Traditional Enough For Ya?

[justsomedude]

And in regards to the 'handful of western men' comment, I think you'll find that traditional knives from many cultures are accepted here as long as they're part of said culture's traditions.

 

[cinnamochoil]

I know that my new to me GEC #33 (thanks again to KBA, I love this knife) is traditional because when I showed it to my mother she said "This looks like the knives your dad used to collect when he was young."

Thanks bud! That's some good anecdotal evidence right there. :thumbup:

And in regards to the 'handful of western men' comment, I think you'll find that traditional knives from many cultures are accepted here as long as they're part of said culture's traditions.

I have no doubt a huge array of blades from all over the world are displayed on BF. That statement was just a crude attempt at inspiring introspection. I'm sure "ethnic" blades are shown, but the perspective is limited.

 

[B.F.U]

Thanks bud! That's some good anecdotal evidence right there. :thumbup:

I'm relatively young for this subforum at a fresh 21, so I really like to show the elders in my life new knives and see what they have to say. My grandparents are both familiar with knives, and they usually are impressed by GECs.

 

[cinnamochoil]

I know what you mean man. I get a kick from showing the elders all my fancy new locking blades. Although the best my grandad ever gave me was "Why do you need all that then?!".

 

[justsomedude]

For the sake of giving some practical advice. I find that the consensus for when a knife is no longer traditional is not a hard line but rather a combination of features. So if it has too many of the features from the list below it's not traditional:

Modern materials e.g. Titanium, 'super steel'
Modern locks e.g. AXIS, Reeve Integral aka framelock, etc.
Unique designs developed/invented by living makers e.g. hollow handles,
Modern opening mechanisms e.g. flippers, thumbstuds, autos

Some examples: A Pukko made with G10 handle would qualify as traditional because, although it's not traditional to put micarta on a Pukko, everything else about the knife is steeped in tradition.

A Busse made with G10 handle would not because G10 is a modern material and the Busse isn't otherwise based on a traditional blade profile.

Pretty much any folding knife with a auto opener is not traditional, unless it's a stilleto because stilletos are traditionally automatic.

 

[cinnamochoil]

Heroic post dude :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

thanks!

---cinna

 

[justsomedude]

Haha, I just realized I actually don't know if stiletos are appropriate for this forum...

 

[cinnamochoil]

Haha, I just realized I actually don't know if stilettos are appropriate for this forum...

My point exactly. I would consider a stiletto switch iconic and traditional. If I remember correctly though, autos are against the board guidelines. So we better clam up on that one hepcat.

edit: Went back and checked, autos aren't off limits, my bad.

Somewhat related: A stag lock-back stiletto that looks like a switchblade.

 

[kamagong]

I came to this particular board because there is no other area where Fixed Blades are specified.

That seems to be a common source of confusion. This space isn't for all fixed blades, but rather traditional fixed blades along with other traditional knives.

Think traditional (folders + fixed blades)
not traditional folders + fixed blades

 

[justsomedude]

I think they're against the guidelines simply because there's a separate sub for autos here. Same for balisongs.

 

[cinnamochoil]

That seems to be a common source of confusion. This space isn't for all fixed blades, but rather traditional fixed blades along with other traditional knives.

Think traditional (folders + fixed blades)
not traditional folders + fixed blades

Word up, thanks for the clarification.

I think they're against the guidelines simply because there's a separate sub for autos here. Same for balisongs.

A balisong or auto would not be in violation of anything set fourth in the board guidelines, as long as they are traditional in some manner.

 

[singin50]

That stone you're holding is a traditional knife in some part of the world, but not in my part.

 

[cinnamochoil]

That stone you're holding is a traditional knife in some part of the world, but not in my part.

It's a chunk of obsidian.

How's that work for ya?

 

[knarfeng]

From a moderator's view point. Rule of thumb: if it's a design your grandfather might have carried 50 years ago, it's likely traditional.

Gary and I worry less about the materials of construction than the basic design. Stainless steel has been used in cutlery since the 1920's. Plastics and synthetics have been used for handles even longer. G10 is just another piece of plastic to us. Epoxy resin has been around since the 40's. Glass fabric has been used as reinforcement for plastic about that long as well. Micarta was invented in the teens or 20's.

For folders
►The most modern we go is roughly a Buck 110 style. That dates from the mid 1960's.
►That leaves out one hand openers and knives with pocket clips.
►It leaves out pocket tools, also.
►Swiss Army knives have been around since the late 1800's. the lobster style knife is far older. SAK's are in.
►A traditional styled stiletto is in. The modern OTF's are not.

We tend to be somewhat forgiving on fixed blades as far as blade shape, but fantasy blades are out and so are skull crusher and seat belt cutter features.

The point of the Traditional Forum is to have a relaxing area where folks can talk about traditional knives in a relaxed and friendly environment. The goal is to enjoy and share, not to compete or challenge. The focus is on knives, and sharing information about them. That information can range from information on new knives, historical information about old manufacturers, and discussions about materials of construction. Other topics belong in the Lounge thread, stickied at the top there.

There is a sticky with posting guidelines for the Traditional Forum. Reading it will help get your bearings. But I have three real simple rules that will get you started:
►Post about traditional knives
►Use family friendly language.
►Post Friendly.

 

[cinnamochoil]

From a moderator's view point. Rule of thumb: if it's a design your grandfather might have carried 50 years ago, it's likely traditional.

Gary and I worry less about the materials of construction than the basic design. Stainless steel has been used in cutlery since the 1920's. Plastics and synthetics have been used for handles even longer. G10 is just another piece of plastic to us. Epoxy resin has been around since the 40's. Glass fabric has been used as reinforcement for plastic about that long as well. Micarta was invented in the teens or 20's.

For folders
►The most modern we go is roughly a Buck 110 style. That dates from the mid 1960's.
►That leaves out one hand openers and knives with pocket clips.
►It leaves out pocket tools, also.
►Swiss Army knives have been around since the late 1800's. the lobster style knife is far older. SAK's are in.
►A traditional styled stiletto is in. The modern OTF's are not.

We tend to be somewhat forgiving on fixed blades as far as blade shape, but fantasy blades are out and so are skull crusher and seat belt cutter features.

The point of the Traditional Forum is to have a relaxing area where folks can talk about traditional knives in a relaxed and friendly environment. The goal is to enjoy and share, not to compete or challenge. The focus is on knives, and sharing information about them. That information can range from information on new knives, historical information about old manufacturers, and discussions about materials of construction. Other topics belong in the Lounge thread, stickied at the top there.

There is a sticky with posting guidelines for the Traditional Forum. Reading it will help get your bearings. But I have three real simple rules that will get you started:
►Post about traditional knives
►Use family friendly language.
►Post Friendly.

Everyone is relaxed sitting in a chair I'd hope. As stated, I've been over the guidelines which resulted in questions and inevitably this thread. I'm interested in finding what knives we find traditional and what makes them traditional to their owners.

My granddad used to make whittling knives out of old steel files.

---cinna

 

[jc57]

Hi Cinna,

I had a similar discussion with Frank a while back, about how the forum title might be confusing to some people - as someone already mentioned, it depends on where you tack on the word "Traditional" - is it a modifier for just the word "Folders" or for the entire phrase "Folders and Fixed Blades." Turns out it's for the entire phrase. My point here being that you are not the only one to need clarification of that title since it can be interpreted two ways, so welcome to the "Oh, that's what that means" club.

There's a sticky post at the top that largely describes what they mean - but unfortunately they refer to a specific knife book, which is long out of print and hard to find, as the reference guide. If you don't own that book or know what it contains, you're sort of at a loss.

My best advice is to stick around and learn from the context of what is and isn't allowed. Gary and Frank are pretty easy going guys and will just remind people or move threads as needed. Never take that personally, they certainly don't mean it that way, they're just doing what needs doing.

There are plenty of times where there may be a question someone asks, where the best answer is "oh, you probably want to check out a <insert modern knife here> but you can't give them the answer. That's just the rules. If there weren't rules, we would just have one giant General forum and special interest discussions would get lost in the shuffle.

As was already mentioned, I can't show or discuss my Case T***lock because even though it looks like a traditional knife, it is a springless liner-lock with a thumbstud and pocket clip, which doesn't fit the standards here, even though 95% of Case's product line does.

Eventually you'll get the hang of what's allowed and what's not. It may seem arbitrary in some instances, but they have to draw the line somewhere.

 

[cinnamochoil]

Hi Cinna,

I had a similar discussion with Frank a while back, about how the forum title might be confusing to some people - as someone already mentioned, it depends on where you tack on the word "Traditional" - is it a modifier for just the word "Folders" or for the entire phrase "Folders and Fixed Blades." Turns out it's for the entire phrase. My point here being that you are not the only one to need clarification of that title since it can be interpreted two ways, so welcome to the "Oh, that's what that means" club.

There's a sticky post at the top that largely describes what they mean - but unfortunately they refer to a specific knife book, which is long out of print and hard to find, as the reference guide. If you don't own that book or know what it contains, you're sort of at a loss.

My best advice is to stick around and learn from the context of what is and isn't allowed. Gary and Frank are pretty easy going guys and will just remind people or move threads as needed. Never take that personally, they certainly don't mean it that way, they're just doing what needs doing.

There are plenty of times where there may be a question someone asks, where the best answer is "oh, you probably want to check out a <insert modern knife here> but you can't give them the answer. That's just the rules. If there weren't rules, we would just have one giant General forum and special interest discussions would get lost in the shuffle.

As was already mentioned, I can't show or discuss my Case T***lock because even though it looks like a traditional knife, it is a springless liner-lock with a thumbstud and pocket clip, which doesn't fit the standards here, even though 95% of Case's product line does.

Eventually you'll get the hang of what's allowed and what's not. It may seem arbitrary in some instances, but they have to draw the line somewhere.

Thanks, I've been over the stickies and I am not confused.

"...In other words, this is a non-commercial knife discussion forum with the focus centered squarely on traditional knives and patterns such as you'll find in this reference:"

...unless it's W.R. Case & Sons Cutlery?

I'm not terribly familiar with case knives but are you talking about the case trapper lock? That knife is about as traditional as it gets. It would not exist without the tradition of case designing their knives in that manner. I don't understand why you should be discouraged from even mentioning that particular knife simply because it has a locking mechanism and pocket clip. The "just hang out and drink the koolaid" line is great and all, but I was just looking for some discussion. I'm seeing it's more about about nostalgia and admiration.

 

[jc57]

Sounds like you don't need or want my help. Sorry for bothering you.

 

[knarfeng]

The "just hang out and drink the koolaid" line is great and all, but I was just looking for some discussion. I'm seeing it's more about about nostalgia and admiration.

If you are looking for discussion, perhaps you should be asking, "Why do you like traditional knives?" instead of asking, "what makes a knife Traditional?" In the Traditional Forum, the definition of "traditional knife" is pretty much a constant.


However, if you are merely going to insult the other posters here, then this thread is done.
Thread closed.