Titanium liner vs?

draggat

draggat

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This is probably going to be a stupid question, but after hours of searching, I can't find it, and I thought maybe someone who actually makes knives could give me a good answer.

The question is this:

Why do most of the more high end knives make their liner/frame locks out of titanium?

I have several Emerson's and am also planning to buy the DPx HEST, both of which use titanium locks. I've noticed that even Strider and these uber popular Sebenza's all use titanium as well. So what's the deal? I know that titanium is softer than the blade steel that all of these makers are using. What are the pros and cons of this? My Emerson's all locked up super early initially, and after about 50 openings or so, the liner began to fully seat itself on the tang of the blade. What I'm wondering is, how many openings until the liner completely fails? I know that the blade has an angle cut into it and that the liner will wear until it eventually reaches maximum. Just wondering how long that might be? I have some cheaper knives, such as a kershaw blackout that I've been using for years and still has a solid lock up. As far as I know, the liner is made from some 'average' steel.

Any answers would be greatly appreciated!

So..... My next question is..... Who should I look to for converting one of my Emerson's to a frame lock?
 
Quick answer, Titanium is lighter than steel, extremely strong, and will not rust.

I'm not sure which models he is or isn't doing these days, but STR here on the forums does conversions. He has his own forum in the "hosted knifemaker forums" section.
 
Thanks for the quick reply, and I will definitely check out STR!

As to your quick answer, lighter is definitely good, very strong is excellent, will not rust.... doesn't really matter IMHO because the blade will rust and in that case, unless it's 1095, probably f#@^&ed.

I suppose what I'm really asking is, does a titanium lock outlast a steel lock? Your answer doesn't really tell me what makes it better. Or worse.....

Folks, I'm not trying to be a pain in the rear. I just really would like to know! Your answers really are greatly appreciated!
 
draggat said:
Thanks for the quick reply, and I will definitely check out STR!

As to your quick answer, lighter is definitely good, very strong is excellent, will not rust.... doesn't really matter IMHO because the blade will rust and in that case, unless it's 1095, probably f#@^&ed.

I suppose what I'm really asking is, does a titanium lock outlast a steel lock? Your answer doesn't really tell me what makes it better. Or worse.....

Folks, I'm not trying to be a pain in the rear. I just really would like to know! Your answers really are greatly appreciated!
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Judging from your response, I think the answer that works best for you is that it is much lighter. If you are looking for a mid to large sized folder that won't bog down your pockets, then a Ti framelock is the way to go:thumbup:

I don't know for sure about lock wear, I've never researched a comparison. All frmelocks tend to drift a tad over the years as they are used, some more than others.

As far as better or worse, it's a bit subjective I guess. The Ti definitely has a cool, exotic material factor going for it that standard steel handles just can't achieve, in my opinion.

Hope this helps.
 
From what I've read, titanium galls (ie sticks) when contacting steel, so a titanium lockbar will less likely slip against the locking surface of the tang.
 
Ti galls to the lock face of the blade, won't rust, is light, can be anadized, and after a few openings and closing the face work hardens so there is a lot less wear than some other materials. I've only used 15&20 other than ti for a linner and the 15&20 wore a lot quicker.
 
Ti is also more elastic that most steels. Darn near impossible to straighten a warped piece. Meaning, it makes a better lock and won't lose shape as easily over the years.
 
For several years I used 15N20 for folder liners, along the way I tried 416 (back when it could be had in thin sheet form), and 410 stainless, and 7-17 stainless.

The biggest problem for me with all the steel liners materials was consistency. I would always encounter hard/soft spots, whether I was using in the annealed or heat treated states. This would always make building a folder problematic. When using 15N20, corrosion was an issue, especially if the knife was going to a client who wasn't very good about maintaining their knives....those knives would always come back to me frequently for "clean-up" work.

When I decided to start using Ti about 10 years ago, I had to learn how the material physically worked, and once I did, I have never looked back. Not only do knifemakers look for materials with the characteristics that lend themselves to our processes of building a knife, but if we can find a material that performs it's function in a superior manner at the same time, then it's "golden". In the case of Ti, that is very much the truth.
Ti is lighter, stronger, pretty much stain/corrosion proof, is springy without requiring a heat treatment, and of extreme importance to the knifemaker....it is consistent...as long as you use the same grade, it's always going to react the same way during construction of a knife. Top all that off with Ti's ability to be anodized, textured, carved, etc. and you have a winner.

Production companies use it because of that consistency....the fact that it makes great folder liners is a bonus. Of course something else that weighs heavily on both the production and custom makers is public opinion...the public as come to expect that a "quality" folder have titanium liners.

Does it make a "better" lock than steel....that's all in the eyes of the beholder, but because Ti hosts so many desirable qualities, for both the knifemaker and the knife consumer, it remains the gold standard for folder liners.
 
Thanks for the great response! I think you've answered my questions about Ti! I've been carrying knives most of my life but just started buying higher end blades in the last year or so. I'm not quite sure why I waited so long! It appears that there's a lot more to a quality knife than I ever imagined. Thanks again for all the answers!


zaph1 said:
Draggat, if you would like a piece of 1"x6"x1/16" Ti to test with, I would gladly send you one.
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Thanks, but to be honest, I don't really know what I would do with it! I'll keep installing floors and I'll let the knife makers keep making knives!:)
 
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