Vanguard

Most likely 420HC. If not, then it's 425 "modified". I'm not sure what year Buck changed over. Jeff or Joe would know.

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Dennis Wright
Wright Knife & Sporting Goods
(Buy a gun....Piss off a liberal!)
La Mesa, Kalifornica
wrightknife@ixpres.com

 
Thanks for the info. Any opinions about this blade? How it stacks up against the new "designer label" steels?

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I don't want my children fed or clothed by the state, but I would prefer THAT to their being educated by the state.


[This message has been edited by Uncle Bill (edited 24 August 1999).]
 
Hmmm, don't know when Buck switched over.

Bill, if by "designer steels", you mean steels like BG-42 and 420V, then 420HC doesn't stack up to them. When choosing their mass production steel, Buck's first requirement is that the steel be fine blank-able (is that a word?), which limits their choices somewhat. When Buck wanted to come out with a premium line, note that they switched to BG-42 for enhanced performance, and had to completely change their production methods for that line of knives. Buck is probably also putting rust resistance high on their requirements.

I'm not necessarily saying 420HC is terrible, just that steels like 420V are in another league.

Anyone know what make a steel capable of being fine blanked? Medium-Low (.4%-.6%) carbon content?


Joe
 
What does it mean to "fine blank" and why does this requirement for mass production mean the steel has to be of lower quality?

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I don't want my children fed or clothed by the state, but I would prefer THAT to their being educated by the state.
bbryant@houghton.edu

 
My impression was that "fine blanking" is to cut the blade form out of sheet stock with steel cutting dies. If the blade alloy is too tough in its anealed state it rapidly wipes out the cutting dies. You are looking for cutting die friendly alloys. When you put toughening elements in your knife alloy you make it hard to stamp out. I would hope that they could slip in some extra vanadium and a pinch of carbon at least.

By the way, if you like the Vanguard and want to get a "super bladed" version try the model with Buckcote. It is harder than any steel and cuts well.
 
In order to be fine blanked the steel needs to be under 1% carbon. Otherwise the dies don't last and the shapes can come out ragged. 425 modified only had .54% carbon. 420HC is closer to the 1% level, but I don't know for sure how much.

Buck makes up for the lower carbon content, a little, by cryogenic treatment of the blades. I don't know for sure what method they use, but they have a BIG tank of liquid nitrogen in back of the plant. Cryo treating the steel can improve the wear resistance and toughness of the steel, particularly the stainless steels.

You're right about the corrosion resistance. It is better than ATS34 & some of the others due to the lower carbon content. It isn't a bad steel though, especially for the price.

You are also right about the Buckcote. That process really works. It makes the blade act as if it were a Rockwell 90, or thereabouts, except it isn't so hard to sharpen if and when you might need to. Used properly a Buckcote edge will outlast almost any steel available. Good stuff.

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Dennis Wright
Wright Knife & Sporting Goods
(Buy a gun....Piss off a liberal!)
La Mesa, Kalifornica
wrightknife@ixpres.com

 
Buck started using the 420HC alloy in 1994. The cheaper 420 alloys (sometimes called 420J) is about .35% carbon. The 420HC is .45% to .55%.
 
The 1994 Vanguard would be of 420HC which has the same carbon range as 425mod (around .5). The main differance between 425mod and 420HC is that the 425 mod has Moly.

Jeff

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Jeff "Without data it's just another opinion" Hubbard
Operations Manager
OEM Mfg / Inserts International

Jeff@oemmfg.com


 
...Have a cup o warm milk there Trax...That message about the "test" was posted almost 6 years ago or so...:D :rolleyes: :p
 
kic said:
at least now i can beat the crap out of it in the field
and i wont feel sorry for him at all.
Cheers
Click to expand...

I like the way you think! :thumbup:
It's interesting to me that my knives with better steel are babied more by me. Short of using a knife as a hammer, the ones that are "4anything" steel are used more on a regular basis for horrendous horrors that would bring tears to any staunch admirer of Buck. Interesting since I guess my mindset should be that the better steel can take a better pounding.
Goose.
BCCI 1190
 
Goose,
If it makes you feel any better, I have an S30V 110 that I use for everyday use regardless of the job.
Mike
 
Mike Kerins said:
Goose,
If it makes you feel any better, I have an S30V 110 that I use for everyday use regardless of the job.
Mike
Click to expand...

It's that "similar mindset" ticking again...

After my post I took my Alaskan S30V that I had on a display stand and put it in my JBWoods horizontal. I'm gonna be using that combination platter for the next few weeks.

Got the 110FG NS BG-42 Walnut from ZZTop propped on the display stand of my desk now. I put a big ass thumb print on the front bolster so I can report back to Professor Trax on my homework experiment of tarnishing of the NiAg (or however you *kneeks spell it).

Goose.

*Kneek = Goosespeak for KNife gEEK kine peeps
 
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