Updates on new Buck made Remingtons?

pinnah said:
afishhunter, I'm a purist when it comes to traditional knives. IMO, a traditional knife becomes fake in some way when it is no longer produced by the country or culture that gave rise to the pattern. The Bowie knife is a very American pattern and Sheffield England has a deep rich culture of producing cutlery but the early Sheffield made Bowies made for inexpensive import into the US market were, IMO, very much less authentic from a Bowie knife made in the US. I feel the same way about SAKs made in Pakistan, or Opinels made in Spain.

IMO, the imported Buck slip joints are on par with Rough Riders and Taylor-made Schrades. I should note that the general construction quality of all of these imported brands is fairly high. But an imported stockman or canoe... It's just sad for me to see, regardless of whether it says Buck or Schrade on it.

Note, I have no problem with non-traditional knives being made outside of their country of origin. The modern flipper and liner/frame locks and many fixed blades... they are non-traditional international type designs and like a refrigerator, could be made anywhere in the world. That said, Buck's modern imported knives (like the Selkirks) don't have the BOS heat treatment. The BOS heat treatment can't be simultaneously something that makes a US Buck better than other 420HC knives and at the same time, something that doesn't matter when it comes to an imported Buck.

Baker is managing the distinction between the German made Bokers and the imported Bokers with the Boker+ brand. In this way, a "real" Boker remains real.

I want my traditional Bucks to be made in the US and IMO, Buck should be competing with Case and GEC in the slip joint market. If they want to compete with Taylor-Schrade and RoughRider, I would rather see them do that under the Remington brand name.
Click to expand...

In my opinion the Buck imported move and Remington lends mixed feelings...

*I give props to Camillus for their work on both Remington and Buck traditional knives.They put a lot more work into those knives than Buck themselves as years went by.Getting Buck to polish the anvil and hammer emblem and on their blades on their 301 is an arm twist of a request...they just won't do it on their slipjoints.

*Buck's imported knives I think would be fairer to judge if they were formerly USA models to compare them to.China lets them tap into delivering more for their Select Series from design they just can't make work at $25 on USA made.Think about it just for a second and think how many people these days would pay $60 for a 365 Trigger model 'as is' in 420HC?...weak selling potential here at the price.On the packaging Buck claims the Chinese harden the steel to 58rc.If this hardness is below what's stated then shame on Buck for lying to sell more knives.Buck's QC flaws on their Select line has fallen in tune with China manufacturing so there's no real 'identity' here.
 
Last edited:
Makael said:
There is no mention of a Buck 110 headed to offshore production except your post. Im not sure why you would suggest it. If your current in your Buck knowledge you would know Buck has been reeling back overseas made product to USA.

DID YOU MISS THE PART OF THE 300 LINE BEING REVAMPED?
Click to expand...

I mention it as a hypothetical to make a point. I'm a purist. I would never buy an imported Buck 110 made with 420J2. I would be frustrated with Buck if they made one. I feel the same way about their imported slip joints. IMO, traditional patterns should be made in their own country, otherwise they are no longer "traditional". And IMO, Buck should just never make a knife (other than a dive knife, perhaps) out of 420J2.

Here is Knarfang's take on 420J2. His description is consistent with most reporting on 420J2 and with my (limited but bad) experience with it.
What about 420J2 stainless steel?

I once purchased a Buck Canoe for a buddy for Christmas. After he had it for a while, I asked him about it and he said, "The steel is pretty soft and it doesn't hold an edge compared to my Chive." My buddy was dead right. 420J2 is an inferior steel and the impression my buddy has of current Bucks is that of being trinkets. He much prefers Kershaws because he's had great experiences with his Leeks and Chives.

IMO, if Buck is going to be producing knives with 420J2, they do so under another brand name like, say, Remington.
 
Last edited:
Frotier76 said:
*Buck's imported knives I think would be fairer to judge if they were formerly USA models to compare them to.China lets them tap into delivering more for their Select Series from design they just can't make work at $25 on USA made.Think about it just for a second and think how many people these days would pay $60 for a 365 Trigger model 'as is' in 420HC?...weak selling potential here at the price.On the packaging Buck claims the Chinese harden the steel to 58rc.If this hardness is below what's stated then shame on Buck for lying to sell more knives.Buck's QC flaws on their Select line has fallen in tune with China manufacturing so there's no real 'identity' here.
Click to expand...

Much truth here.

Couple of things....

1) Not all of the imported knives are 420HC hardened at 58Rc. The slipjoints are 420J2, which maxes out around 55Rc. IMO, Buck shouldn't be importing 420J2 knives under the Buck brand name. I would have no problem with Buck doing this under the Remington label. All it would mean is that the brand name Remington has become just another retreaded and empty brand name like Camillus, Schrade and Marbles, all of which used to be icons of US knife making and now are just marketing lip stick put on imported knives.

2) I can tolerate Buck importing knives under the Buck brand name so long as they aren't traditional patterns, as (since I'm a purist) I see Buck's traditional patterns as being core to their brand identity. I wouldn't want to buy a Victorinox made in Slovenia. Nothing against the Slovak knife industry. I've no doubt they make fine knives, but it just wouldn't be a "real" Victorinox in a meaningful way. In the same way, I don't consider an imported Buck slip joint as a real Buck. I have much less issue with Buck making the Trigger, the (non-traditional) Selkirks, or for that matter, the Vantage and Spitfires overseas.

3) Regarding the Chinese 420HC being hardened to 58Rc, Buck and we, are forced to speak out of both sides of our mouth. If we say that US-based BOS heat treatment is superior to other heat treatment, then we are forced to say that the Chinese heat treatment is not the same as the better BOS heat treatment. But if we say that the imported Chinese 420HC is just as good as the BOS heat treatment, then having BOS heat treat on the US made knives is nothing special. Perhaps Buck should just drop the marketing of BOS heat treat. I mean, if its no better than generic imported 420HC, what's the point?
 
I agree. what's the point?:)

New stuff coming..... The past is the past.
 
I guess to be a real "purist" a person should only buy knives of a "traditional" pattern that have the blade steels used in the 1950s, 1940s and earlier.
 
The Remington 532 for 2019 is made in Post Falls Idaho anyway.
 
bertl said:
I guess to be a real "purist" a person should only buy knives of a "traditional" pattern that have the blade steels used in the 1950s, 1940s and earlier.
Click to expand...

Case and GEC sell a lot of traditional patterned knives with 1095 steel to people who think exactly that.

But that's not the point I was making. IMO (and I'm sure I'm in the minority), traditional knives should be made in the country that traditionally produced them. A US or German made Laguiole knife makes no sense to me. Neither does a Chinese-made stockman or canoe.

Question: would you buy an imported Buck 110 and if not, why not?

Aside: 50's vintage "surgical steel" stainless was horrible and 420J2 is a good approximation of that.
 
I understand the thought of having a connection between companies, but there is no freaking way I would want to represent Remington which was a company who fooled people for the last 40 years saying that a trigger design was safe knowing that it wasn't and then crying about it when they had to recall hundreds of thousands of guns.

Not to mention quality fails with non 700 models. The company has slid downhill for a while. I regret buying a 700 and will sell it first chance I can.

So knife focused aging a.new Buck always appeals to me but not a Remington Buck
 
bertl said:
I guess to be a real "purist" a person should only buy knives of a "traditional" pattern that have the blade steels used in the 1950s, 1940s and earlier.
Click to expand...

For a Buck purist that would be true. To be a real knife purist you'd have to go back to knapped Flint and sinew. Lol!

I don't like modern designs with very few exeptions. I hate recurve blades, and try not to buy anything foreign made.

With all that said, I have to be in the minority, and Buck has to do what it has to do to survive.

Case makes traditional knives in the US, and sells at a high price point. Buck can easily make a better knife and sell them for less.

If someone handles a Chinese knife or worse breaks one, they see the brand name, not the country of origin.

IMHO, for long term success a company has to be careful what they put their name on. One "Oh crap" wipes out a thousand "at a boy's"
 
pinnah said:
IMO, if Buck is going to be producing knives with 420J2, they do so under another brand name like, say, Remington.
Click to expand...

Buck does not own the Remington brand name....
Buck is making knives for Remington....
As Makael has said before... it is Remington's call, not Bucks.

Buy a cheap knife then complain it's a cheap knife... huh?
There is something in Bucks product line for everyone...high end and low...
 
Yo Mama said:
I understand the thought of having a connection between companies, but there is no freaking way I would want to represent Remington which was a company who fooled people for the last 40 years saying that a trigger design was safe knowing that it wasn't and then crying about it when they had to recall hundreds of thousands of guns.

Not to mention quality fails with non 700 models. The company has slid downhill for a while. I regret buying a 700 and will sell it first chance I can.

So knife focused aging a.new Buck always appeals to me but not a Remington Buck
Click to expand...

Sorry to go off topic but thanks for that... I have a 700 in my safe and wasn’t aware of the recall so I’m going to check later.

Back on topic, I would love to see some old traditional pattern bullet knives made.
 
Buck is doing a great job bringing everything back in house. Reading some of these one would think Buck is doing the opposite. Not every knife has to represent something from 50 or more years ago. New great models puts money in Bucks pockets. These new slim models are modern, well received and has brought new customers into the family. They are receiving tons of orders. Who knows how many variations we will see of that model. Buck is well aware that made in the USA is very important.

The new Remington model in the store is a 532 model. Gorgeous knife made in the USA. If the Xmas sale wasn't so close I would of picked one up.
 
Wharn said:
Sorry to go off topic but thanks for that... I have a 700 in my safe and wasn’t aware of the recall so I’m going to check later.

Back on topic, I would love to see some old traditional pattern bullet knives made.
Click to expand...

Good you checked man! They will cover shipping and it wasn't more than a 2 week wait. I'm still pissed they force you to take the optics off. I was bullseye at 200 yards and now I need time to go sight in again.
 
Makael said:
Buck is doing a great job bringing everything back in house. Reading some of these one would think Buck is doing the opposite. Not every knife has to represent something from 50 or more years ago. New great models puts money in Bucks pockets. These new slim models are modern, well received and has brought new customers into the family. They are receiving tons of orders. Who knows how many variations we will see of that model. Buck is well aware that made in the USA is very important.

The new Remington model in the store is a 532 model. Gorgeous knife made in the USA. If the Xmas sale wasn't so close I would of picked one up.
Click to expand...

Many things to state in response to those statements...

*A very effective approach for knife manufacturers has been to create a subsidiary brand to separate a quality gap between the host brand from it's subsidiary that makes imported knives .Schrade's use of the Imperial brand overseas in the late 80's is a good example.Buck Knives slapping their name on the imported stuff and the whole 420HC (on some models) heat treatment mess blurs the lines to consumers.Buck has also been using China on their label since 2007.

*All Remington would have to do is contract Sanrenmu to make their knives for them...they don't really need Buck at all.Taking into account how absorbed the Remington name has been on the imported side for a good while now.

*There's nothing wrong with Buck coming up with 110's and 119's and so forth in different handle materials and steel grades.But they're really just making variants of the same models which says they aren't expanding as far as designs.Buck's already been down this road with their 422 and 442, Bucklite's,the Ecolite Series, to their 560 Titanium handled finger grooved 110.I'm not saying ditch their old models but they had some progressive designs 15+ years ago...they seem bored now as a knife brand.

"New stuff coming"..yeah I'm thrilled:rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
a 532? nice. brought back from the dead. always liked the 532s. prefer buck labeled ones but Remington is good enough.

any pics of this green 532...is it green bone or wood or...?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top