidbit, there is no legislative deffinition of what makes a sword in CA, so they are considered just a long fixed blade knife and legal to carry, technically!


-Xander

I'm not a lawer, this is not legal advice, you're on your own, I'm taking your bike and not bailing you out.
 
[Here's a handy little tidbit, there is no legislative deffinition of what makes a sword in CA, so they are considered just a long fixed blade knife and legal to carry, technically!

/QUOTE]
So when the officer asks me "what the hell is that?" I will answer " EDC".haha




why no working right?
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Daniel! Try again!
How did Hartsfield get a hamon on A2?? That's the question!
 
Oh yeah it's on again soon! I have more W2 for a tanto and can't wait to polish the kiridashis and see how they look! :D

Hartsfield did get a hamon on A2 and he was an exception to the rule with that, no one seems to know how he did it. I have thought about it a lot and still am not sure, it just doesn't add up with a steel that will through harden simply from the air cooling process. Cool stuff I know that!
 
Cool.
You're not the only one who wants to know how Phill got that hamon on A2. Pohan wants to know too. Po once thought that Phill's hamon was cosmetic. Not me!
 
Lycosa said:
Cool.
You're not the only one who wants to know how Phill got that hamon on A2. Pohan wants to know too. Po once thought that Phill's hamon was cosmetic. Not me!
Click to expand...

Yes I have heard the cosmetic theory but never by anyone who has held one, all speculation. I understand as it makes sense.

I have gotten as hamon on D2 but that is all I'm going to say about that! :D
 
Hmmm, I'm thinking an oil quench with a torch on the spine to slow its cooling rate just enough. I might build a new horizonal quench tank and give that theory a shot...


-Xander
 
D2 Hamon? Got a pic of that?
Ca mon, you two can figure this A2 hamon thing out.
 
I'm interested in trying it, but I don't have any A2 that isn't already a knife! I'll check out the TTT chart for it and crunch some numbers to see if it is worth trying.


-Xander
 
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