Toothy or polished edges on your sebenzas?

Bladenoobie1

Bladenoobie1

Joined
Jul 20, 2012
Messages
1,261
Hi,

I was curious as to whether you guys prefer toothy or polished edges on your s35vn sebenzas and what edge angle you use them at. My sebenza is sharpened only up to a 1k shapton glass, but mained with stropping on 6 micron paste. I would say for the most part my edge is polished. I did some cardboard cut testing today and after around I estimate around 30 or so cuts the edge began to show slight difficulty slicing through newsprint. I saw a sebenza cut test by smokeeater on youtube and his knives did 100 cuts on cardboard and still was able to slice phonebook paper. I would like my sebenza to do that and I'm willing to experiment with different geometries or finishes the next time I need to sharpen the knife.

Anyhow, I'm open to any comments or suggestions regarding this matter.


Thanks,
BN
 
I have different edges on my sebenzas, but the last edge on put on one was a 18ish degree angle and I took it all the way to 10k chosera stones because I was bored:) This particular sebenza was s30, but I treat s35 the same way. If I don't have two hours to kill sharpening then I usually stop at 1000k diamonds on strop to remove any burr.
I have not seen a big difference in edge holding between different levels of polish.
 
Any good edge, as long as it's not too thin. I use a steeper angle on my Sebenzas than I do with other knives. Because of their profile, they seem to slice very well even when not razor sharp, and with such an edge, they will cut for a long, long time.
 
I use the sharpmaker for all my sharpening and use the 40 degree setting ( 20 degrees per side ). I just use the medium and fine rods. I do have the ultra fine rods and have polished some edges on my sebenzas. For me personally, the polished edges are just for show and really add nothing to the overall cutting of this fine knife. So I guess my answer is the "toothy" edge.
 
Either or, just make sure there is no burr.

To get a toothy edge to be as sharp as a polished edge is actually quite challenging for beginners.

Most people have never used a truly sharp polished edge. That is IMO because they are also hard for beginners.

With that said, I go with a Trend Diamond stone followed by black compound on linen belt strop. It gives me micro serration that are refined at the apex and even the lows of the microserrations as well as a polished edge. Its an easy thing to do but only if you know how. Took me years of frustration to figure it out.

Hope this helps.
 
jon1all said:
I like polished. I run mine at 17dps on the Wicked Edge (up to 200-1000 grit diamond s-3.5tones, then 1200-1600 ceramics, then leather stropping from 14-10 microns, then 5-3.5 microns. Here's some vids I did for my YT channel after doing some 450 cardboard cuts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Kkq6_bSLco
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30Sl4JCuCJk
Click to expand...
Do you have a video of the actual cut test? Not that I don't believe you, but those videos are only you discussing the test you did and showing how the edge currently is.
 
Also, a slightly toothy edge will hold up a bit longer than a highly polished edge. If that matters to you.
A polished edge is fun for slicing thin paper and such, as it will do that much better, but a slightly toothy edge cuts better on the things I cut the most. I do keep a few knives around with a polished edge.
It all depends on what you'll be cutting the most.
 
I believe it was (sadden) showed a edge on one of his knives with 140 diamonds that would slice phone book paper.

He just really lightened pressure to the point he wasn't using pressure to knock down the burr.
 
I agree with this! I strop to maintain between hones ( my hones are usually 3 to four light passes) and my end result before re-honing IS a ridiculous polished edge. I have microscopic photos I posted in the traditional section following this step by step. Micro serrations keep cutting when slightly blunted while a slightly blunted straight apex will fall behind.

The one thing, Ken, I would add to your statement, is it is actually very possible to make micro serrations cut newsprint just as well. Its just a little more of a trick to sharpening :)

Picture those micro serrations as having the apex at ever peak, valley and edge connecting, then picture a linen strop loaded with compound able to lightly sneak in there and polish off the edge, NOT removing micro serrations, but polishing them. What is left is crazy, and, how I finish my edges. It will melt newsprint just the same as a straight high polished edge. :)

Ken44 said:
Also, a slightly toothy edge will hold up a bit longer than a highly polished edge. If that matters to you.
A polished edge is fun for slicing thin paper and such, as it will do that much better, but a slightly toothy edge cuts better on the things I cut the most. I do keep a few knives around with a polished edge.
It all depends on what you'll be cutting the most.
Click to expand...
 
Polish all the way.

I cut mostly boxes at work, and random stuff at home (yard/garage/etc) so I never needed a toothy edge (not sure what benefit of toothy edge is).

My polished edges go through wood paper cardboard plastic and whatever VERY easily, but that's after removing a lot of shoulder.
 
I keep my Sebenzas at 17 (25) or 18 (Large Insingo) degrees per side. I sharpen both on my Wicked Edge. I go the the 1000 diamond stones and then use 1500, 2000 and 2500 grit 3M auto sandpaper taped to the stones before stropping. Very sharp and edge retention has been good.
 
For what you are doing, polished would excel on the wood working. But thats an age old known. You don't want teeth on the apex or grit marks on the bevel when you do wood working.

Now, what is the benefit of a toothy edge?

Lets say there is not always an obvious benefit if you are not using it for certain applications. First you have to realize guys that know what they are doing can get a toothy edge just as sharp as a fine straight edge. Then you have to realize teeth actually give you more cutting edge per lineal inch of blade length. Then you have to realize that not every is simply cutting cardboard or woodworking, so lets take those two out and move into cutting flesh and rope. Sure, I can get a straight edge to cut anything, but once that straight edge turns into a rounded straight edge where are you left? Now the same for those serrations, sure the serrations have dulled but they still have teeth to rip in.

Picture for reference


Now look at the knife on the right, its crazy crazy sharp, pull that along flesh and oh yeah buddy it will cut right through, but do you think its going to bite in as aggressive as the knife one to the left? Think about the physics of this. Now lets say your hunting away and that pretty polished edge goes blunt, bet you can still saw away with the serrations. Now trust me, I am a strong advocate of keeping a knife sharp, but please remember, there is real foundation for certain facts.

Here is a vid I made showing the awesomeness of a full polished apex and bevel.

[video=youtube;5qGxaIxKmq4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qGxaIxKmq4[/video]

Here is another showing REAL polished edges do not lack in any way when still SHARP

[video=youtube;fX95Kil5t0s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fX95Kil5t0s[/video]

Now you are just slicing cardboard, so honestly you shouldn't need much more than a decently sharp knife.

Hope this helps you understand better.

HwangJino said:
Polish all the way.

I cut mostly boxes at work, and random stuff at home (yard/garage/etc) so I never needed a toothy edge (not sure what benefit of toothy edge is).

My polished edges go through wood paper cardboard plastic and whatever VERY easily, but that's after removing a lot of shoulder.
Click to expand...
 
"Cardboard" is like "blade steel". They are not all equal;)

Be careful what you take from cut "test" videos. A demonstration can be fun to watch, but unless you are playing with the same materials, your cardboard may be much harder (or easier) on edges.

The degree of Polish is something that should be considered along with what you are cutting and what sort of blade steel you are using. A steel that has an appreciable amount of vanadium carbides in it (like S30V of S35Vn) will not benefit as much form higher degrees of polish. Simply put, these steels were formulated to take advantage of these carbides in cutting. Polish them if you like (I certainly have). But if you like the performance of a well honed highly polished edge, you will be resharpening (these steels) much more frequently.
 
nyefmaker said:
I use the sharpmaker for all my sharpening and use the 40 degree setting ( 20 degrees per side ). I just use the medium and fine rods. I do have the ultra fine rods and have polished some edges on my sebenzas. For me personally, the polished edges are just for show and really add nothing to the overall cutting of this fine knife. So I guess my answer is the "toothy" edge.
Click to expand...

Sharpmaker at 40 works for me. I vary my finish strokes between the flat side of brown/grey medium stones and the edge of the fine whites. Seems to give my CRK's with both S30v and S35v the edge I like. I have some polished edge CRKs, but ironically, the prettier the edge, the more reluctant I am to work it...go figure. ;)
 
I was breaking down some boxes today with a box knife and noticed it had a distinctive toothy edge. It was a new blade, a Stanley, and it worked great!
 
Bladenoobie1 said:
Do you have a video of the actual cut test? Not that I don't believe you, but those videos are only you discussing the test you did and showing how the edge currently is.
Click to expand...

No... that would have been a 20min video of me standing over my recycle bin cutting endlessly cutting cardboard (450 cuts takes a while)... pretty boring and not much fun to watch probably. Guess you'll just have to take me word for it. I did document it (somewhat) in picture format on my IG account (1allspub on IG).
 
If required, I'll used a Sharpmaker or sandpaper/mousepad to change edge angles, fix damage, or sharpen excessively dull blades, but I then strop all my knives for maintenance, so I guess ultimately polished.
 
Krav said:
I believe it was (sadden) showed a edge on one of his knives with 140 diamonds that would slice phone book paper.

He just really lightened pressure to the point he wasn't using pressure to knock down the burr.
Click to expand...

This can be easily done with the 120 grit Edge Pro stone or the 100 grit Wicked Edge stones. Once the edge is apexed, the key is pressure while honing both sides to the point that no more than gravity be applied. Some people make a burr on one side then make a huge burr on the other side then immediately change stones since technically the edge is apexed. Making effort to eliminate the burr in the earlier grits makes a much easier time eliminating it at the very end, and you will be surprised just how sharp an edge you can make at a very coarse grit. Just my experience. TIFWIW
 
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