Umnumzaan Detail Photo Request

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BobP63

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I've warmed up to the possibility of purchasing an Umnumzaan, but there's one thing that just keeps nagging me about the execution of it's design that being the installation of the ceramic ball itself.

I've never liked the process of staking to secure an installation, I view it as the method of last resort. I know it works, but it's likely the most crude method of securing an installation available. As a thought exercise I've tried to think of a better method to secure the ball such that the same surface area is exposed, but the alternatives I've come up with simply aren't practical.

When it comes to staking something correctly there's a bit of an art to doing it cleanly and consistently. I've searched for images showing the actual staking of the Umnumzaan's ceramic ball, but there just aren't many clear shots of the staking itself. From what I've seen so far the staking appears to be done free hand with some being done better than others. Maybe I've been looking at early photos hopefully the process has evolved to use some sort of jig to ensure consistency of spacing and depth.

Unfortunately if I buy an Umnumzaan it will be without the benefit of actually holding one in my hand to look at the quality of the staking. It would be helpful if some of you Umnumzaan owner's could post some clear photos of the staking, it would be nice to see several knives and compare the stakings. Thanks.
 
So-Lo said:
Really?

Not being funny, I don't understand why it's a big deal... :confused:
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Not sure about you, but the reason I purchase Chris Reeve products are their consistantly tight tolerances and careful attention to small details. The materials used in CRK knives can be found in many other brands, it's how they build them that sets CRK apart. If all I wanted was a utilitarian knife I'd likely buy a much less expensive knife. I certainly don't need another knife, I want another knife because I enjoy the workmanship it's all about the fine details.
 
BobP63 said:
Not sure about you, but the reason I purchase Chris Reeve products are their consistantly tight tolerances and careful attention to small details. The materials used in CRK knives can be found in many other brands, it's how they build them that sets CRK apart. If all I wanted was a utilitarian knife I'd likely buy a much less expensive knife. I certainly don't need another knife, I want another knife because I enjoy the workmanship it's all about the fine details.
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It sounds by your post that your already familiar with CRK so why would you insult there integrity at this point ?
 
bigmark408 said:
It sounds by your post that your already familiar with CRK so why would you insult there integrity at this point ?
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Why would you even say something stupid like that?

I'm very supportive of the brand and the man behind it, that's why I buy them time and time again. I'm considering buyIng something other than a Sebenza which I know well, I just want to know more about this knife.
 
This is as good a picture as I can get with out taking the knife to bits.

It has been peaned in 3 places at the quater marks, this is pleanty strong enough
as the forces are pushing the ball into the lock bar and not out form it's seating.

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Some of us are just a little high strung from all the flak CRK has been taking lately. That's all.

If you run a google search for bladeforums+umnumzaan, you'll likely find a few pictures sooner or later. The area of the lockbar surrounding the ball appears to have been meticulously peened to hold it in place, but I can't say for sure.

There's a video running around that has stirred up some hubbub, of the 'Zaan being stabbed through a refridgerator door and other similar 'hard-use' tasks. While the knife itself seemed to suffer catastrophic damage for one reason or another, as I imagine most folders would at that point, the ball itself appeared to remain firmly in place. I wouldn't worry.

You could also email CRK on the matter, and get a few more technical details. You appear to have some insight on staking and peening, and so would probably know what questions to ask better than me.

Good luck!
 
The inside forward edge of the lock bar does "reach over" the ball a small amount, you can just see it in the pic.
 
missin_hobo said:
Some of us are just a little high strung from all the flak CRK has been taking lately. That's all.
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I appreciate what your saying, but we should to be able to distinguish genuine curiosity from an attack on someones integrity. That being said I apologize for my harsh response to Mark's comment.
 
Part of what's driving my question can be found when you compare the staking shown in Haze's post with this image I found on the web. Clearly the number of stakes and the location are not the same. So I'm trying to understand if the installation process is evolving.


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The lock bar on my knife looks just like that but has the extra 3rd point that you can
see in the pic. It does also have the "pinching" on the edge of the lock bar too.
 
That is an amazing shot Tony A. I have yet to take my Umnumzaan apart and get a closer look of the ceramic ball but from what I can tell of mine it looks just like the one in Hazes shot.
 
bigmark408 said:
It sounds by your post that your already familiar with CRK so why would you insult there integrity at this point ?
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COme on dudes, isn't an answer like that basically doing the same as what you're accusing him of?:confused:

Please let dudes ask questions without directly being flamed.

If it's someone's integrity being attacked, it's not yours anyway. CRK speak for themselves but sometimes you just want to know a little more detail:thumbup:

don't let one of the knife brothers down when he just wants some info
 
So-Lo said:
Mark, You put it better than I did :cool:
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So-Lo, I guess I'm just not adept at this whole user forum keyboard sniping thing.

I was able to understand what Mark was trying to convey, I obviously didn't appreciate the implication and my response clearly reflected that.

missin_hobo politely provided some background as to why Mark may have made his comment, I understood the point he was trying to make and I offered an apology for my response to Mark.

I mistakenly took your original post at face value and responding accordingly.

So-Lo said:
Really?

Not being funny, I don't understand why it's a big deal... :confused:
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It seems rather ironic to now use your wording, but appropriate non the less.

Really? Not being funny, what does it take for someone to be given the benefit of doubt when making a post? The anonymity of user forums seems to make people take a lot of liberties in what they'll say and to whom.
 
Thanks Tony_A,
That's the clearest shot I've seen to date, the staking looks to be very well applied. Any chance you can get a shot like that of the front of the lock bar? For those Umnumzaan owners not able to get a shot like Tony's, would you say his Unnum is representational?

Has anyone seen an Unnum with only two staking points like photo I posted, or other configurations?

Thanks again Tony_A from a follow lefty, BTW what's the DOB on your Unnum?
 
Bob,

Every Umnum I have seen has the 3 stakes, but I have only handled a few and all were post June 09 production.

You needn't worry about the ball coming free. There has never been a single post or test result on any of the forums indicating a ball came free.

On top of that, part of what you pay for is the outstanding service CRK offers, so if you did manage to lose the detent ball have no doubt that necessary repairs would be handled quickly and to your satisfaction.

Considering what I have said above, the question you are asking is just a total non issue, IMO. If that is the only thing stopping you from buying an umnum then just do yourself a favor and take the plunge, you won't be disappointed!
 
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