Uncle Bill needs your vote. PLEASE READ!!

Discussion in 'Himalayan Imports' started by Bill Martino, Feb 3, 2005.

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  1. munk


    Mar 22, 2002
    My problem with this is even I can sharpen a khuk to decent working condtion. No, not razor sharp, but more than wood cutting sharp.

    And I was a complete knife newbie when I got here. (yeah- I had four pocket knives)

  2. yiterp


    Mar 18, 2001
    well i have something funny to add to all this--as many of you have seen i have a cold steel LTC kukuri in the for trade forums--will i got a e-mail from someone that wanted to trade a 12" AK for it--said they had been working on the bevels and sharpening--i had read this post and tryed to do a search on the person--found nothing--told them to send me the AK first since they have no feedback and i haven't delt with them before and also asked them if he was the person that was trying to get a refund from uncle bill--haven't got a e-mail back yet--LOL--go figure :eek: :) :eek:
  3. ed tank

    ed tank

    Jan 19, 2003
    No. Private matter between the two parties, Mr. M, and Mr. H.
  4. Kismet

    Kismet Basic Member Basic Member

    Jan 30, 2002
    posted this:

    "hello Geoffrey....

    I heard of your troubles. Did you, by any chance, contact the distributor of H.I. products, instead of first contacting the person from whom you bought the knife?

    That is to say, did you attempt a refund or replacement of the khukuri you bought from the company, AND not talk to the person you bought the knife from on an eBay auction beforehand?


    And is it possible that you posted your problems in open forums before you attempted to reconcile them with the person from whom you bought the knife, or, for that matter, before you went to the H.I. forums and asked the people there, who are the user-experts of these tools?


    So, if I am to understand this situation correctly, you bought a previously-owned khukuri on a public auction, couldn't sharpen it to the degree you thought it should sharpen, did not contact the person from whom you bought it, DID attempt to get a refund or replacement from the company with which you had NO business dealings, and have complained in public forums about the situation.

    Interesting. Very interesting.

    Be well and safe,


    Roadrunner likes this.
  5. Green Ice

    Green Ice

    Dec 27, 2004
    Kis, please post his reply if you receive one.

  6. Daniel Koster

    Daniel Koster www.kosterknives.com Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Oct 18, 2001
    I noticed they enacted some scripting changes...to prevent direct linking...which is what caused the crash, I'm sure....

    Yes, keep us posted (those who don't have time to check bushcraft).
  7. Steely_Gunz

    Steely_Gunz Got the Khukuri fevah Moderator

    May 9, 2002
    Kis, as always, you remain a gentleman when being firm. very well done:)
    Dave, you're a heck of a guy. You did the right thing. We all know you well enough for that. It looks like this guy has multiple avenues to take and get his satisfaction. All he has to do is come here. I mean, 5 or 6 offers to sharpen a knife for free, at least 2 offers or more to buy the thing for 50 bucks, an offer from Dave himself to refund the money AND he gets to keep the knife AND an offer for an expensive drink of very fine Scotch (green boxes for you on that one, Dave). Not to mention Uncle Bill being democratic enough to get a vote from his most loyal customers before casting judgement. If it were me, it would have been a "go to hell" moment for sure.

  8. wildmanh

    wildmanh Part time Leather Bender/Sheath maker

    Jul 9, 2000
    Dave, that is a Beautifull AK.. Looks just as sharp as the one I got a year ago.. Which is plety sharp for chopping. I'd be honored to have a blade like that.. Hope this whole mess gets cleaned up quickly.


    P.S. Dan, if you can get your hands on the Khukuri.. Please post more pics. Thans.
  9. 37up


    Jun 16, 2002
    I am still very suspicious but if Geoff is willing to contact me on his own, than I'm willing to discuss refund in an atmosphere of friendship.

    I think that is the least he could do.

  10. Bill Martino

    Bill Martino

    Mar 5, 1999
    It looks like things are taking the proper course.

    Many thanks to all who contributed and let's acknowledge that we have a couple of new heros. It's not hard to figure out who they are.
  11. Tohatchi NM

    Tohatchi NM

    Mar 26, 2002
    Sweet khuk. I'd put some greenbacks on the barrelhead for that fine piece by Sher. It would take lots of abuse to render such a fine blade unsalvagable.

    With regards to this situation, it seems to me that the HI policy is to act honestly and straightforwardly, and make things right. With that said, this is how I imagine the situation would work if I were the end buyer:

    I receive a khuk that I paid for. I play with it for a little while and figure out that it's not satisfactory. I contact the seller with my issue (actually, I would try to fix it, but I've been hanging around the Cantina for a while). Ideally, the seller would take it back, try to fix it, and return it to me in better condition (unless sold in "as is" condition, in which case I would expect nothing.)

    If the seller was some hack moving stuff (not you Danny, but you get good and bad on EBay) and didn't want to deal with me, I would contact HI directly. I'd give them a chance to fix it. If they were unable to fix my knife, or provide me with a satisfactory replacement, then I'd ask for a refund.

    Honestly, I'm more mellow than most people, and I have lots of experience with Uncle Bill and HI, including a quick replacement. So perhaps it's not unreasonable for Geoffrey (?) to ask for a refund immediately. Note to you, if you read this - try and get a good HI, either by exchange or letting someone with more experience sharpen it. It was a bit premature to look for cash. I hope you join the Cantina and learn lots more about knives in general and khuks in particular. Obviously, you've ruffled some feathers, but it's forgiveable.

    In the end, I would ask for the blade back. You can't give a refund site-unseen, or I could call up and say all my HI blades failed catestrophically, and I want n dollars back. If it is an HI, and there is something wrong, he deserves a refund. If it's still in saleable condition, he should get a refund - not on merit, but because it builds good will without significantly taxing HI. If he's just fishing for cash, it's pretty pathetic to return a $50 blade to get it, especially since shipping will eat up a decent fraction of that.

    The fish is that he didn't mention contacting the seller. That should be the first recourse. Props to Dan and others for taking the HI warranty upon their own shoulders.
    mPisi likes this.
  12. Eric_425


    Sep 21, 2002
    Out of curiosity, what was the previous situation that caused HI to be burned by second hand owners, causing them to decide to only warranty original owners?
  13. Svashtar

    Svashtar Gold Member Gold Member

    Dec 28, 2003
    I'm not an expert and certainly don't have the history others do here, but I think it was guys buying up blems and daily best buys and then occassionally selling them off. The new owners would then either tear them up or complain about them to Uncle Bill and then want a new knife in exchange. Or, not a blem but the same situation where the knife is not at all in the condition in which it was sold and the 3rd owner wants to trade it in for a new one.

    Seems there is always someone who will try and take advantage of someone else's kind heart and good nature and willingness to stand by their product, and this was happening to Uncle Bill.

    Because of their "NO BS" lifetime warranty I buy reloading and range equipment exclusively from Dillon Precision in Scottsdale AZ, but even they will not honor ANY problem from a second hand owner.

    As long as you are the original purchaser though, they will replace anything that is broken or lost even if it was clearly the users fault, with no questions asked.


  14. Daniel Koster

    Daniel Koster www.kosterknives.com Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Oct 18, 2001
    That's exactly the reason in this case, Norm.

    A sale is a sale, whether by company or person-to-person. The seller is the person who makes the guarantee, regardless of origin.
  15. Eric_425


    Sep 21, 2002
    So somebody bought the khuks, then sold it, and the other person broke it, and asked for a return? When did this happen? I guess I don't really see the difference if the original owner tears it up, or if the second owner does? I do see a difference if HI isn't be able to keep track of who has the knives through the reselling process, and if the broken knife is really their own?

    Edit- so I don't sound like a loony, I definately don't think HI should give a refund for something like this. I'm meaning the question in regard to warranteeing the knife itself against breakage.
  16. Kismet

    Kismet Basic Member Basic Member

    Jan 30, 2002
    I think the contract is between the seller and the initial buyer of the product.

    Once the product is re-sold, a new contract is established, and any product liability passes to the new seller, should the new contract include such terms.
  17. Eric_425


    Sep 21, 2002
    So the thing is that the warranty is on us, and not the knife? As in, it's not the knife itself that is unconditionally guaranteed against defect/breakage, but the buyer is unconditionally guaranteed not to break it?
  18. Kismet

    Kismet Basic Member Basic Member

    Jan 30, 2002
    No. I must not have been clear.

    If two people make an agreement, they set certain terms, in this case, that H.I. guarantees the blade to the purchaser.

    The purchaser can not extend a legal obligation BACK to H.I. if he resells the product. He is establishing a new contract, and new terms.

    By selling the product, it is up to him to warantee or not.

    Sorry for any confusion.
  19. Yvsa


    May 18, 1999
    Not exactly. People were buying blems and other discounted knives and then selling them for whatever reason.
    Then the person who bought it second hand would trash the knife and either want a full refund on, or a, non-blem replacement.
    Since there is a lot of difference in price between a blem and a top of the line khuk it wasn't cost effective for Uncle Bill to continue to warranty the knives past the original owner.
    I would've done the same.
  20. Thomas Linton

    Thomas Linton

    Jun 16, 2003
    Try, HI promises the original owner that the knife is unconditionally guaranteed for the life of that owner. The promise is not made to any other person, and no other person has standing to claim the benefit of the guarantee.

    What is reasonable when faced with: "Dear Mr. Martino. I bought this kukri from a guy named Joe. I don't know where he bought it. I'm not happy with it. I notice it has a crack (It has rust. The handle is cracked. It's top heavy. I can't sharpen it. It pinches my hand. The scabbard it too tight/loose.) so I would like a refund or a new kukri." ?
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