Traditional Queen with modern High Performance Steel?

For me Traditional knives are carbon steel. Love me some 1095, so why change? Nice wood like ebony, bone, stag and Mammoth ivory are fine also. I also like micarta which can nicely mimic ivory. Why make them something they aren't?
 
Not everybody wants carbon steel all the time.

Custom slip joints with more modern steels are very popular
 
hunterjrg said:
Not everybody wants carbon steel all the time.

Custom slip joints with more modern steels are very popular
Click to expand...

That's my thinking and if you don't have something special to differentiate your knife from all the others why would people want to buy it?
 
For me, if I were to pick up a modern steel in a traditional handle and pattern, the fit and finish better be perfect. I can not see the point of either a high end steel and traditional handles if the f&f are not up to par as well. There is a lot more to consider when asking if there is a market for just steel, or just traditional material, in a traditional pattern. The pattern itself would also come into play for me. Just thinking and typing here. :)
 
KBA said:
For me, if I were to pick up a modern steel in a traditional handle and pattern, the fit and finish better be perfect. I can not see the point of either a high end steel and traditional handles if the f&f are not up to par as well. There is a lot more to consider when asking if there is a market for just steel, or just traditional material, in a traditional pattern. The pattern itself would also come into play for me. Just thinking and typing here. :)
Click to expand...

I totally agree with all these points and the challenge would be to come up with a knife that really ticks all the boxes.
 
You ask: "In addition to the upgraded blade material. What other items should be upgraded over a standard production knife?"
The Most Important feature of all is: Design.
You can build the best pocket knife possible but if the design is poor, i.e. looks uninteresting, etc. and feels bad in hand, then it won't sell.
The Case/Bose Colabs, some of which are $700 (for the 2014 LB Whittler with Abalone), feature a Tony Bose design, not a regular Case pattern. That really is the most significant feature: Perfection of design, and still 100% Traditional as they are copies of vintage patterns.
For a premium Traditional knife don't just copy some manufacturer's existing pattern. There are many fine knife patterns that were designed to perfection more than 100 years ago in Britain. Make your premium traditional knife a pattern that is not being made elsewhere except maybe by a custom knifemaker. There are lots of patterns to choose from.
kj
 
Last edited:
kootenay joe said:
You ask: "In addition to the upgraded blade material. What other items should be upgraded over a standard production knife?"
The Most Important feature of all is: Design.
You can build the best pocket knife possible but if the design is poor, i.e. looks uninteresting, etc. and feels bad in hand, then it won't sell.
The Case/Bose Colabs, some of which are $500 this year, feature a Tony Bose design, not a regular Case pattern. That really is the most significant feature: Perfection of design, and still 100% Traditional as they are copies of vintage patterns.
For a premium Traditional knife don't just copy some manufacturer's existing pattern. There are many fine knife patterns that were designed to perfection more than 100 years ago in Britain. Make your premium traditional knife a pattern that is not being made elsewhere except maybe by a custom knifemaker. There are lots of patterns to choose from.
kj
Click to expand...

What patterns would you suggest?
 
Thomas Carey said:
What patterns would you suggest?
Click to expand...

I do not know how to answer that one, considering the multiple options out there, but I would suggest a closed length of, or between, 3 1/2 and 3 3/4. It seems to be the sweet spot for a lot of traditional users. To keep the cost down a single blade would be nice, imo.

Edit: Though ...... a Dogleg Spear w/ a Long Match strike Pull at 3 1/2 & a Lanny Clip at 3 3/4 do come to mind.
 
Enrique Pena, Joe Oeser, and Northwoods Knives use modern materials and higher end steels. They sell well but they are exceptionally expensive.
 
kootenay joe said:
You ask: "In addition to the upgraded blade material. What other items should be upgraded over a standard production knife?"
The Most Important feature of all is: Design.
You can build the best pocket knife possible but if the design is poor, i.e. looks uninteresting, etc. and feels bad in hand, then it won't sell.
The Case/Bose Colabs, some of which are $500 this year, feature a Tony Bose design, not a regular Case pattern. That really is the most significant feature: Perfection of design, and still 100% Traditional as they are copies of vintage patterns.
For a premium Traditional knife don't just copy some manufacturer's existing pattern. There are many fine knife patterns that were designed to perfection more than 100 years ago in Britain. Make your premium traditional knife a pattern that is not being made elsewhere except maybe by a custom knifemaker. There are lots of patterns to choose from.
kj
Click to expand...

Hey Joe,

Please check your email when you get a chance. Thanks.
 
I just corrected a mistake in my previous post. I meant the 2014 Case/Bose knife, not 2015 which will not be released for some months i do believe.
kj
 
KBA said:
For me, if I were to pick up a modern steel in a traditional handle and pattern, the fit and finish better be perfect. I can not see the point of either a high end steel and traditional handles if the f&f are not up to par as well. There is a lot more to consider when asking if there is a market for just steel, or just traditional material, in a traditional pattern. The pattern itself would also come into play for me. Just thinking and typing here. :)
Click to expand...

Thomas Carey said:
I totally agree with all these points and the challenge would be to come up with a knife that really ticks all the boxes.
Click to expand...

Queen had a line of collaboration knives with Dan Burke that used BG-42 for the blades. From what I remember they were not great sellers, at least compared to the Case/Bose collabs.

The problem IMO is that once you go above a certain price point, ~ $250, most slipjoint enthusiasts would rather spend the money on a custom.

- Christian
 
kamagong said:
Queen had a line of collaboration knives with Dan Burke that used BG-42 for the blades. From what I remember they were not great sellers, at least compared to the Case/Bose collabs.

The problem IMO is that once you go above a certain price point, ~ $250, most slipjoint enthusiasts would rather spend the money on a custom.

- Christian
Click to expand...

That is a good point. Marketing is a huge variable as well. People want to say, "I own a Bose," or some other maker at that price point or higher.

Some production knives have been attached to causes. The ship wood that was added to GEC's 48 pattern for example comes to mind when it had damascus steel. Which, if this were to be done on one of these the price would be even higher.
 
My feeling is you would sure want to stay under or right at $200 which I don't know if it could be done.
 
Who buys traditional knives? What sells? How many are sold? These are questions manufactures ask since they want to make money. GEC uses 1095on the majority of their production and they sell. Case uses SS and that sells. Queen uses SS plus D2 and that sells. They all uses traditional materials and modern. If there is a demand it will be made.
I want a whittler like the Case Seahorse or EDC Courthouse with stag handles and M390 or Elmax or M4 or CPM – 154. I will buy it and use it. But until then I will use my current Case Seahorse SS, GEC Northwoods clone Courthouse 1095, and Queen D2 pattern #48 bone handled whittlers to do what I like to do and that is whittle.
It is hard for me to believe that super steel would be that much better than what is currently available but it is nice to think it would.
 
T.C. you ask: "What patterns would you suggest?"
Rather than suggest a pattern, i suggest "Levine's Guide to Knives and their Values" 4th ed (important) in which nearly every traditional pattern is well described and numerous examples shown.
Also "Sheffield Exhibition Knives" by Claussen/Watts/McMickle is absolutely inspirational to those who like Traditional knives.
From these 2 sources you can see what is not already in regular production and someone familiar with knife making can say which of these patterns could be built relatively easily. The "relatively easily" is so that a fair number could be made per unit time as part of cost containment.
One of the Bose/Case colabs is a Norfolk Pen knife. The design is exquisite and the execution was good too.
I mention this as an example of successfully resurrecting a superb old pattern.
kj
 
I'd suggest two actually....

Their Teardrop No.6 pattern which comes with liner-lock as well as backspring but the liner can be left out. Actually, the one I have in Amber Carved Stag Bone and D2 is probably the best production knife I own, superb.

Their other pattern is the Sleeveboard currently being offered in Horn. A single-spring two blade knife it looks great but it suffers a real flaw, the main blade is ridiculously small relative to the frame. It cries out for a decent sized Clip blade in posh steel.

Their Heritage series was a path not taken, patchy fit&finish, again blades that were not in harmony with the frame size, fix that and you've got stellar Barehead knives.
 
What do you think of the idea of going with something based on a Queen fixed blade?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top