VG-10 or ZDP-189 steel?

On youtube the knife reviewer "BLUNTTRUTH4U" just made a video about this very topic. It is a review of an Endura in ZDP that he bought.

He wished he had bought the VG-10 Endura and said that they hold an edge equally. The ZDP was harder to sharpen. He said the only bonus of ZDP was that it did not chip/fold when hitting staples in cardboard like VG-10 might.

It is just another data point for you. I dont have experience with ZDP.
 
First of all, ZDP-189 steel is not for a newbie, that's for sure.
Having said that, I love the ZDP-189, there is simply nothing better than a ZDP blade on the market right now. All my folders can split hair with ease and I never had a chipped ZDP blade. It is also true that they are not easy to sharpen with normal sharpening stones, diamond plate is a must, since the ZDP is by far the hardest steel on the market Rc66-68. Which also means it can take an acute edge that no other steel can even come close, I have read ppl sharpen them to 10-15" inclusive degrees, you simply can't do that with any other stainless steel. I usually keep my ZDP edge at around 20 inclusive degree and never have a single problem. I can sharpen my CPMD2 (my 2nd favorite) to 28 degree but the edge wouldn't last as long as the ZDP blades. VG-10 on the other hand, I have to keep the edge at 30+ inclusive degree or the edge simply can't last a good rough day of cutting thick card boxes. My ZDP blade can easily out last ANY other steel blade, while having a much more acute edge angle. The Pro's of VG-10 over ZDP-189 is the price, easier to sharpen (because the VG-10 is alot softer and wear faster), and rust resistance. So if you can get over the price difference, you are an experience sharpener (or belt sander), and you can treat your blades like tool steel blades, there is no reason to pick VG-10 over ZDP. ZDP is vastly superior they should not even be in the same comparison IMHO

I can understand why people don't like ZDP once they tried that on and Endura, the edge angle came completely off, there is simply NO WAY to re-profile Endura ZDP blade on sharpmaker stones. I've tried, took me 3000 strokes (I counted) on grey stone and the blade wasn't even close to worn a tiny bit. Even diamond plates took me a couple hours to reprofile it to around 30 degree inclusive. I gave up and used my belt sander instead. Caly3 ZDP is one of the best example to test the steel, the flat ground edge came less than 30 degrees from factory and once stropped at 20 degree (diamond paste), it is actually quite difficult to whittle hair because the hair was cut in half in air if you are not super careful and let the piece of hair to touch the edge a teeny to hard LOL
 
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Gadgetaholic said:
Well, thanks for the replies guys. I might get myself one of those Endura 4 VG-10 knives - it seems that it would be easier for me to maintain (less corrosion or staining, less difficult to sharpen) and a bit easier on the budget.

I'll be getting a plain blade - the serrated ones don't appeal to me. I don't think I'll go with the wave, it doesn't seem like something I need or even want and I don't really like the look either. The one I'm looking at is $66 and the shipping to New Zealand is very reasonable (quite a few of the places you guys buy from don't ship internationally). I have looked at quite a few knives and some I like are more than twice the price of the Endura4 - it seems like quite a bargain.

I might see if I can stretch my budget at some point to add a ZT0200 - that looks like a very nice knife, I like the look of the blade on it especially. For now a good folder and a good fixed blade should give me most of the utility I want for camping and whatever else I need/want a knife for.
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You are right. I admit the waved version looks butt-ugly. :D
 
I own the VG10 and ZDP189 versions of the Spyderco Calypso jr. I wanted to compare the two steels in order to use properly those two knives.

I've sharpened them the same way, about 10 degrees per side, microbevels at about 20 degrees per side (i sharpen freehand) on DMT diamond stones and a smooth fine ceramic stone (unknown grit), stroppping on leather loaded with chromium oxyde.

Grinding is harder for the ZDP189 than for the VG10 but the raise of the burrs is not more difficult. The VG10 gives a toothier edge at the same grit finish.

I've tested:

The wear resistance, by slicing a thick clean nylon rope. In a first time the toothy VG10 has been more efficient but its slicing ability decreased more quickly than the ZDP189 one. However it took me a while and a large length of rope to get this result.

The strength, by pushcutting (whitttling) a piece of seasoned hornbeam. I stopped when the VG10 edge began to roll. The ZDP189 was still sharp.

The toughness, by cutting stripes of a thick sandy cardboard. There it's the ZDP189 which dulled the first while the VG10 still bit the cardboard. No chipping which could be seen under X3,5 magnificence, just dulled.

I didn't make any specific test about the stain resistance, i yet knew the result by looking into the thumb hole: rust spots on the ZDP189, clean steel on the VG10.

No scientific measurements, just a bit of practice to get a more precise idea of the abilities of two steels i like a lot. I could say the ZDP189 is better but it's not so simple. The VG10 seems to me very well balanced, no strong points, no weak points, the kind of steel which could forgive awkwardises.

dantzk.
 
I've reserved ZDP for thin cutters. I'm getting ready to send Mr. Krein the last of my saber ground Delica ZDP's for thinning. VG 10 works great in both applications (extra thin and just plain thin ;)), ZDP is unbeatable for a super thin slicer, given the proper precautions.
 
T.K.C. said:
I very much like ZDP-189, but not in Spyderco knives. I had one of the Burgundy Caly 3's that had a ZDP-189 blade, and it chipped quite easily with general cutting. I have 3 ZDP-189 CUSTOM knives, and it ROCKS.
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Which custom knives do you have - I'm looking for a Good ZDP knife. I've looked at William Henry and Rockstead, but I'd like to see if there is something of outstanding quality somewhere in the $400 range. Have you looked at the G. Sakai Kitano Ultimate?
 
This is merely a guess but she probably has a Yuna knife in the mix. He is known for working with ZDP.
 
vg10 want hold an edge as long as 189 but it's more forgiving. vg10 is a very decent steel & will give you great service . i'm no expert but i consider 189 as an alloy to be used by experienced knifers.down the road you may want a 189 or even better some m4.
 
Just an update:
I have received my Endura 4 with VG-10 plain blade. It came nice and sharp and can slice through a tomato in a similar manner to a hot knife through soft butter. I like it - a very nice knife at a fair price. I think for my skill level at sharpening and with the sharpening equipment I have the VG-10 is the better choice. The ZDP-189 blades are best left to those that are experienced at sharpening and have diamond sharpeners, VG-10 is fine for the rest of us.
 
I think VG-10 is one of the best steels available. It can take an amazingly fine grained edge and its pretty easy to sharpen right back up. It also holds an edge really, really well. It's probably the best all-rounder I've had experience with.

ZDP on the otherhand, isn't as great of an all-rounder so I don't think it's too practical for everyday use.
 
I like the ZDP in my Kershaws. From what I know, they are the only company to do an in-house heat treat, and their ZDP-189 seems rather durable, specifically in the composite models.
 
I guess Im about to find out for myself on this one. I have an Endura VG-10 which is juuust about to make a trip to see Mr. Krein for a regrind. Santa, on the other hand, has strict instructions that a Blue FRN ZDP Stretch is to appear under the tree this year....er, so to speak haha.

When I finally have both in hand at one time, I'll do a basic comparo as I am want to do with virtually all my knives (cardboard, whittle cured hardwood, thick zip ties, sometimes 16ga copper wire baton depending on the intended use of the knife). I do have a full complement of Dia-Sharps and strops, I'll work on the ZDP knife till its where it ought to be for that steel. Obviously, coming back from Tom, the Endura will be as good as it ever will. We shall see. :D
 
BigAlVista said:
Which custom knives do you have - I'm looking for a Good ZDP knife. I've looked at William Henry and Rockstead, but I'd like to see if there is something of outstanding quality somewhere in the $400 range. Have you looked at the G. Sakai Kitano Ultimate?
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TKC has Yunas. I have a few also and they're great knives. Very tough.

Www.yunaknives.com
 
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