Traditionals and locking systems

Who said anything about big? I carry a Spyderco Mule in the ruler pocket of my carpenter jeans every day. It handles the things I don't think I should do with a folder just fine, not that there are many of them.
 
Fausto, like many, I, too, grew up with nonlocking knives and they always worked well for me. Never had one close on my fingers. I also grew up in times where cars had no seatbelts. Never needed one, never had my face against the steering wheel or the windshield. But it sure is nice to have them and, just in case, I buckle up every day. Like seatbelts, I view locks as safety devices: you don't need them, but it's nice to have them "just in case." Having said that, for me locks or lack thereof is not a major deciding factor choosing a pocket knife (except that I don't like framelocks and don't buy them just because of that, but that belongs in another forum). But there are several traditional loocking mechanisms, as others have pointed out.

As far as fixed blades go, some of us cannot carry them in the work environment we toil. For some, a locking folding knife may be their best option, and perhaps that's why there are plenty of traditionals with it.
 
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Modoc ED said:
If ya want a Case Copperlock without a lock, get a Case Copperhead. They're available from various dealers and of course the great aution site.
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Way ahead of ya Ed. I really like the 6249's and have had the pleasure of owning " a few :D ". It is a close second favorite pattern of mine, right next to the mini trapper
 
I can go either way on this discussion. When I think traditonal, I think non-locking. However, for a lot of years I only owned a Buck 110 and I have difficulty lumping it with the modern folders. In addition, there are folders that straddle the line, such as some of A.G. Russell's knives that are a traditional pattern, but with a lock, the Case Copperlock, the Boker Trapperliner, the Queen locking Mountain Man and Teardrop, and the locking GEC's.

Since I haven't a clue where to draw the line between traditional and non-traditional, I choose not to worry about it.
 
Thanks for the replies :)
I didn't mean to discuss the utility of locking mechanisms here...just wanted to hear your opinions, cause I felt like I may not be the only one who linked the concept of "traditional" knife to non locking blades.
Cisco, you are right about seatbelts...they did have an impact in reducing the cases of deaths and major injuries in car accidents. And I buckle up too. But as for locking knives, I still think that it's an overly considered matter.
I have locking knives and I do think that a lock can give an extra safety to the user. But the major safety comes from the way you use your knife, and what tasks you use it for. I am sometimes surprised to read discussions about the strength of a lock, and I realize that we don't use our knives in the same manner. A lock on a modern folder has made me feel safe sometimes (when I started using them) but I think it was mainly a psychological thing. Even if I had my folder locked, I do know that I didn't put virtually any load on the lock. Anyway, this was not the point of the OP.
I don't consider a locking system a necessary thing in a knife. It's a good thing, but not strictly necessary to me. In some cathegories of knives (those we call with the general term "traditionals"), I think they just don't fit well...and David's awesome post tells me I'm not the only one.
Fausto
:cool:
 
A knife can lock, and also be considered tradional. Locks are not a new thing.

Since my failed right thumb surgery(last summer) I can no longer open a slipjoint with a heavy pull(and yes, it sucks).
I now have to use a locking knife, fixed blade, or one of the two slip joints I had maid with a light pull.
I really like my mini and regular Copperlocks with CV. I wish I had kept my Case Tony Bose lockback whittler, but sold it before I hurt my thumb.
 
This is an interesting thread. I have been carrying a Buck 110 lately, because I've been needing a bigger knife while preparing for deer season. Anyway, I think locking knives can still be traditional. But I think it depends on the lock. An AXIS lock, is definately not traditional, but a lockback is.
 
I've noticed a tendency of one of my Opinels to try to close a bit, when simply stropping the blade. Some of my slip-joint folders with weak(ish) springs tend to do it, too. The pivot on my Walnut-handled No. 08 is not so tight, so the leather will 'grab' the blade occasionally, and try to swivel the blade closed, if the lock is disengaged. On the other hand, my 'carbone' No. 8 is very tight in the pivot, so I can strop at will with that one, without needing the lock. Ken44's post above reminded me of this. On knives with very light pulls or somewhat loose pivots, a lock would indeed be safer for even the simplest of tasks.
 
quattromori said:
I'm not saying that a locking system is useless in a knife. I just think it's a bit overly considered. And personally, I don't like it in a traditional knife (making a very special exception for Opinel's...their locking system looks so old fashioned).I still have this idea that a traditional blade, no matter if it's made in 1930 or 2011, should still be the same kind of knife that my grandfather, or his dad, would carry. And there were no locking systems back then.
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I'm pretty sure locking knives go back pretty far. Point Wikipedia towards "navaja", a traditional Spanish knife that had a racheting lock in the 18th century according to that wiki entry. So, perhaps it depends on where your Granpa was from! :)

I was born right around the time that the Buck 110 was being designed, and as old as this makes me feel, I think you'ld be really hard pressed to make a case that the 110 is anything other than a classic.

I have slipjoints, an Opinel and an Old Timer 5OT lockback. I'm an average guy and my "he man" cutting jobs include cutting down card board boxes and piercing hard shell plastic consumer goods packaging. Ther's just no question about which knife gets the call. IMO, no amount of proper technique will make a slip joint safer, or even as safe as a good lockback. Bad technique is what is dangerous.

Obviously, fixed blades don't have the problem of failing locks, but I got the sense from your post that you were primarily interested in pocket knives.
 
Locking knives definitely aren't something new, ther are plenty of lockers around that were made around the turn of the last century, four examples are right here care of Ulster from around 1910-1920. I'd definitely consider them traditionals, along with a good number of old Sheffield leverlocks:

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Eric
 
Eric, I really like the 1138 and 1119 pattern!

I really wish the custom makers would make more of the old pattern locking knives. I've had a Halfrich(CF, so not really tradional), and handled a Pena lockback at Blade, and the precision of those locks were amazing. It has to be tough for a maker to pull those off, and can often add to the piece IMO.

Then again i'm still very PO'ed that I can no longer open most slipjoints:p And I really wanted the last two Case/Bose collabs!
 
Ken, sorry for ur thumb thing.
Pinnah, I guess the reason why I find locking traditionals less traditionals :) is that every knife that I have seen in my youth was a slipjoint with no backspring and enough friction on the pivot...that helped me build my own image of a traditional knife. Probably if had grown up sorrounded by Buck 110's and 112's, I would probably see things from another point of view.
I find this kind of thread very interesting; it's nice to share personal views, especially when they are somehow related to our own "knife history" (meaning both personal and cultural).
Fausto
:cool:
 
Particularly like Eric's photo of those Ulsters, some very desirable knives there.

I'm sure that Sheffield produced some locking knives in the late 19th century - have look at the Old Knives or Sheffield thread. Interesting topic for sure and it is very region centric. For instance, here in Finland the traditional knife is neither locking nor folding but Puukko of all sizes. I like both locking Traditionals and slipjoints, it is not always the case that locking Traditionals have thick heavy blades either-although they often do to mimic a more rugged blade. I have lockbacks from MOKi Japan and Fontenille-Pataud France that are very keen slicers indeed. The Fontenille is a very clever locking Laguiole whose very end of the spring acts as the lock.This is very impressive as the whole spring,with filework and 'bee' at the end is forged from one piece, nor does it interfere with ergonomics or appearance. I might add that this is one of the best made knives I own and it looks the part!
 
Most, but not all, of my singleblade folders are lockers: either backlock or linerlock. Often the action is even easier/smoother opening on these than on a non locking slipjoint. I think locking folders can be safer or less safe than slipjoints, depending on the user. Anything you do with a slipjoint would be safer with a locker if done the same way, respecting the fact it could fold up. But if you treat a locker as a fixed blade, it becomes less safe.

To me, the safest kind of folder is one with at least a fingers width choil before the edge starts. Then if the knife folds up, it only pinches instead of cutting.
 
I have a lot of locking knives too. I think my personal hold up with them is that they are not necesarily dangerous but I get over confident with a good locking knife. The lack of a lock really helps remember to be careful. :)
 
When it comes to the dreaded "other" type of folders, I prefer liner locks in some instances. However, I do not care for them on a traditional knife (electrician, trapper with a liner lock etc). Lockbacks are fine, though not preferred. When it comes to folders, I like the Opinel type lock, friction folders and slipjoints.
 
I guess I'm going to wind up going against the grain here or maybe across the grain. Locking folders have been around a very long time and, in fact, there is very little that's actually new in the way of locking mechanisms in the modern area. I don't know how long Schrade built the 194OT and it's predecessors with the liner lock, but that is certainly one example and IMO a fine traditional single blade trapper. A locking mechanism does not deter me from buying, using, and enjoying locking traditional knives. Nor, does it interfer in the use of the knife. So, I have owned and enjoyed several different traditional locking knife patterns, Remingtons, Camillus, Buck, Case, and Gerber (Silver Knights). Yep, I like them all very much.

Non-locking traditionals are great, too. I have a fair number of non-locking traditionals and I don't feel handicapped because they don't lock. What I decide to use each day sometimes depends upon what I am going to do. I actually have do some jobs that Kershaw's "Needs Work" is the best knife for the job,and I use it for those jobs. However, I find my self using traditionals 99% of the time (locking or non-locking).

Ed J
 
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