Trying to decide

tenman

tenman

Joined
Jun 17, 2006
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443
I currently do not own any Busse or Swamp Rat knives, and am trying to decide which will be the first. My preference is for the blades in the 4-5 inch range, it would be used for a wide variety of tasks (fishing, skinning a deer, maybe some hiking, etc.). The knives that interest me the most are the HRLM, Scrapper 4, Ratmandu, possibly a meaner street. I have done a bit of research comparing INFI and SR101, both seem to be plenty impressive- will sr101 take and hold an edge similar to INFI? An M6 and HRLM would seem to make a great pair of knives. In the Busse line, the GW and AD are just a bit smaller than I'd like, the Meaner Street has caught my attention.

Any assistance would be appreciated.
 
HRLM - It has quickly become my favorite all around user. I pair it with a ratweiler which is also about the perfect camp/survival/woods knife, imho.
 
Another HRLM vote. :thumbup:

I'm a drop-point fan, especially when dressing a deer. The HRLM is shaped just right for me and has a great handle. For some cutting, the steel will actually hold an edge longer than INFI.
 
The HRLM is a great little knife...

But the Ratmandu is as close to an all-arounder as you can get -- if you wanted to start with just one.

The Busse meaner street is an awesome EDC as well, but less useful than the HRLM and Ratmandu in the woods / camp.
 
Thanks for the response, the insights are very helpful. Its always tough when you have to decide on one, and one only (at least for now). The Rats certainly seem to offer a lot of bang for the $$$, and that is a plus. Some of the torture tests I have come across are incredible. These knives seem to be capable of absorbing abuse that would chip, gouge or shatter any other blade- yet come out shaving sharp. They appear to be really great knives, but it is one of those things where I have to see for myself. At this point my preference is heavily towards the HRLM, though the Ratmandu is a very close 2nd.

Is the logo/sterile thing a big deal?

Size-wise (no CS hate please), how do the HRLM and Ratmandu compare to a CS Master Hunter?
 
tenman said:
Thanks for the response, the insights are very helpful. Its always tough when you have to decide on one, and one only (at least for now). The Rats certainly seem to offer a lot of bang for the $$$, and that is a plus. Some of the torture tests I have come across are incredible. These knives seem to be capable of absorbing abuse that would chip, gouge or shatter any other blade- yet come out shaving sharp. They appear to be really great knives, but it is one of those things where I have to see for myself. At this point my preference is heavily towards the HRLM, though the Ratmandu is a very close 2nd.

Is the logo/sterile thing a big deal?

Size-wise (no CS hate please), how do the HRLM and Ratmandu compare to a CS Master Hunter?
Click to expand...



Your 4 choices in knives are all 4 VERY nice knives. (HRLM, Ratmandu, Scrapper 4 and Meaner Street).

The Scrapper 4 and Meaner Street are very similar - Both are INFI and they both have a very similar blade shape. The difference is the handle. Micarta is nice, but in this case you will pay a lot for it. I am personally a BIG fan of the mudder grips used on the Scrapper 4. So, for the money, I would have to recommend the Scrapper 4.

The Scrapper 4 and Meaner Street are similar to each other, but different enough from the HRLM and Ratmandu.

The HRLM and the Ratmandu have the same AWESOME handle design and are both SR-101 (Swamp Rat) steel, but mainly differ in blade length.

I don't bash CS as a company. I have a Master Hunter. I think CS makes a few pretty decent knives including the Master Hunter! The Master Hunter is a simple, but good design. However, in my book, Swamp Rat, Busse and Scrap Yard are quite a few levels higher than Cold Steel.

The Master Hunter is actually right at the same size of the HRLM and a little smaller than the Ratmandu.

The blade length of the HRLM is measured smaller, but because I measure a blade from tip to first edge of handle material. If you measure from the index finger side of the guard to the tip of the blade, the knives are almost identical in measurements.

The blades on the HRLM and the Ratmandu are taller

I don't have my scale handy, but the micarta handles on the HRLM and the Ratmandu will make those two knives both heavier than the Master Hunter.

Lengths:

HRLM:
..........Blade length: 4.3125"
..........Blade height: 1.375"
..........OAL: 9.25"

Ratmandu: 10.375"
..........Blade length: 5.3125"
..........Blade height: 1.375"
..........OAL:

Master Hunter:
...........Blade length: 4.5"
...........Blade height: 1.125"
........... OAL: 9.25"



The Logo / Sterile thing is not really a big deal. The logo definitely doesn't affect the function of the knife and probably only affects the value less than 5% of the time and if so, the value difference is minimal. The knife designs have certain clues to distinguish themselves without the logos. It especially doesn't matter if you are going to use the knife. Some people like the look of the logo, but the military doesn't allow the logos. Some people don't like the logos. So, sometimes Busse (and family) release a run without logos.

Preference would really come down to intended use of the knife. You could probably do just a little bit more with the Ratmandu around camp, but the HRLM and the SS4 are awesome size for EDC, hiking and general chore/camp knives!


Your only problem is you "think" you can only purchase "1"! :D

You don't quite understand the addiction factor just yet..... ;)

Since none of the knives you are interested in are available directly from the factory, the best place to look is at Bladeforum's trade-forum for Busse/Swamp Rat/Scrap Yard Here: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=804

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Having owned at least one of each at one time or another, I vote for the Ratmandu. It has a useable choil, the HRLM doesn't. You could modify it, but you'd kill the resale value of it, IMHO. The Mean Street or the SS4 would be good choices also. The SS4 had a little too long of a handle for my tastes. The MS is my current favorite small Busse, although I'd like a larger choil, thinner blade, and an active duty butt. The RM or SS4 are available now for @$200, the MS will run you $250-$300. I'd pick up whatever you can right now as it's a buyer's market.

GregB
 
I've owned both the Ratmandu and the HRLM. Sold the ratmandu. To me the Ratmandu is more fighter than a utility knife which is why my friend bought it and loves it. He wanted a fighter first. Not that the RMD can't do everything the HRLM can do it's just that the false edge and lack of the fatty belly that you find on the HRLM are turn offs to me. I do like the length of the blade on the RMD which is why I bought it in the first place but until the newer Howlers grow an inch, I'll stick with the one I got.

As far as choils...that's a personal preferance. I personally don't think a choil is necessary on a knife that small. IMO a choil doesn't pay off until you upsize to the 1/4" thick 6" or longer blades.
 
I am sure style and uses for a given knife are very subject to opinion. But I don't view the RMD as a fighter.

I would argue that it might be slightly more fighter styled than the HRLM, but only because it is a little longer and has a clip point that makes it a little more pointy.


I wouldn't say the RMD has a false edge. The edge has barely been beveled - rounded over. Sometimes the rounding of the edge helps in batonning as a square edge can eat into the wood. I don't see that the bevel/rounding makes the RMD much more of a fighter.

The sweep and curve of the cutting edge on the RMD and HRLM very close to the same. If you over-lay one knife on top of the other, starting from the tip, the curves of each edge don't deviate much more than 1/32" - 1/16" - pretty close for function.

I agree on part of GregB's choil comment though. The RMD has a very usable choil. The HRLM needs to have the choil modified. Modifying the choil might reduce the resale value if compared to a Mint/New HRLM, but I don't think a well modified choil would reduce the value anymore than slightly using an HRLM. So - if you are buying a knife to use, make it work the way you want it to!

The good thing about the HRLM needing to have the choil modified (IMO) is that "I" (or you) can grind the choil back into the guard handle as opposed to into the cutting edge. I prefer my choil closer to the regular grip for better feel and leaving as much blade as possible. In any event, the choil can be put were and how you want it.

I feel on many of the Swamp Rat and Scrap Yard knives, the choil is about .125" - .25" to far from the handle and too far into the blade.

Some choils that were done nicely (IMO) include the SS4 and the Bog Dog.

I personally (generally) like a choil even on relativley small blades like the 4.125" HRLM. I feel I can choke up and get even more control in certain uses with the choil and the choil makes the knife more versatile.

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Thanks so much for all the great information. As someone stated, it is highly unlikely I'll end up with only one, but for now I'll just have to make a choice. The knife will be a user, so I'm not too worried about resale value. The HRLM is probably a better fit for what I have in mind at this point, but the RMD definitely looks to be a great knife as well. I actually had a black g-10/green blade in my cart yesterday, but did not pull the trigger...oh well. This has been one of those choices I could make myself nuts over. There are a few good choices for HRLM's up on the board, any one of which would make a great first Rat. There is also a very good chance I'll be selling off some folders to purchase a few more :)
 
tenman,

It may seem like it is just better and more simple to just make the right decision and only buy the "one".

But, you probably should have pulled the trigger when you had one in your basket! - especially if it was a color you liked!

Here is why:

With Busse, Swamp Rat and Scrap Yard knives you get a small window of opportunity to purchase knives at retail price. If you miss that window, you tend to have to pay more on the secondary market as these knives are some of the very few knives that consistantly appreciate in value. :thumbup:
This is great if you purchase directly from Eric. Not so great if you miss!

For anybody trying to decide between two knives within this family of knives, buy both - compare side-by-side in your own hands (pictures can be difficult to determine certain nuances).

Then if you still have it in you, sell the one you like the least (*Try not to regret it later!).

If you purchase via a retail opportunity, you usually can at least break even if not make a couple of bucks for your efforts.

If you decide later you want a certain knife, but you missed the opportunity to purchase directly, you will more than likely have to pay more than the original release price :(

..... still - the good news is: if you pay X dollars on the secondary market and you decide it isn't what you want, you can still probably break even when you resell it.

I am confident Eric has more Ratmandu's coming, but he won't tell you when the ride will end. One day they will just not show up anymore!


It doesn't look too good about getting any more HRLM's, but we have been surprised before - you never know :confused:

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DWRW said:
I am confident Eric has more Ratmandu's coming, but he won't tell you when the ride will end.
Click to expand...

There are RMD's available at the store right now, 6 PM eastern, they've been up for a couple of hours, I doubt these last a couple more ;)

:D:D
 
Eric Isaacson said:
There are RMD's available at the store right now, 6 PM eastern, they've been up for a couple of hours, I doubt these last a couple more ;)

:D:D
Click to expand...



Mmmm... Muddy/Tan - If I didn't already have 3 and wasn't having to sell other knives to pay bills right now, I might be tempted.


How are those G10/Satin HRLM LE's coming Eric?

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I think the HRLM and the RatManDu's would be perfect for what you described. Good luck on your choice and let the addiction begin.
 
How are those G10/Satin HRLM LE's coming Eric?
Click to expand...

Haven't officially purchased my first Rat, and all ready I know that if this knife showed up in the store I'd buy it in a second. Maybe even stretch the blade length 1/2 inch and add a bit more choil?

Still leaning towards the HRLM for the 1st Rat, there is something about the drop point styling that I really seem to like.
 
I have four Rats, looking to get a Busse. I've got a sterile HR, a sterile Camp Tramp, a Battle Rat and a Bog Dog. The HR, CT and BR were coated, Scott Gossman removed the coating on the HR and CT. I am going to do the Battle Rat and get a convex edge put on it. The Bog Dog needs a new pro edge, but didn't have any coating, and was my first knife (thanks thathamguy ;)). All three except for the HR were purchases, the HR was part of a trade. Out of all of them, I love all of them! My favorite size right now is the HR and BD. Since the BD isn't available any more, I would get a Howling Rat, great EDC task knife. I have been eyeing the Ratmandu for a while. I have seen a few Busses, mainly the older ones, but have been looking at the ones in the 4-6" range. I have a soft spot in my heart for the SR's, but have heard nothing but good things about the Busses.
 
tenman said:
Haven't officially purchased my first Rat, and all ready I know that if this knife showed up in the store I'd buy it in a second. Maybe even stretch the blade length 1/2 inch and add a bit more choil?

Still leaning towards the HRLM for the 1st Rat, there is something about the drop point styling that I really seem to like.
Click to expand...



Tenman,

Don't hold your breath for the HRLM in G10 with a Satin finish. I have requested it, but .... that doesn't carry much weight. :( :rolleyes:


... and I sure wouldn't hold my breath for them to had a 1/2 inch to the blade. HRLM and Ratmandu are the current choices and there probably won't be anything in between for a long time :( ... not that much is really needed in between :confused:


Adding more choil is an easy do-it-yourself project.

You could probably have the blade of the RMD shortened, but you should probably leave that to a knowledgeable professional. If you over-heat the blade, you will mess up the temper. :eek:


***** This should be taken into consideration of making the choil larger or any other power grinding that might be done to any knife!!!

.
 
silenthunterstudios said:
I have four Rats, looking to get a Busse. I've got a sterile HR, a sterile Camp Tramp, a Battle Rat and a Bog Dog. The HR, CT and BR were coated, Scott Gossman removed the coating on the HR and CT. I am going to do the Battle Rat and get a convex edge put on it. The Bog Dog needs a new pro edge, but didn't have any coating, and was my first knife (thanks thathamguy ;)). All three except for the HR were purchases, the HR was part of a trade. Out of all of them, I love all of them! My favorite size right now is the HR and BD. Since the BD isn't available any more, I would get a Howling Rat, great EDC task knife. I have been eyeing the Ratmandu for a while. I have seen a few Busses, mainly the older ones, but have been looking at the ones in the 4-6" range. I have a soft spot in my heart for the SR's, but have heard nothing but good things about the Busses.
Click to expand...


It is hard for me to decide which is my favorite as well, but I would likely put the HRLM and Ratmandu near the top WITH my Bog Dog!!!! :thumbup:

CT and BR are probably neck and neck for 4th.

.
 
Willieboy said:
What does HRLM stand for? Where would one acquire a Meaner Streets? Are they available again?
Click to expand...



HRLM = Howling Rat Little Mischief - A Swamp Rat knife made with SR-101 steel

Meaner Steet is a Busse knife made with INFI steel.

Busse owns Swamp Rat and Scrap Yard knives, but the three companies are run seperately.

The best place to find a Meaner Street is likely the Bladeforums trade Forum or ebay.

There were a few that were sold a few weeks ago and were recently recieved by buyers. You won't likely be able to buy them directly from Busse any time soon, but you never know and they won't tell you. Knives just pop up, are availabe, then they are gone.

If you miss, you have to buy on the secondary market.

Do some searching and reading. There is a lot of info about how this works.

.
 
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