Vertical forge vs horizontal temps?

Will52100

Will52100

Joined
Dec 4, 2001
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Really getting tired of re working my forge lining after extended welding. The thing is, mine gets plenty hot even with heavily damaged lining for normal damascus work. But lately I've been screwing with wrought iron to wrought iron welding and unless the lining is in good shape it won't quite get hot enough. That lead me to thinking of finally building a vertical forge to save my liner.

My question is, will a vertical get as hot as a horizontal of equal size? Might be a dumb question, but only used a vertical forge once, and it was in pretty rough shape.

BTW, my current forge is blown, and if I build a vertical it will use the same blower gas injector.

Oh, and both would be propane.

Thanks.
 
There are a couple of castable refractory compounds you can use on the lower in place of a coated kaowool. Bubble alumina on top of any lining will help with the wear from flux. Also, if you're using borax, look into hydrocarbon flux... Several hydrocarbons make good flux that is much less damaging.

And yes, a vertical will get equally hot if not hotter and retain heat well... I am using one horozontal and building a second, personally due to form factor. My soon to be OKT partner who is a talented damascus and knife maker uses a vertical and swears by it. I use it as well and it does maintain temp very well and is very efficient. Materials selection plays a big part in efficiency...
 
Vertical will get as hot, it also does not have the hot spot often associated with horizontal forges. They are great for damascus work but I find it a pain to put a handle on everything that goes into the forge for general forging. Having both is nice.
 
Kinda what I thought, but wasn't sure and wanted to check before starting on a new build.

Now all I need to do is find a thick piece of 12" pipe and get busy.

Thanks
 
Drop by your local public works dept. They use pipe that diameter all the time and will usually have cut-off pieces that they have no use for... Sometimes they scrap em, but if you tell em what its for they will probably be impressed and intrigued enough to throw some your way... Might have to trade a blade or something. ;)


-Eric
 
My forge also see extensive use. I was always rebuilding it. I finally made a castable refractory forge. It's a verticle forge that is about 3" thick. It has held up well and once it gets to temp I can cut back on propane pressure. It got even more efficient when I stacked high temp bricks around it. I am going to build another forge that is 5" thick castable refractory.
Jim
 
You can also extend that heating zone of the 12" by splitting it lengthwise and welding in a web.



Here's a 12" that I have used for about 7 years. I've made piles of Damascus with it, and it's still as good as the day I built it.



I use the same blower in both:



This is at welding heat:



 
Thanks, and cool idea on splitting and extending the pipe, may have to do that.

I'd try public works around here, but "what public works?" I've got an idea where I can get the pipe cheap. Worst case I can always bend sheet steel and make my own.

Now to get busy, Thanks
 
Will52100 said:
Thanks, and cool idea on splitting and extending the pipe, may have to do that.

I'd try public works around here, but "what public works?" I've got an idea where I can get the pipe cheap. Worst case I can always bend sheet steel and make my own.

Now to get busy, Thanks
Click to expand...

All municipalities have a public works/streets and maintenance dept. As do most counties. They are the guys who fix the water mains, storm sewers, roads, streetlights, etc. I work for the govt so I am friends with a lot of them. Sometimes their grabage is good stuff for me.

Another good diameter pipe if you can find one is an old 100# propane tank. Just exacuate and purge the tank before you cut it.

-Eric
 
No reason to get "heavy" anything for the shell. Both my current forges have 20 gauge stainless shells. One is a vertical with five inches of brick the other a horizontal with 2.5 inches of castible. the horizontal get much hotter on the outside than the vertical but bot will melt steel on the inside.
 
Again, "what public works?" We do have county workers, but for the most part they are useless. One of the main reasons I have a well for my water. If i could figure out how to build a small nuclear reactor I'd get off the power lines as well. If we are lucky they come out once in a while and throw some tar and gravel in pot holes. Most of the roads around here are old gravel roads with pea gravel sprayed with tar.

Good idea on the propane tank, I'll see what I can find at the scrap yard.

What size do most recommend? I'm thinking a 12-14" diameter pipe, about 24" long. Probably use 2-3 layers of 1" wool.

Thanks
 
Sorry, our public works guys are a pretty talented and useful crew. Can't complain about any of our utilities and our roads are excellent. They use 12" diameter by 1/8" wall pipe for drainage culverts that run under a local trail (doesn't support much weight.) They always have scraps laying around is why I mentioned it...

Both of the cities I have worked for didn't contract any work out and did pretty much anything that involved keeping the city running. Sorry yours are not the same...

And like Bill said, light is fine. My current project is formed 16ga steel and is still overkill. It just needs to contain the refractory materials.
Cheers!
 
Well I found an old 25 gallon propane tank I'm going to use. After I take the valve out and rinse it out and put it in the burn pile to make sure there's no trapped propane left. It was my father's, and it's had a leak in it since I was a kid. He was going to take it too the scrap yard, but give it too me. Now just to get some more satanite and bubble alumina.
 
Will52100 said:
Well I found an old 25 gallon propane tank I'm going to use. After I take the valve out and rinse it out and put it in the burn pile to make sure there's no trapped propane left. It was my father's, and it's had a leak in it since I was a kid. He was going to take it too the scrap yard, but give it too me. Now just to get some more satanite and bubble alumina.
Click to expand...

Propane is a gas at atmospheric pressure. As long as there is no valve, and you purge it with argon or fill it with water you are good to go. Not like a gas can. No need to throw on the burn pile, and may even deform it.

-Eric
 
I hear you, but been through two explosions and burnt both times, after that I'm a little over cautious with fire.
 
Will52100 said:
I hear you, but been through two explosions and burnt both times, after that I'm a little over cautious with fire.
Click to expand...

No, I understand the over-cautiousness (not a word I don't think.. hah). I flash-banged a meth lab once (we didn't know before-hand). Was glad to be wearing Nomex gear...

And Karl, that is how every properly insulated and built forge should be. Thanks for sharing the pics...

Cheers!

-Eric
 
Och, never had quite THAT much excitement, kinda glad I didn't. As a kid a propane hot water heater and leaking gas lawnmower was bad enough.
 
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