Traditional knives and public perception.

Joined
Oct 2, 2004
Messages
17,578
I used to carry larger knives than I do now. It wasn't unusual once upon a time for me to pull out a large, almost 5 inch Eye-Brand sodbuster or large Case soddie to cutsomething. Even though my edc was a 3 7/8ths Buck stockman, I'd now and then carry something a bit bigger. But times change.

As I grew older, and I hope and prey a bit wiser, I downsized my edc in all things, cutlery included. It was then I noticed something about the non knife carrying people reaction to knives in general, and traditional knives in particular.

They don't seem to be seen as a threat like some of the black handle one hand wonders. Particularly if they have some intersting handle material. I noticed that stag and jigged bone of various colors seem to make it more acceptable for some odd reason. Not to meniton I've had some of my knives called cute. I'm not sure how I feel about that, but I guess it's better than having them start bleeting like a herd of sheep when a wolf is around.

Not too long ago I had to go into a Staples store to get a new filler for my Cross pen. I hate plastic bags and packaging so I usually refuse a bag and then disgard the packaging soon as possable. On this occasion I paid for the filler, and the teenaged girl went to bag it and I told her don't bother. I then took my Vic classic and ran the blade down the edge of the plastic blister pack and took out the filler to put it right into my pen. The store being empty at that time of morning, there was no line, and I wasn't holding anayone up. The girl watched me free up the new filler and was actually interested in my classic. She thought it was cute, and how cool it was to carry a little knife on my keyring.

Another time I was at Lowes getting some sand, and a middle aged woman was trying to tear open the sheet of plastic that was wrapped around a pallet of mulch. I offered to help, and took out a stag handled Hen and Rooster half stockman from the late 60's early 70's period. I sliced open the plastic cover on the pallet, and the lady asked what kind of knife that was. She was looking at it very intently, and I showed her the knife and she asked what kind of handlle that was. I explained abut Indian sambar stag, and she ran her finger over the ridges and popcorns, remarking how beautiful it was.

When I was having a difficulty with my left hand after hand surgery, a friend gave me a little peanut sized Bear Cutlery lockblade with a stag handle. That little knife got more comments than most of my other knives ever got. It seemed like everytime I took it out to cut something, I got a question on it. Even Karen was not immune after being around and me various knives for all these years. She liked it so much, it now rides in her purse as back up to her classic.

Years ago, my old Boker 240 with the rosewood scales got a lot of positive comments from both men and women. Not too long ago, a little yellow peanut got so much of a positive reaction from a young couple outside an IKEA store, I gave it too the young man. He had needed to cut some of the cord they have on a roll outside for people to tie stuff on the roof with, and somebody had walked off with the cheap sissors, so I loaned him my knife. It was less painful than watch him try to saw his way through some tough polypropoline line with his car key. He got to reminising about his grandfather, who carried a knife like that, so I told him to keep it and just give me coin.

With the rising amount of anti-knife stuff going on, I can only wonder if more people were exposed to traditional knives, would there be less bleeting. It seems like the rise of the black tactical stuff that people carry these days do not have the same acceptance as a small stockman, or maybe a yellow handle soddie, let alone a nice jigged bone or stag handle pocket knife. The red handle sak's and natural handle traditionals don't seem to stir any negative feelings like the other knives. Maybe because no Hollyweird movie has shown a slow two hand pocket knife used for mayhem.

I don't know where I'm going with this, just chewing over food for thought.

Maybe as traditional knife users, we are some sort of positive ambasadors for our hobby.

Or maybe I just havn't had my second cup of coffee yet.

Carl
 
Hi Carl
I'm in Canada where there seems to be less negative hype about knives. I buy and sell old slippies and new Rough Rider slip joints and lockbacks. I have never had anyone look at me in a strange way when I pull out a pocket knife and in fact sell more knives to Women than men on average. By friend on the other hand carries assisted openers that look like tacticals and he gets lots of negative comments compared to me and he's 78 years old. In my showcase I have a little sign that says "pocket knives like your grand dad used to carry" and many people respond to that with a sentimental comment or two.
I have to say I really hate the look of "tactcal" knives and the mall ninja head space and honestly feel that they have a very negative affect on the knife industry and potentially it's future as a whole. Great thread.

Best regards

Robin
 
A lot has to do with the demeanor of the person employing the knife.

Is it perceived as "brandishing" or simply "utilizing"?

Also, the size of the knife, even a traditional knife, will come into play depending upon the venue.

When I go out to a restaurant, pub or market I avoid carrying something like a large Halfrich folder as it would look out of place being opened and used in such locations.

I generally opt for something smaller on the scale of one of my Bret Dowell knives or a production knife in the vicinity of 3.5" closed or slightly smaller.

I live in the "sticks" and knife carry is more the norm than not...but even with that I still think that demeanor and the appropriate knife for the setting have much to do with public perception.
 
Hi,

I might be a bit prejudice about traditional slippies, but I think Elliot does have a point about demeanor. I would add that age will also play a part in perception. Us older guys, and gals, can often get by with things that younger people can't.

I also think that many non-knife people look at traditional slippies and see an item that can approach a jewelry like status. Like the Lady you mentioned Carl at Lowes. I too have had people want to examine a knife they watched me use because it looks pretty.

On the other hand, I have had people look askance of my use of a pocket knife.

Years ago, I was at a similar type of big box store to Lowes. I was getting help from a manager and another employee. The item I wanted was bundled on pallet with plastic strapping. I took my stockman from my pocket to cut the straps and the manager told me that he should have me escorted from the store because that it could be considered a weapon. Me and the employee gave each other a puzzled "what the??????" look. I looked back at the manager and told him that if he didn't want me have such a "weapon", they shouldn't have sold it to me last month. It did shut him up nicely, but it still rankled me.

Dale
 
Carl, I think you're on something. Colorful traditionals, like yellow handle two hand opening knives do not scream tacticool/weapon like than one hand openers, that are all black and have serations and/or tanto points.

I'll take yellow soddie over any tacticool knife any given time.

Thanks again Carl for great ideas.
 
A lot has to do with the demeanor of the person employing the knife.

Is it perceived as "brandishing" or simply "utilizing"?

I really do believe this is 99% of it.

It's always been interesting to me, that the 'tactical' knives that were originally (presumably) designed for use by those who're supposed to make us feel safe & secure (military & law enforcement, fire & rescue personnel) are the same ones that strike fear into so many people. Once upon a time, even switchblades were legal & fairly commonly in use. That is, until they were 'popularized' in hollywood movies about gangs 'brandishing' them on street corners.

I've been carrying both modern and traditional knives for years (at the same time usually). And I do exercise great discretion in even pulling them out of my pocket. The vast majority of the time, such as in situations and locations previously mentioned here, I'll use my small sodbuster or my stockman when in public. I've never gotten any suspicious or 'strange' looks from people, even when I know they can see the shiny clip on the Spyderco in my pocket. I'm certain it's got everything to do with my demeanor in public settings (calm, polite & 'responsible'). I even got pulled over for speeding once, and realized after the fact that I'd had my Spyderco Endura clipped to my right front pocket as I stood next to my vehicle talking to the DPS trooper. He never gave it a second glance, didn't even ask to see it. Again, I'm sure it had a lot to do with my demeanor & behavior.

Behaving in a responsible & polite manner goes a very long way, in almost any situation.

By the way, I remembered after thinking about this post a bit, my 'responsible demeanor' saved me a little $$ too. When I was stopped for speeding, the trooper let me off with just a friendly warning. No fine. It really does make a difference to behave as a responsible adult.
 
Last edited:
Years ago, I was at a similar type of big box store to Lowes. I was getting help from a manager and another employee. The item I wanted was bundled on pallet with plastic strapping. I took my stockman from my pocket to cut the straps and the manager told me that he should have me escorted from the store because that it could be considered a weapon. Me and the employee gave each other a puzzled "what the??????" look. I looked back at the manager and told him that if he didn't want me have such a "weapon", they shouldn't have sold it to me last month. It did shut him up nicely, but it still rankled me.

Classic! :D

I'm afraid of weenies, period. Whether they're carrying a black plastic one-hand wonder knife, or not.

-- Mark
 
Hi All
If I open a knife in public to cut something or help someone out, I consciously do it slowly, with care and precision
I also ensure that the cuts are done in a controlled manner.
I don't get bad remarks often, especially at work, when Nursie reminds them tactfully "I could save your life with this little knife!"
A respectable looking tool, carried by a person of good character, acting in a calm and reasonable manner should not attract bad comments

Just my 2 pence worth

Take Care
Graham
 
Hi Carl
I'm in Canada where there seems to be less negative hype about knives. I buy and sell old slippies and new Rough Rider slip joints and lockbacks. I have never had anyone look at me in a strange way when I pull out a pocket knife and in fact sell more knives to Women than men on average. By friend on the other hand carries assisted openers that look like tacticals and he gets lots of negative comments compared to me and he's 78 years old. In my showcase I have a little sign that says "pocket knives like your grand dad used to carry" and many people respond to that with a sentimental comment or two.
I have to say I really hate the look of "tactcal" knives and the mall ninja head space and honestly feel that they have a very negative affect on the knife industry and potentially it's future as a whole. Great thread.

Best regards

Robin

Thats what I'm getting at; it seems to me that old or old style slippys seem to have a draw to a wider range of people, including women. I'm not sure if it's the old 'just like grandpa had' or that with the traditional materials they just don't have the negative affect that the 'tacticals' have. Like an assisted opener in the hands of a 78 year old man. Heck, I may even need an assisted opener by the time I reach that age. But a 78 year old man is not a threat, yet he gets negative comments. Go figure!

But it weirds me out, in a good way, but still a little weird, when a complete stranger askes about my knife because she thinks it's pretty, or cute, or some other positive comment. Or a young guy going all sentimental on seeing my yellow peanut, because his grandpa carried one just like it.

It seems like that the non knife people seem to connect with the old style pocket knives in a way that does not paint them in a bad light.

Of course, I wonder if it's an age thing. They are old enough to remember a time that every man who had pants on had a pocket knife in them. Nothing big, usually a 3 to 3 1/4 inch two blade jack of some type. A little serpintine Camillus, or a dog leg Schrade Old Timer.

It was another era back then.
 
i carry both traditional knives and the flick open knives.

i'm not going to stop because someone is a sissy and is afraid of a knife. someone asked me why do i carry a knife after i helped them cut something open, i told them next time you could always use your teeth instead.

so they said ok i get your point.
 
I think part of why traditional knives are less of a threat is because of the time and deliberation it takes to open them. It takes a few seconds to pull a slipjoint out of a pocket and two hands to open it in a deliberate manner, as opposed to a more modern knife apparently instantly appearing in hand with the blade open and a loud SNAP. Even I've been a little surprised by someone using a pocket clipped assisted opener.

Also, traditional knives tend to be more reasonably sized, which also helps quite a bit.
 
We were setting up some prototype equipment at work one day and the chemist, an older Chinese woman asked for a knife. I pulled out my Queen trapper, a fairly large knife at 4 1/4 and handed it to her. She opened it up, cut some tubing, closed it back up, handed it back to me and didn't say a word about it. She handled the knife like she owned it. I thought I was going to get some reaction. I got nothin.
 
I normally carry a slippie and a Spyderco. Well as you know the slippies hidden in pocket and the spydies clipped to it. Well I walked in a gas station in Ohio the other day with my Spyderco Endura clipped to my pocket. The lady at the register started staring at me grab the portable phone and went outside where there was a group of older men BS. I pulled the spydie off my pocket and let it fall right inside the pocket. She acted terrified. All I wanted was a bottle of pop. So yep modern knives get WAY more attention then slippies. Great topic Carl!
 
I was watching this "what would you do" show the other day where they create situations and see what people would do and it was a sorority hazing and they had a girl in public, saran wrapped to a light post, pouring vodka down her throat and nobody cared. but one guy comes over to help and he asked if she wanted to be cut free and crying she said yes and he pulls out his knife and they were like WHOA A KNIFE! mini freak out as he helped her. The sight of a tortured young girl nothing but a knife in the hands of an everyday hero omg look out! hes gonna stab somebody in broad daylight on a busy street! oh wait he saved her i thought he was going to kill her for a second. idiots
 
One day the wife and I were in McDonalds in a booth and a gal was fiddling with an ivy plant in the center between the booths when she noticed me watching, she said the gal at the counter said she could have a slip off the plant. I slid my blue handled 4.3 toothpick (closed) across the oak board and without a hitch she had it open and was using it like it was the normal thing to do. When she finished she snapped it shut slid it back and said Thanks--Really made my day!
Ken.
 
Great post. I am in agreement with "Obsessedwith edges", that your demeanor and manners go a long way in being a knife-ambassador. Being in Law Enforcement myself,we are trained to watch the hands and scan anyone we deal with for weapons on their person. Bulges, pocket clips,etc. I've dealt with citizens that were carrying knives or handguns and never had a problem. When I travel though I always carry a couple slipjoints, and if I do carry a tactical folder I do not clip it on, just put in a pocket.
 
99% of the time I select a legal knife to carry when out and about. If I have a need to use the knife I'm carrying while out and about, I take it out of my pocket, use it, and put it back into my pocket. If someone around me is offended by my using my knife that's tough. As long as the knife I used is legal and the use of it was legal, nobody has a legitimate gripe about my using it. I either carry my knives in my pocket or in a belt sheath (legal in CA). Incidentally, I've never know of anyone around me being offended by my using any of my knives anywhere I've ever been. I think a lot has to do with how you display and handle your knife when using it.
 
Ca. and Mass. have the worst knife laws. Surprising though, at least where I live the people are most tolerant. One of the guys in my department pulls out his mini copperlock in the cafeteria to cut up his apple. Nobody gives him a second look.You are right Ed, it's the way you are percieved while using it.
Dale, I love that big box store story. People are funny. Whats more menacing, a 3 5/8 stockman or one of those new type easy open box cutters those stores sell?
 
A large part of it comes from the selling tactics of the knife manufacturer. Mike Stewart of Bark River has posted that(not a direct quote) "if you sell a knife with the name of Death Dealer or Gravedancer, you will create a perception of that knife". I'm sure someone will have the direct quote. Tactical knives were created for a specific audience, and while they are applicable in other situations, they are still geared to people who would use them in that way, or think they could use them in a certain way (armchair commandos).

Traditional knives, from the stockman to the trapper to the Buck 110, are well known, non threatening, and not geared towards a "tactical operator".
 
Traditional knives, from the stockman to the trapper to the Buck 110, are well known, non threatening, and not geared towards a "tactical operator".

The Buck 110 is a large and imposing knife. Despite its popularity and acceptance (worldwide), as a retired LEO it would certainly get my attention if it was open and in the hand of someone whose demeanor caused my internal radar to alert.

As most all of us have agreed, it's all about how one presents oneself in public and the manner in which the knife is employed. The less done to attract undue attention the much less likely it is that using a knife in a given situation will raise eyebrows or heartbeats.

(As to the whole tactical operator schtick, it's mostly ludicrous on its face and hardly worthy of comment. In knowledgeable hands most anything can become a weapon in a hurry...from a pencil to a rolled up magazine ad infinitum)
 
Back
Top