Traditional vs "Habaki Type" Bolsters... What are the differences/pros & cons?

Yeah, I guess you're right. The AK series used to be the super big heavy chopper. Now they're similar to the BAS. I stand corrected.

I have a pound and a half BAS and it handles like a pipe. I doubt I'd like the feel of the old ak's.
 
Where are the two and a half pound 18" AK's? Everything is getting blended together.

That 24oz BAS sounds nice.



munk
 
You guys are going to make me look it up on the HI website, aren't you? What the specs are for the BAS? I thought they were 22 oz, but they might be 24, I gave mine away and don't have it to weigh.

It is interesting how a couple ounces can change the balance. Like I say about 18" khuks and going beyond about 29oz...


munk
 
Originally posted by munk
Yvsa, we all listen to what you say because your words have the unmistakable sound of both experience and honesty. I want you to look at one of these 'almost convext edge' they make now. We could learn a lot.

You said a long time ago that khuks were made to chop wood and that's what you were going to do with yours. I've always believed that- and that's what I do with mine.

I thought I'd let you know the blades I have- purchased since Ma. of 2002, have held well with the exception of the two during the Maoist time.

I asked Bill about a year ago if I should regret not having an earlier blade- a Shop One blade, and if that was something I should strive to own. No, he said. From what I can tell by accounts and my own experience, today's blades are in line part of the HI family.[/B]
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That's good Munk. I haven't got any late khuks except a bilton and a couple of 12" AKs and I do have to say they are decent. Thicker edges with a secondary bevel like most other knives which isn't all that bad. A damned sight better than before.:)

Continued:
Here's something we should talk about: today's blades are lighter. This is pretty consistant now.

munk
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I saw that when I had HD's AK here working on it. And I think it's an improvement although I would've liked to have seen HD's 18" AK as wide as mine but I liked the thickness.
I had to take as much as 3/32" and as little as 1/32" to get HD's AK to the point where I could put a fully convexed radius all along both sides.
That's an improvement of the old edges where as much as an 1/8"+ sometimes had to be taken off all along the edge in order to do the same.

There were some of us asking for the thinner blades a long time back and I for one am glad to see them. HD's AK is in line with the thickness of the old Nepali khuks I got from AC and that's good.
You don't need all that thickness and weight to make a good chopper as my BGRS cuts just as well or maybe better than my 18" AK and is why it's probably my favorite in that size.:D
 
I was going to ask you about that, Yvsa, how important the weight was. I'm glad you think it's OK we're more slender today. I never saw the big old ones. It does seem the antiques are no where near what even today's thinner HI khuks are.

It is nice to be able to carry AND use a khuk.


munk
 
All you 24 oz BAS owners- I'd like another BAS someday. Catch me when I'm solvent- like after April, if you want to free one to go where it will be loved.


munk
 
Here's a picture of my 16.5" WWII by Bura that broke on me right after I got it. Too bad, it was a beautiful blade. Evidently, they got water on the tang when they quenched the edge.

Anyway, I did learn quite a bit about the dimensions and how everything was put together under the bolster. I'm still toying with the idea of brazing a simple fingerguard to the underside of the bolster. IMHO, I think the bolster is strong enough as the brass material is about 1mm thick and when off the blade feel quite rigid.

Most of the wide part of the bolster covers handle material. The narrow part of the bolster is mostly over the actual blade which has been trimmed a bit on the top and bottom to make the surface of the bolster even with the rest of the blade.

As you can see in the picture, the amount of actual tang not covered by handle is really kind of small. The black stuff is the laha. The fractured metal itself was kind of crystalized and it fractured right at the base of the tang where it met the blade section under the bolster. The measured amount of bolster material that went past the handle material itself was 5/8".

facb792d.jpg
 
I reduced the number of pics in the previous post to one so the free image server doesn't get over taxed.
 
Originally posted by Thomas Linton
Lovely little boxes with red X's. Is it me?
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No, I get the red x too.

mrostov the "The narrow part of the bolster is mostly over the actual blade which has been trimmed a bit on the top and bottom to make the surface of the bolster even with the rest of the blade." is the tang.
The tangs are quite substantial which I have said all along in defense of the stick tang. The straight part of the bolsters can be up to at least 1/2"+ long and to me that would be better covered with the angle part of the bolster with wood or horn right behind it.
The ideal situation would be to let the straight part of the bolster cover the actual blade instead of being even with it. But like the ones that prefer the chiruwa tang YMMV.
 
morostov; when I go through the link, a message tells me I'm forbidden and don't have permission to view the photo.



munk
 
Originally posted by munk
I was going to ask you about that, Yvsa, how important the weight was. I'm glad you think it's OK we're more slender today. I never saw the big old ones. It does seem the antiques are no where near what even today's thinner HI khuks are.

It is nice to be able to carry AND use a khuk.


munk
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Yup.:) The old ones I have and have seen even though the spines were fairly heavy on some were overall thinner in thickness down the blade but all had the convex edge whether the blade was convexed or not.
And the edge convexes on the two I have from about 0.085" to 0.100" thick at the beginning of the convex.
Mine weigh 20 and 23 ounces respectfully and so shows the thinness of the beautiful heavy bellied leaf shaped blades.
Twenty ounces is 1 1/4 pounds and we have talked about the lighter weight being able to generate more speed, making up for the lack of weight.
I have still to test mine and am hesitant to touch the somewhat dull edges to sharpen them to give the best results in any cutting or chopping test but when it starts getting warm I'm sure the urge to do so will start gnawing at me.
An old one that I got from John Powell did just fine although I wasn't able to do it full justice because of my poor stamina.
That's where the heavier khuks have an advantage IMO as you can let the weight do much of the work without over exerting yourself overly much.:D
 
Originally posted by Yvsa
There were some of us asking for the thinner blades a long time back and I for one am glad to see them. HD's AK is in line with the thickness of the old Nepali khuks I got from AC and that's good.
You don't need all that thickness and weight to make a good chopper as my BGRS cuts just as well or maybe better than my 18" AK and is why it's probably my favorite in that size.:D
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Yvsa,

But my AK wouldn't really chop well till you worked on it. I think even a sharp AK doesn't penetrate as well as the thinner ones cause the blade is thicker. Fantastic for splitting wood or chopping real thick stuff though.


I have to agree with you on the thinner blades. Probably my best 2 blades as far chopping are the bonecutter and my BGRS. Both have thinner, but harder edges.

The BGRS was too thin at first. When I used it on some oak it started getting wavy, but I kind of sharpened it past the thinner part and now it seems to do well.

The bonecutter has always chopped well. I think the difference between it and the BGRS is on the bonecutter the part where the blade bevels down to the edge is longer so it has greater penetration without being thinner.

The BGRS has a shorter distance to get down to the same edge and some parts are almost a little hollow ground. This was the part that wavered.

Oh yea, another great edge is the pen knife.
 
I have to agree on the thinner blades cutting better. I got an 18" AK blem from Uncle Bill because it had a crack in the middle of the sweet spot that went up into the Khuk about 1/4". I used some layout blueing, then scribed a new profile on the blueing. I ground out the crack, basically bringing the sweet spot back about a 1/4" and adjusted the blade so it all flowed together properly. I then reground the entire edge area untill it met again. The edge was substantionally thinner than the original was. The AK is thinner, leanner and the edge is still plenty hard, as the reason the edge had cracked was it was too hard in the sweet spot. Now this khukuri is a sliceing deamon and when I chop with it the wood flies and there is never a binding at all. Now this 18" AK is lighter than my M-43, but chops like there is no tomorrow. It was definately a fun project, to boot.:D It makes a great backyard tool now!
 
There are a lot of variables here. I've said before that if the blade isn't too heavy a thinner edge might work better. I asked Cliff Stamp a lot of questions once, when I was new to khuks. He told me his heavy 20" AK is great at de-limbing a felled tree because the weight cuts through the branches. Weight does work for you.

I've spent a lot of time swinging lighter blades. My heaviest standard Khuk is only about 2.5 pounds- a 20" Villager.

I wish I could try a truly heavy blade but that will have to wait, until my wallet's a little heavier too.

Metal was and is expensive, and older khuks are not heavy. They probably needed to be able to carry the thing, and couldn't afford a heavy blade only be good for a few things, instead of a lighter blade good for many- such as kitchen and fur dressing.

Yvsa; isn't your full size Ganga Ram a heavy chopper?


munk
 
Originally posted by munk
There are a lot of variables here. I've said before that if the blade isn't too heavy a thinner edge might work better.....Weight does work for you.

I wish I could try a truly heavy blade but that will have to wait, until my wallet's a little heavier too.

Yvsa; isn't your full size Ganga Ram a heavy chopper?

munk
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Yup, weight does work for you. And Munk if you want a heavy chopper sometime in the future I might be able to be talked out of my Super Salyan, notice I said, "might.":) ;)
My Super Salyan is 3 1/2 pounds and is 20 1/4" oal with a 12 7/8" blade that's 11/16" thick at the bolster and 5/8" at the bend. The nicely convexed edge starts 3/4" away from the edge and is 9/32" or 1/32" over a 1/4" thick at that point. The blade tapers nicely from there up to the spine which is 2 3/16" further up. The blade is 2 7/8" wide!!!!
This thing is a virtual axe!!!!:D
The handle is 7 1/2" long from the bottom of the old style bolster to the top of the pretty old style Shop-1 scrolled butt cap.
The handle at the bolster is 5 3/8" in circumference and 7 1/4" at the bottom of the butt cap.
I had to take some material off so I could handle it safely so it is now about 4 1/4" in circ. in the center below the ring and around 3 3/4" center above the ring and the large swells at both sides makes it a very comfortable handle for me to hang onto now.
It is still in an unfinished state.
The rosewood handle cracked on me while I was removing the excess wood but I fixed it with super glue and the crack no longer exists nor has it cracked anymore since.
This khuk is definitely in the realms of the heavy choppers.:D
When you stand back about 25 feet from it it has the exact same profile as the H.I.Logo Salyan, up close it is stubby and doesn't look as well porportioned as it actually is.

I was gonna give you the specs on my GRS which is the "Friendship Model" that Bura made and when I went to dig it outta the safe I remembered it is still out on loan for a couple more months.
I think it's a tad smaller than the other GRS I had that I sold to Samuri Dave but not by much. They are in the realm of the heavy choppers too.

The Super Salyan is an excellent wood splitter while the GRS is a better felling khuk.
 
Originally posted by Pan Tau
The habaki bolster is a special friend of Yvsa I think....
I am not quite sure, but I have a Khuk the traditional bolster and it fits the scabbard really well ........
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Please pardon my ignorance, but could someone supply a link to a picture of a Khuk with the traditional bolster? Thanks
 
ichor,
look over to the Gelbu-Special thread. The upper pic of the 18"GS shows the habaki-bolster, the lower of the 21" GS the more traditional one.

Andreas
 
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