Utilitarian, Aesthetics, & Art - Where is the line?

KBA

KBA

Joined
Apr 27, 2014
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So, imo there are three types of knives, and this is subjective of course.

1. A knife that is a utilitarian tool – One that simply does what is supposed to do, cut. Aesthetics are not considered a primary, or even in some cases a secondary reason, for the knife.

2. A knife that is aesthetically appealing but still will be used.

3. A knife that has become, more than a safe queen. It has become a piece of art that will be displayed and never used.

Putting price aside, even though I am sure it will be brought up, where is the line between the aesthetically pleasing user, that could be a safe queen to some, and the safe queen that could be considered more art, even though it is a knife?

I see several knives that are just to "pretty" to be real users in my opinion. I look at them and just think, “Wow, that is amazing, but I would never use that.”

So where is that line for you?
 
marcinek said:
The line is wherever you want. No one else can decide that for another.
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Not only this, but I find it hard to express. The Sebenza is a great knife, but I like the aesthetic of the humble Opinel better and I would certainly use either one, so it doesn't necessarily correlate to price, either. There are certainly knives out there that I couldn't bring myself to use and would proudly display, but even for myself I couldn't say where that exact line is.
 
marcinek said:
The line is wherever you want. No one else can decide that for another.
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Agreed.

The only thing I will add is the term "Art Knife", where makers build knives with the intent of being a piece of art. That still doesn't mean they can't be used though. There are people here that are scared to scratch up their $80 folder, and others that use the hell out of a $1000 folder.

Edit: Where is that line for me? I don't draw a line, I use anything I buy. No matter how artistic it is, if it has a functional shape I will use it.

Art Knives:
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This is a deep issue, because many guys will buy a higher end knife because of its high tech features or general blingy-ness, and then try to convince themselves or others that it actually cuts stuff better. "If you have to ask, you wouldn't understand." And then arguments and general grumpiness ensue.

I'm into most any kind of knife except an art knife. They are fun to look at online, but I would never want one. They just don't do it for me. The great majority of my knives are in the sub-$140 utilitarian category, with a few bling-ers just because. I've been drawn into the CRK and Busse worlds, but I'm almost embarrassed about it.

The only knives I own but would never use are multiples of knives that I do use. For example, I like the blue Kershaw Blur so much that I bought 2x of them. One to carry, and the other to hoard. Same with several other knives, like the blue/purple Para 2 and orange Military. I buy one to carry and another to make me feel good. So the few knives that I don't carry are not art knives or spendy knives, but limited editions or knives that I think may go out of production one day.
 
Damn, BB - I was close to writing that you use your customs (because of your response in that 'mud thread', but didn't want to speak for you).. lol
 
bld522 said:
Right. And, of course, life's too short to carry an ugly knife. :)
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I'd have to disagree, to a point. I have a soft spot for ugly knives. Pitting, patina, etc. I think some knives become better looking with wear, and flaws.

Now, that said, the firm and shape of the underlying knife must still be appealing to me. No amount of age and rust will make a knife I find visually distasteful become eye pleasing.



To the OP, I really only have one knife that is not a user. It is a custom I got when I was 12? Made by my Uncle Glenn Hornby. He passed away decades ago, and I can't really replace it. It has never been used. Though that may change some day. I've been able to aquire another which I passed on to my brother. I've missed a one other I wanted, but did not have the funds to secure until it was gone.


There are definitely knives I see and think...."art" but not usefull, or at least not a user.

There are a lot of knives that others would consider art knives that I would carry, and gently use if I had the means.
 
Just in general:

Agreed, a line is where one decides it to be. I am not trying to create a line and have others agree. This is a subjective concept. My most prized knife is a traditional pattern that has family attachment.

I am just asking where that line is for you all. For me, I would love to own an original katana, Abraham Lincolns pocket knife, an original Roman or Spartan sword, or other forms of historical knives, but I wouldn't use them. I would display them making the knife, sword, or whatever more an art piece. I love the history of it.

At the same time there are several makers out there that produce amazing pieces that I consider more art than tool. While they could be used, and probably function well, I would preserve to the original state of it as an art piece changing the original meaning of the knife to what I wanted.

I do not collect so I will never have "knife art" but there are several out there that can see beauty in the creation of something and want to preserve that.

This is a subjective topic. I'm just curious I suppose on what you all consider "knife art"?
 
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The line for me is will it cut well or is it all show and no go? If it cuts well I could care less how cool/pretty/utilitarian it is. If it doesn't make the cut it's not a good knife.
 
I know that there are people on this forum who buy knives for art, and I agree that many of the knives shown are very intricate and show tremendous talent, but I would never buy a knife primarily as art. I like my knives to be beautiful and functional and only like having knives that I am ok with using (based almost purely on price).

I prefer books and old maps for my art/safe queen category, where my knives, flashlights, and (slowly) watches become personal tools that have meaning to me.

I like Blues Bender's style of use, but I am still easing into the category of >$500 knives and lights and >$300 watches. With some time, I am sure I will probably get there, but I am pretty happy with where I am.
 
KBA said:
I am just asking where that line is for you all. For me, I would love to own an original katana, Abraham Lincolns pocket knife, an original Roman or Spartan sword, or other forms of historical knives, but I wouldn't use them. I would display them making the knife, sword, or whatever more an art piece. I love the history of it.
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I picture your 3 categories in the following way:

1. A knife that is a utilitarian tool: Opinel, SAK, Leatherman, or any knife that does what a knife should do.

2. A knife that is aesthetically appealing but still will be used: Something like a Sebenza; its refined, tried-and-true, but many of us know they are extremely expensive for a pocket knife and don't offer a tremendous advantage over more traditional (and cheaper) designs (category #1). The same goes for many of the modern (and expensive) folders of "today".

3. A knife that has become, more than a safe queen. It has become a piece of art {or a treasured keepsake}: Art Knives (subjective), historical pieces, sentimental pieces, etc.

I don't really think of something like Abraham Lincolns knife as a piece of art, I think it's more special than that. I could never bring myself to use such a piece. Thus the reason I added a small change to category 3.
 
These makers covered all bases, imo. Hartsfield, Moran, Dozier, Loveless, Busse. These are off the top of my head. There are more makers in this group.
All gorgeous knives, designed to be used.
rolf
 
As someone with an art degree
AHEM
I'm going to go ahead and say that, for me, the most beautiful and artful knife is one which functions well, and I also regard the simplicity of the execution with merit. I do not consider "art knives" tasteful, regardless of how much skill they convey. They can be interesting, though.
 
Truly efficient designs bred for high performance generally carry something that I like to refer to as "functional beauty", which is a beauty gained exclusively from the way that its every feature is there for the purpose of optimizing the tool for its intended context. It is often possible to integrate decorative embellishments or aesthetic consideration into high-function designs, but you take the step into that "aesthetics" tier when one or more design considerations are made for aesthetic improvement at a minor detriment to contextual function. You reach the realm of art knives when the functional considerations rank lower than the aesthetic concerns to such a degree that performance as a tool is significantly affected for the worse.
 
an art knife is one that looks as though it has absolutely no functionality to use besides display. the line between aesthetically pleasing and shelf knife i guess to some is wether it was bought because it was a good deal at the price while looking good compared to looking good but not worth the price for quality. example: a knife with lets say aus 8 looks appealing and is say $50 to many would be a knife for use but some may still display as a shelf knife whereas a $100 knife with 4cr14 that looks amazing would be solely a shelf knife/art knife
 
The line for me is just about price, not any of the other stuff mentioned. The really exotic, artsy type custom knives are just more money than I would want to spend. I certainly wouldn't turn one down if if it was given to me and I do appreciate the work that goes into some of the stuff out there. I wouldn't mind owning one and adding it to the collection and keeping it only as a safe queen. I just can't justify spending that amount of money on one.

I own enough knives that I pretty much have all the function I want. Most of my purchases now are simply because I came across something new or unique that peaks my interest and it doesn't cost an arm and a leg.
 
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