Two new knives for me, and two very unlikely reactions

[Belly]

It’s been at least 6 or 7 years since my last Spyderco purchase. I got my first Military model back in 1998, and after 25 years of being a Spyderco fan, I still Iove their products and their business methods. Sal and Eric are really great members of the knife community.
I just got my very first Paramilitary 2, after watching it since its inception. For some reason I never wanted one…until recently. I also purchased the Swayback model. I’ve wanted that very much since it came out, but I didn’t feel comfortable with the price. But it has been reduced recently While I was waiting for them to arrive, I was mostly interested in the Swayback, and the main attraction on the Paramilitary was the Cruwear steel. I’ve never had a knife with it.
Well, they’ve arrived, and I‘m quite surprised (and very sad). The Swayback is really bad, and the Paramilitary is really great - the opposite of what I expected.

The Swayback fails for 2 reasons- it’s so difficult to open due to the size, location, and chamfering of the Spydie hole. The greatest feature of all Spydercos is the worst implementation of it on the Swayback. It’s ridiculous how tough it is to open. Second, the swayback design with the back of the handle being slightly “concave”(like a smile) has “pointy” corners which poke your hand. I’m shocked they designed it this way and super disappointed. I want to love it..but these 2 issues really ruin it. And I’m a very forgiving knife nut! Such a bummer because I have lusted over this knife. And such a huge bummer because both of the issues could have been prevented so easily with out changing the core design of the Swayback much if at all.

On the other side, what I thought would be a boring, average, simple, EDC kinda knife, is freaking great! The Paramilitary 2 in purple G10 and Cruwear is excellent. Great, crisp Spydie hole can but opened easily with the thumb or a Spydie flick. Smooth opening and closing. And the grip is a great fit for my hand - no hot spots and the thumb falls right behind the hole. Just fantastic.

So, a complete 180 on the 2 knives! What a surprise.

Thanks!

 

[brainsxn]

It’s been at least 6 or 7 years since my last Spyderco purchase. I got my first Military model back in 1998, and after 25 years of being a Spyderco fan, I still Iove their products and their business methods. Sal and Eric are really great members of the knife community.
I just got my very first Paramilitary 2, after watching it since its inception. For some reason I never wanted one…until recently. I also purchased the Swayback model. I’ve wanted that very much since it came out, but I didn’t feel comfortable with the price. But it has been reduced recently While I was waiting for them to arrive, I was mostly interested in the Swayback, and the main attraction on the Paramilitary was the Cruwear steel. I’ve never had a knife with it.
Well, they’ve arrived, and I‘m quite surprised (and very sad). The Swayback is really bad, and the Paramilitary is really great - the opposite of what I expected.

The Swayback fails for 2 reasons- it’s so difficult to open due to the size, location, and chamfering of the Spydie hole. The greatest feature of all Spydercos is the worst implementation of it on the Swayback. It’s ridiculous how tough it is to open. Second, the swayback design with the back of the handle being slightly “concave”(like a smile) has “pointy” corners which poke your hand. I’m shocked they designed it this way and super disappointed. I want to love it..but these 2 issues really ruin it. And I’m a very forgiving knife nut! Such a bummer because I have lusted over this knife. And such a huge bummer because both of the issues could have been prevented so easily with out changing the core design of the Swayback much if at all.

On the other side, what I thought would be a boring, average, simple, EDC kinda knife, is freaking great! The Paramilitary 2 in purple G10 and Cruwear is excellent. Great, crisp Spydie hole can but opened easily with the thumb or a Spydie flick. Smooth opening and closing. And the grip is a great fit for my hand - no hot spots and the thumb falls right behind the hole. Just fantastic.

So, a complete 180 on the 2 knives! What a surprise.

Thanks!

Do you like wharncliffe style blades in general? I must admit, Im more of a drop point or leaf shaped blade kind of guy.
People online rave about the PM2. I just dont like the shape of the blade. The belly looks good, but the straight spine ruins it for me. Have you tried the shaman or the manix 2? Im thinking of one of those 2.

 

[RoyalHolic]

I've handled a few swaybacks and it didn't feel like it had hot spots but I do recall it being more difficult to open but on a knife like that the spydiehole isn't really intended to be the opening method since it's in the style of a slipjoint.

PM2 is their magnum opus, it's perfect and it's been done in about every steel and a few blade shapes as well. Couldn't agree more on Sal and Eric they seem to be top notch people.

 

[Belly]

Do you like wharncliffe style blades in general? I must admit, Im more of a drop point or leaf shaped blade kind of guy.
People online rave about the PM2. I just dont like the shape of the blade. The belly looks good, but the straight spine ruins it for me. Have you tried the shaman or the manix 2? Im thinking of one of those 2.

Yes, I do like the wharncliffe blade. I have a Yojimbo 2, and maybe 1 or 2 other knives with that style. I also have a Manix 2. Enjoy those.
I do like the shape of the Paramilitary 2 blade, mostly because the full size Military is one of my favorite models. The P2 is similar but shorter.

 

[Belly]

I've handled a few swaybacks and it didn't feel like it had hot spots but I do recall it being more difficult to open but on a knife like that the spydiehole isn't really intended to be the opening method since it's in the style of a slipjoint.

PM2 is their magnum opus, it's perfect and it's been done in about every steel and a few blade shapes as well. Couldn't agree more on Sal and Eric they seem to be top notch people.

I understand what you mean about the opening method. But if they just didn’t do that chamfering it would help a lot. And they could have easily made the handle cutout a little more “open”. These changes would not compromise the swayback design.

 

[Sharp Guy]

I bought a Swayback when they first came out and had issues open it too. It's been so long now that I don't remember what I changed to make it open easily. I know it's not a problem any more

As far as the handle shape goes....that's what a swayback knife is. It is kind of a weird handle shape and takes some getting used to. I don't have huge hands. So I don’t get the hot spot issues like some do

I'd suggest working with the knife for awhile before making any decisions

 

[brainsxn]

Yes, I do like the wharncliffe blade. I have a Yojimbo 2, and maybe 1 or 2 other knives with that style. I also have a Manix 2. Enjoy those.
I do like the shape of the Paramilitary 2 blade, mostly because the full size Military is one of my favorite models. The P2 is similar but shorter.

Im going to have to try out a PM2 or a military...

 

[Belly]

I’ve been very aware of the PM2 since it was announced, released, improved, and went on to extreme popularit. I’ve always found it boring. I’ve always thought the Military was the better model and fully supplanted the PM2. Now, I have zero interest in a regular version of it, but purple and black look good together and Cruwear sounds like an interesting steel. Even more ironic is I normally hate anything purple.

 

[fishface5]

Well the swaback design is meant to accommodate work which involves having the edge facing towards your body and pulling it towards you, the reverse of normal. So the grip is great for the specific purpose but not great if used the "normal" way.

Also Sal told me at a show that when Spyderco licenses a design from a maker they don't modify the design.
"Inspired by 19th century English Jack knives, the sway back pattern is a stylish and extremely functional cutting tool. In his latest Spyderco collaboration, renowned Polish knifemaker Marcin Slysz supercharges this classic design by rendering it with state-of-the-art materials and craftsmanship."

You could modify it by enlarging the opening in the scale and rounding the sharp point in the handle, but it would be hard to match the finish.

 

[DA170]

If you look at other manufacturers versions of the Swayback, A nail nick for two handed opening is present. Even though you can manipulate the Spyderco offering with one hand, Think of it as a 2 handed blade and you'll be happy. The knife is an outstanding cutter that's a joy to use!

 

[GPO MAN]

For me, the Swayback is more of a collection piece than a daily cutter. It’s a cool design and can be had for $200 or less now that it’s discontinued.

 

[BD_01]

I hotly anticipated the Swayback and grabbed one as soon as they were available.
Unfortunately it’s one of my least enjoyable Spyderco’s due to the thumb hole access and mechanics of opening.

It cuts like a sun-of-a-gun though. I still carry it periodically when I feel like switching things up. Adding an aftermarket pocket clip improved the knife, imo.

The PM2 is one of my favorite working knives. It’s a bit of a pocket hog for my usually light to moderate EDC needs, but It’s fantastic when real work needs to get done.

 

[sgt1372]

This is funny.

I own over 160 Spydercos and, while about 100 of them are knives that I "could" carry, the only one that I've been carrying for about 3 months is the Swayback.

Knife ergonomics are based on the design of a knife and it's impossible to design a knife that appeals to everyone.

The PM2 has long been touted as one of Spyerco's best designs in terms of size/ergonomics, which is why it has been sold for so long and in so many variations. I own one but I'd never carry it because I've got so many other Spydercos that I'd rather carry.

The Swayback is one of Marcin Slysz's Ti designs which have been very popular, especially his Slyz Bowie, which at least partially emphasizes design over function. The other Ti designed Slyz models are the Techco & SpydieChef. The only other Slysz Ti knife that I own is the SpydieChef.

I do not have any problems opening the Swayback. It is more difficult to open than other Spydercos because of the strength of the detent and how close the Spydie Hole is located to the pivot in relation to the length of the blade, which bascially makes it "unflickable."

While there are many Spydercos that I own that can be opened more quickly, I don't always find that important in the knives that I carry. When I do, I'd carry a karambit instead.

However, if "quick opening" is a key factor for you, then the PM2 would be the better choice because most compression lock knives can be quickly flicked open WITHOUT even touching the hole by just pressing/releasing the lock tab while flicking it w/your wrist.

FWIW, I've been carrying the Swayback in my pocket for so long (for me) because of it's low profile/light weight and it's razor sharp wharncliffe shaped blade which is ideal for cutting thru tape to open boxes which is my primary use for any knife that I carry.

The design is also very suitable for self-defensve purposes (think Yojimbo) but that's only a 2ndary consideration in my case for carrying the Swayback.

To each his own.

 

[norcalAF]

I’ve been very aware of the PM2 since it was announced, released, improved, and went on to extreme popularit. I’ve always found it boring. I’ve always thought the Military was the better model and fully supplanted the PM2. Now, I have zero interest in a regular version of it, but purple and black look good together and Cruwear sounds like an interesting steel. Even more ironic is I normally hate anything purple.

I have a yojimbo 2 in that scheme, it looks great in person.

 

[Belly]

This is funny.

I own over 160 Spydercos and, while about 100 of them are knives that I "could" carry, the only one that I've been carrying for about 3 months is the Swayback.

Knife ergonomics are based on the design of a knife and it's impossible to design a knife that appeals to everyone.

The PM2 has long been touted as one of Spyerco's best designs in terms of size/ergonomics, which is why it has been sold for so long and in so many variations. I own one but I'd never carry it because I've got so many other Spydercos that I'd rather carry.

The Swayback is one of Marcin Slysz's Ti designs which have been very popular, especially his Slyz Bowie, which at least partially emphasizes design over function. The other Ti designed Slyz models are the Techco & SpydieChef. The only other Slysz Ti knife that I own is the SpydieChef.

I do not have any problems opening the Swayback. It is more difficult to open than other Spydercos because of the strength of the detent and how close the Spydie Hole is located to the pivot in relation to the length of the blade, which bascially makes it "unflickable."

While there are many Spydercos that I own that can be opened more quickly, I don't always find that important in the knives that I carry. When I do, I'd carry a karambit instead.

However, if "quick opening" is a key factor for you, then the PM2 would be the better choice because most compression lock knives can be quickly flicked open WITHOUT even touching the hole by just pressing/releasing the lock tab while flicking it w/your wrist.

FWIW, I've been carrying the Swayback in my pocket for so long (for me) because of it's low profile/light weight and it's razor sharp wharncliffe shaped blade which is ideal for cutting thru tape to open boxes which is my primary use for any knife that I carry.

The design is also very suitable for self-defensve purposes (think Yojimbo) but that's only a 2ndary consideration in my case for carrying the Swayback.

To each his own.

I definitely understand what you’re saying. In hindsight, I came off a bit too strong against the Swayback. I did expect a flickable knife. And, you and others are right that it’s just not meant to be flickable. I still plan to use it. And this small corners are uncomfortable but not horrible.