Vantage pro vs select

justtheedge said:
Plumberdv...REALLY???!!!
You come across as a bully...making the guy bow down to you and all..
Thanks for your experience mbjannush. I understand exactly what you are saying...(without micro managing what you said). This is not a legal terminology class so I figured out what you meant very easily.
I got the jist...now can we get back on to the OP's question?
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Not to stir the pot more, but a fact is not always true. A fact can in fact be false. Data that is proven wrong does not turn to opinion when proven wrong, it is still a fact the same as when it was originally presented. Most people do not understand that and think fact means truth. The difference between fact and opinion is simply stated in terms of whether the statement can be proven true or false. You cannot prove an opinion true or false but a fact you can.

BTW, I say go for S30V and get that "premium steel." Although I personally do not consider it much of a premium, but more of the best all-rounder. It excels at nothing, but lacks nothing. It is not that hard to sharpen, I have never seen any rust spots, and it will cut plenty of cardboard in my experience. Enjoy my opinions, and hope that helps.
 
nccole said:
Not to stir the pot more, but a fact is not always true. A fact can in fact be false. Data that is proven wrong does not turn to opinion when proven wrong, it is still a fact the same as when it was originally presented. Most people do not understand that and think fact means truth. The difference between fact and opinion is simply stated in terms of whether the statement can be proven true or false. You cannot prove an opinion true or false but a fact you can.

BTW, I say go for S30V and get that "premium steel." Although I personally do not consider it much of a premium, but more of the best all-rounder. It excels at nothing, but lacks nothing. It is not that hard to sharpen, I have never seen any rust spots, and it will cut plenty of cardboard in my experience. Enjoy my opinions, and hope that helps.
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Please re-read the later portion of post #10, the definition of fact. The Pot doesn't need to be stirred.
 
mbjannusch said:
Please re-read the later portion of post #10, the definition of fact. The Pot doesn't need to be stirred.
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Those are true definitions, but when grammatically comparing fact vs. opinion I am right in what I said. It is a grammatical issue , not a definition of the word issue here. A fact, when deciding whether a statement is fact or opinion can be true or false, and it does not matter when deciding whether it is a fact or opinion. I can give you false facts all day, but they are still facts. Opinions have no data to support them, they are just one's data-unsupported viewpoint. There is more to this than just copying and pasting definitions, look up fact vs. opinion and maybe you can find something that explains it better than I can. I am not intending to stir the pot, just trying to clarify a common misconception many people have.
 
mbjannusch said:
I have found S30V more difficult to sharpen than 420Hc and it rusts quickly when fishing on the ocean. 13C26 rusts in as quick a time as S30V.
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In your comparisons, I didn't notice any mention of how or with what abrasives you use to sharpen your knives. I would be curious to know, as for harder steels, diamond is faster and superior to stones which work great on 420HC.

In my experience, BG42 and ATS34 can be sharpened with stones, but diamond takes a fraction of the time. I don't have experience with S30V to relate, but I suspect it is the same scenario.

Peter
 
nccole said:
A fact, when deciding whether a statement is fact or opinion can be true or false, and it does not matter when deciding whether it is a fact or opinion. I can give you false facts all day, but they are still facts.
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Which is why I never deal in opinions or facts, but exclusively in factoids (which can be the same as facts, but are never as stiff and pretentious as facts, being instead more friendly, amusing, likeable and relaxed while still being weightier than mere opinion).

(Of course, that is just my opinion.)
 
"From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia,:

A factoid is a questionable or spurious (unverified, false, or fabricated) statement presented as a fact, but with no veracity. The word can also be used to describe a particularly insignificant or novel fact, in the absence of much relevant context.[1] The word is defined by the Compact Oxford English Dictionary as "an item of unreliable information that is repeated so often that it becomes accepted as fact"." :) :thumbup:
 
Plumberdv said:


A factoid is a questionable or spurious (unverified, false, or fabricated) statement presented as a fact, but with no veracity. The word can also be used to describe a particularly insignificant or novel fact, in the absence of much relevant context.[1] The word is defined by the Compact Oxford English Dictionary as "an item of unreliable information that is repeated so often that it becomes accepted as fact"." :) :thumbup:
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That's the early definition, Dave.

I use the second, more modern and more commonly accepted definition: 2. A brief, somewhat interesting fact.

...Usage Note: The -oid suffix normally imparts the meaning "resembling, having the appearance of" to the words it attaches to. Thus the anthropoid apes are the apes that are most like humans (from Greek anthrpos, "human being"). In some words -oid has a slightly extended meaning"having characteristics of, but not the same as..."

And just to help you understand yourself, PlumberD.......what you wrote is called an "Irrelevant Bullying Propagandoid."

:D
 
Where it is fact or not he is sharing his experiences which is always good. Im starting to wonder if I got diamond stones for my s30v vantage how much easier it would be to sharpen. Also salt water isnt really an issue for me as far as rust would go but the person in question beats the hell outta everything he owns and he does own diamond stones so would that make an s30v just as easy to sharpen as 420hc? So aside from salt water is the s30v just as tough as 420hc is?
 
Hey Patrick, I for one am in the likes S30V camp. I don't find it particularly hard to sharpen. It responds well to stropping. And in my personal experience it holds a working edge longer than 420hc.
If your freind has diamond stones I'm assuming he is a bit of a knife nut like the rest of us around here. If he doesn't already have an S30V blade the Vantage is a great platform to give this steel a go. If he, or you wanted to do some side by side usage caparisons a 420hc Vantage could be got later for pretty reasonable money.
My Vantage has been carried here in NC where it's hot and humid and I've noticed no rust issues whatsoever...
Hope he likes whichever you choose :)

adding this pic of a useage shot...this is a small oak tree I cut down and used my Vantage to de-bark and thin down the wood to make a cane...
it only needed a light touch up afterwards...YMMV...


IMG_0600.jpg
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"Where it is fact or not he is sharing his experiences which is always good."

That I totally agree with.:)

I won't present myself as an expert in sharpening, in fact far from it but I do have some experience with using the diamond sticks for the Sharpmaker. I've yet to have an S30V blade get dull enough to need a diamond stone, I did have an occasion to touch one up with the fine white sticks. Recently my brother and I spent a good portion of the morning emptying his storage unit and cutting up tons of cardboard storage and moving boxes to fit in the recycle bin. My Vantage Pro showed very little if any dulling afterwards but I hit it a few licks on the Sharpmaker's white fine sticks and it was as sharp as the factory edge in a short time.

I have used the diamond sticks to sharpen a new and duller than a butter knife Queen folder with D2 blades. The diamond sticks did a great job getting a good edge started which I finished off with the medium and then the fine sticks. Same thing with a very dull vintage 121 with 440C that I bought recently.

I see no reason to believe that the diamond stones wouldn't work equally as well on dull S30V. If I ever get one dull enough that the medium or fine stones won't restore it, I'll report my opinion of how the diamond sticks work on S30V.
 
PatrickKnight said:
I already own a pro and love it to death, but a friend of mine loves my vantage so much i want to get him one for his birthday. I would assume my pro would hold and edge longer and stand up more to chips and things like that but im curious as to which would be more durable in terms of standing up to rust and things of that nature and help would be awesome.
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Patrick......I think what it might all come down to is this.

If I were you, I'd want to give him exactly the same knife as the one I own.

He'd probably feel best about that as well.

If he's a good friend......he's worth it.

:)
 
I use a GATCO diamond system with a ceramic finishing hone, and S30V sharpens about as quickly and easily as anything else. I do not have any 420HC, but quite a few 8Cr13MoV blades. There is a slight noticable difference between the two with S30V feeling harder and taking a bit longer to sharpen. They only steel I found hard to sharpen was ZDP-189. I have it figured out now, but it was difficult at first because it is so hard.
 
'Hard to sharpen', is quite different from rebeveling. I've found that S30V takes a little more time to sharpen than 420HC which is a snap. Yet, the S30V blade holds an edge just about twice as long. The 420HC is a good stainless, easy to sharpen and holds an entry level edge. To rebevel S30V or 440C is a bear, not so with 420HC on diamond or SiC stones. So, its better to not allow them to get real dull and if you desire to change the bevel be prepared. Enjoy your Vantage. YMMV. DM
 
I like the way the Sandvik blade sounds on the stones and when being flipped open, it rings sometimes.
 
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