TRAILMASTER VS TUSK

The ones I will be testing are well used yes. That picture is the standard lineup off of Bill's website. However mine look the same except for cosmetic damage, mostly scratches along the sides of the blades. They are functionally the same as when I got them. The only one that suffered real damage was the 15" Ang Khola, whose buttcap became slightly loose due to a fall:

http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum26/HTML/000018.html

which resulted in a minor repair of some epoxy applied around the buttcap.

-Cliff

[This message has been edited by Cliff Stamp (edited 24 March 1999).]
 
I can`t wait to see the results of this test either. If anyone can give a bunch of knives a good workout it`s Cliff. Cobalt,I love a good debate too! Don`t get me wrong,I`d love to have a super duper MD to use,I`m just not about to shell out that kinda change for a knife,any knife. But then I`m cheap.
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Marcus
 
Craig's khukuri arrived yesterday and I have put my initial impressions on the following page:

http://www.physics.mun.ca:80/~sstamp/knives/bas_gh.html

Testing so far is only light, but its performance is very good.

The main review page will be here:

http://www.physics.mun.ca:80/~sstamp/knives/face_off.html

I'll make posts as I update it as the results come in. For now it just contains some details on the various knives being tested.

-Cliff


[This message has been edited by Cliff Stamp (edited 25 March 1999).]
 
Good review so far Cliff. See I told you, you were the man to do the total testing.

 
Cliff, would you like me to throw the 12" Sirupati in with the Ontarios when I send the rest? I have the feeling it might do better than expected for an 8" blade compared to a lot of 10-12" ones out there, and it's relatively cheap ( under $150 if I recall ) and easy to carry, and like I said before, of all my HI's, this is the one that begs me to take it with me when I go out the door. For that matter, I can send a 15" Sirupati too.

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Russ S
 
Cliff, I had no idea that the Tusk was that heavy. It could have fooled me by it's looks. Almost as heavy as the Ang Khola.
 
Cliff - sorry, I forgot that this test is being done with knives at hand, and not knives donated for testing.
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Maybe I was thinking about the other thread where the Trailmaster is being pitted against the ATAK.

Cobalt - Yep, you're right. I'm sure there are a lot of other bowies out there which deserves a second look. As to the CS Trailmaster, I just figured it would be a great knife for my dad, since he puts his knives to good use (don't ask me what, though, hehehehe). Then again, we shall see which one would come out to be the better knife.
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Price-wise, I guess CS wins hands down... performance-wise? we'll find out soon enough.

Regarding the email, I don't really believe they have no email address. Maybe they just haven't posted it, or don't want to post it, for whatever reason.
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I'll try to check something out, as I'm from the Philippines, and their 1-800 number doesn't work here.
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Gee... I guess I'm as excited as everyone else here with regards to the outcome of the test!!! Good luck, guys! and thanks again!

Dan
 
Danny, indeed, the trailmaster will suit your dads needs quite well. So would the Recon Scout, which is extremely stout for a 7.5 inch blade.
 
Hi Cobalt!

Well, as to the Recon Scout, I'm eyeing that one for myself.
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You're right... with around 2 inches shorter, but with the same stock thickness as the Trailmaster, I believe it to be a pretty strong knife. :-) But I'm not closing the doors yet, as I would still be interested in finding out just how tough CS would be compared to MD in general (TM vs. TUSK).
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I wonder if pull-ups would be part of the test? lol....
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just kidding.
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Dan

Dan
 
Dan, not to change your mind or anything, but have you seen the Himalayan imports khukuri's. If you want tough, these are about as tough as they come, especially the 15 inch Ang Khola. Mine is 7/16 inch thick. Cliff will be throwing his Ang Khola's into the mix, but they have already been tested hard previously and passed. In other words these knives have already passed the acid test. If you have never seen a 15 inch H.I. Ang Khola, it is a sight to behold. Go check out the Himalayan Imports forum over here and at knifeforums. There is a lot of good info. You can also read Cliff and Wills reviews of the Khukuri's. If you want tough, these are it.
 
Dan, and although pull-ups won't be in the test, there will be a prying test to see how tough these blades all are.
 
Rusty send whatever you want. I will not do any extensive toughness testing (mainly lateral blade strength) on the Sirupatis though as I don't want to find Bill and a bunch of angry kamis on my doorstep. It should be interesting to see how they fare with regards to general utility though.

Cobalt I was very surprised as well. The TUSK is balanced so well that you can't feel its weight. There is little wrist fatigue using it. It actually feels much lighter than the Service #1 due to its almost neutral balance. I compared the two of them with regard to general chopping over a range of wood sizes and types with a few friends the last few days. The more neutral balance of the TUSK and its much thinner grind has its advantages and disadvantages.

Dan, not all of the knives are mine. Rusty is sending a few, and CS has shown interest in seeing how a couple of their larger knives fare. Once I get final word from them about exactly what they want to include I'll post a note.

And yeah, there will be lateral blade strength tests. This will not include an actual pull-up as I have never had the need to use a knife as a climbing peg, and do not forsee a time when I will. Interestingly enough one of my brothers friends who rock climbs uses a CS tanto for exactly that. Anyway I will look at blade strength in regards to prying and in different chopping / splitting methods (the latter are much harder on a knife than just prying).

-Cliff


[This message has been edited by Cliff Stamp (edited 26 March 1999).]
 
Cliff,

A question, correction?

Hard Chrome is indeed a vapor barrier, it is chemically bound to the steel surface if I read the

http://www.hausnerinc.com/sealproc.htm

info correctly, it will not chip off as a chrome coating on a bumper may. Barrels of many military rifles are chrome lined (AR-15, AK's and FN-FAL) This inhibits corrosion and wear in this abusive application. A hard chrome coating is a chemical process,that has excellent abilities, I think.

In testing would you cut through an energized household type conductor? Is this not one of the features that a knife could be used for? I have done this with a pocket knife (unintentionally) as a kid as I set out to repair a plug on a lamp. Sparks and suprise, resulted ( no injury to me).

In a fire, or other situation we could be faced with chopping out of a room and a conductor could be encountered??

Your thoughts?

Noel
 
Noel, you can get rusting under the chrome on MD knives, this issue has been discussed before on his forum on knifeforums.com. While it will I would assume reduce corrosion somewhat I have never see hard facts promoted about what the extent of the protection is. Because of this lack of information I am uncomfortable not protecting the blade. Note though I have never heard of a documented failure due to a MD blade rusting out.

About the electrial conductivity aspect you bring up a good point and it is one of the strengths of MD knives. All the other knives have metal on the handle that is connected to the blade and will transfer current right to you. Besides the electrical aspect, thermal isolation is also very nice to have as it makes working in colder situations much nicer.

As for chopping up electrical lines that is an interesting prospect. I will consider it and if I can determine a way to test this safely somehow I will attempt it. I will not actually chop a live wire but instead pass a current across the edge. Chopping a live wire is too much of a hazard. As this should generate enough heat to ruin the temper of the blade if I do this it will only be on the blades that fail the toughness tests. I will test the metallic parts on all the handles to see if there a line of conduction between them and the main blade - this I can do without any danger of electric shock.

Thanks for bringing that up.

-Cliff
 
Craig from Gurkha House here. I'll be following Cliff's postings around the internet, and wanted to express my thanks to him for doing such great tests. He's really doing a service to knife buyers and enthusiasts. Happy testing, Cliff.
 
Hmmm... Interesting.. These Khukuris looks similar to what we have here, like the Bolo and the Machetes. My dad collects these (obviously, the son would follow, hehe) and I think he has one similar to those pictured here. Though I don't think we call it khukuris. It would be interesting, though, to own one. How heavy is it again, Cobalt?
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I doubt if customs people here would allow it to be imported, though...

Oh yeah, this may sound dumb, but how exactly does one calculate the width of the blade in terms of ?/16th of an inch? My CS tantos here are supposedly 3/16 width? but I tried using a ruler to check, and it's nearly 1/4" thick. Is that 16 divided by 3? Like I said, dumb question..
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hehehe..

Prying tests would be good. I guess we'll be able to see whose edge bends a bit first or something..
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And yep, no pull-ups.
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Cliff, you mean someone actually used a CS tanto for rock-climbing pegs? lol....
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But it's barely 1/4" thick... wonder what happened to it. Oh, and when doing the splitting test, watch out for the shrapnels.
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You're really going to sacrifice your MD Tusk for this, aren't you? Egad... I sure hope Mad Dog knows about your willingness and generosity in terms of testing out their knives with one of your own! Who knows? They might end up sending you a brand new one later on?
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Hmmm... guys, Mike and Spark are also about to test out the Trailmaster against the Busse. Makes one wonder how come it's always the Trailmaster that they are testing it with. What's there with the Trailmaster that makes people want to test it against other brands? Their hyped-up ads? If CS ends up on top after these tests, that would probably give Lynn the go-signal to justify his ads, and hype them even more.. hehehe..
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If it doesn't, then we'll have to watch out for the next posting of "Riposte" ...
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GO FOR IT, GUYS!
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Dan
 
Oh yeah, an off-topic question for you, Cobalt, if you don't mind.
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Since I've seen that you're pretty knowledgeable when it comes to steel composition and stuffs like that, I was wondering if you happen to know what type of steel CASE uses for their lockback folders. I heard someone say that they are using 50100 for those folders, wonder if that's true...

Oh well, just a thought..
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thanks!

Dan
 
Dan, width of 3/16" means 3 divided by 16 of an inch. It is 1/16 less than a 1/4 of an inch.

I have seen the tanto climbing peg and it would make a very impressive knife add. The knife is only few years old and has seen considerable use. The edge is actually significantly moved back from sharpening. The handle is still secure and the point profile is still intact.

Case advertises "chrome-vanadium" blades on some of their knives which is supposed to be a good edge holder (I don't know what the steel name is). If they don't say "chrome-vanadium" type I heard its just a low grade stainless.

About the TUSK, yeah it will be going into the mix and will not get treated any gentler this time around.

The reason that the Trailmaster gets discussed so much is probably because of the push from CS but is also has a strong reputation as a solid work knife comparable to the high end handmade knives. This leads to interesting questions being asked. If CS priced the Trailmaster at about $300 interest would be much lower but since its about 1/3 the price of the knives it gets compared to it goes it with a strong advantage from the start.

-Cliff
 
Dan, unfortunately I have never owned a Case knife and never been interested in them enough to find out. But it seems to me that someone else brought this question up about 2 months ago either in this forum or one of the other forums. Search around and go back like 60 or 75 days to see the threads and you may find one on Case knives. I'm almost positive someone else asked this question.

Noel, Chrome is not a vapor barrier even though it is bonded to the steel. It resists vapor more just like if you put any standard coating on it and it is extremely abrasion resistant. A vapor barrier will completely encapsulate a material and not allow any of the elements to get through, like birdsong coatings and so many other good teflon base coatings. These coatings wear off easily however, and then you can have corrosion on the exposed parts.

As for the linning of a gun bore with hard chrome. The hard chrome is there for wear resistance only not corrosion resistance since the friction and heat of the bullets as well as the gun oils used keep the barrels from rusting anyway.
 
Cliff, the Ontario Survival Bowie, the Marine Raider Bowie, and the HI 12" and 15" Sirupatis are in the mail going out at 3:45 PM PST today. The Ontario Kukri and Bolo *should* arrive at my place in a week to ten days, and I'll send them on.

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Russ S
 
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