Vista OS

[Razzierb]

My Vista machine arrived and thus far I've found that there is no Vista driver for my Epson laser and for some reason my wireless network card is not compatible. I just don't have the time or patience to fuss with Vista until MS does some more development work and suppliers like Epson decide to support the OS. The other thing I'm not going to do is to spend MORE money for Vista compatiible hardware / network cards when all my current stuff works. The best Epson could do for me was to suggest I buy one of their 2 Vista compatible laser printers .. It was just far easier for me to phone up Dell and have them pick it up the Vista machine. As to that experience, once I described the compatibility issues, Dell agreed to the return with no restocking fee.

In my recent research regarding Vista, I've learned that Vista SP1 is on the immediate horizon (during the next few months). That will likely streamline some of the issues folks have been struggling with, but I'm going to wait for my next round of computers to move to Vista (assuming it's still around and hasn't gone the way of Win ME). In the mean time, I also learned that there is a Windows XP SP3 on the way during the first half of 2008, so MS intends to continue it's support of that product (at least for the forseeable future).

Razz

 

[Keencutter]

Check out the last paragraph in this quote is from Computerworld.com:
Devil Mountain ran its OfficeBench suite of performance benchmarks on a laptop equipped with Office 2007, Microsoft's latest application suite. The notebook -- the same unit used in the Vista/Vista SP1 tests earlier -- featured a 2.0-GHz Intel Core 2 Duo processor and 1GB of memory. The results reported that XP SP3 delivered a 10% speed increase over SP2, the service pack released in 2004.

"Since SP3 was supposed to be mostly a bug-fix/patch consolidation release, the unexpected speed boost comes as a nice bonus," Barth said. "In fact, XP SP3 is shaping up to be a 'must-have' update for the majority of users who are still running Redmond's not-so-latest and greatest desktop OS."

According to the Office performance benchmarks, Windows XP SP3 is also considerably faster than Vista SP1. "None of this bodes well for Vista, which is now more than two times slower than the most current builds of its older sibling," said Barth.

 

[fixer27]

UAC is poorly implemented and annoying driving many users to bypass it completely. The other issues don't really apply to the user experience, they're more about the IT guy in business.

As to the UI, yes, i've continued to the use the Classic interface in XP and Vista. That's not the issue. Vista is SLOW, annoying and poorly supported. The low vendor support indicates they too don't think Vista is a particularly desirable platform for their products. I agree.

Vendor support for Vista is a problem.

I monkey around with older computer stuff like printers (Hp, Okidata, Canon) and what I've found is with the release of Vista, the companies (Hp so far) will not continue to maintain driver sites for their older hardware because it does not play well (or at all) with Vista.

The Hp Deskjet 697 was and is in use in who knows how many Dr's offices around the country, and Hp dropped support for it because it will not function on vista according to the Hp website.

 

[kodeslinger]

I had to upgrade to Vista because my new hardware was being limited in XP (8GB of Ram only showing up as 3.25 GB, and I wanted to try some DX-10 games with my Geforce 8800 GTX)

So far I noticed a few random crashes, bugs etc, but in general it seems alright for daily use.

Make sure if you do get it, get Vista Ultimate 64-bit becuase if you're gonna get 32-bit, might as well stick with XP.

For some reason, I really like the Aero using the windows classic skins, it just seems so much faster since it uses your video card and not the CPU for desktop animations (OSX does the same thing)

I guess I'll give it a shot and see how it holds on in the long run, but so far it's surprised me compared to how much bad rap it's been getting.

I don't really notice any slowdown, but I think I would recommend that you get at least 4GB of ram (it's pretty cheap, ram prices have dropped, I got 4GB of Gkills DDR2 800 for 130$ canadian), because Vista will actually utilitze all your ram as one big swapfile so none of it's really wasted.

Yes for older hardware I would stick with XP.

I may try the dual-boot approach when SP3 comes out.

 

[phatch]

If you hadn't bought the 64 bit version, Vista would only show 3.2 gb of RAM too. It uses the same 32 bit memory addressing as XP.

Drivers for 64 bit are problematic and hardware support is even lower than standard vista. And there are some really stupid bugs. If you try to install 64 bit Vista on a 4GB RAM system, it crashes. Pull 2GB for the install and the install works. Then add back the rest of the RAM.

 

[kodeslinger]

If you hadn't bought the 64 bit version, Vista would only show 3.2 gb of RAM too. It uses the same 32 bit memory addressing as XP.

Drivers for 64 bit are problematic and hardware support is even lower than standard vista. And there are some really stupid bugs. If you try to install 64 bit Vista on a 4GB RAM system, it crashes. Pull 2GB for the install and the install works. Then add back the rest of the RAM.

They actually fixed that issue, and it was related more to motherboard BIOS issues, I know because I installed it with 4GB of Ram, and then added the 8GB later.

Drivers have been getting better, but I guess I don't have many peripherals, but my xfi drivers are very good, and the nvidia ones are current too.

I guess I'm stuck with Vista because of my hardware requirement

 

[rebeltf]

They actually fixed that issue, and it was related more to motherboard BIOS issues, I know because I installed it with 4GB of Ram, and then added the 8GB later.

Drivers have been getting better, but I guess I don't have many peripherals, but my xfi drivers are very good, and the nvidia ones are current too.

I guess I'm stuck with Vista because of my hardware requirement

That's the thing , Vista ( 64 bit) is great for those who plan on spending a lot of money on building a great gaming computer , Vista 32 bit is pretty useless for the average user who does not plan on spending a lot of cash to upgrade all of their hardware just to keep up with the times.
XP , on the other hand....

I predict Vista is going to be a huge waste of money for Microsoft.

Hell no , we wont go !

 

[Midwest Ninja]

Looks I've been screwed...last desktop in my house came with ME, and my current one has Vista Home Premium. The only problem I've noticed with it is it won't rip music because of copyright BS. So I have some freeware for that that I'm gonna try out.

Does anyone have any experience with Linux? I'm thinking about getting my hard drive partitioned and running Linux on one half and bare-bones Vista on the other...or maybe just switching over to Linux entirely.

 

[spikedog]

Does anyone have any experience with Linux? ... switching over to Linux entirely.

Good choice I moved from M$ to Linux a couple of years ago and didn't look back. Linux has come a long way lately to become user friendly to install and operate. Many Linux distro's have very good hardware recognition at installation, so no cyptic install stuff to get your video, printer, etc to work.

The advantages are:
It's free.
It will run on current and older hardware.
It tends to run faster than M$ on a given PC.
Many PC programs will run on Linux with the Wine package.
No Viruses are currently targeting Linux:thumbup:

You might try one of the Linux Live CD's. This would allow you to run Linux w/o installing it -- Just to try it.

 

[phatch]

I'm running ubuntu. I use it for most of my surfing duties and hit XP for gaming and some other specialized apps. I use Open Office on Vista, XP and Linux.

Phil

 

[TLR]

Vista is the whole reason I went to a mac. Period. When I called and ordered my Mac the rep told me that they were being inundated by people switching over (this was 8 months ago) and Vista was the most given reason.

 

[Midwest Ninja]

Good choice I moved from M$ to Linux a couple of years ago and didn't look back. Linux has come a long way lately to become user friendly to install and operate. Many Linux distro's have very good hardware recognition at installation, so no cyptic install stuff to get your

You might try one of the Linux Live CD's. This would allow you to run Linux w/o installing it -- Just to try it.

*Snip* Thanks for the info Spikedog. How difficult is it to do the actual partition? I may be young, but I'm no techie. And my computer is pretty dang new-an HP Pavilion desktop, btw.

 

[heatride]

Looks I've been screwed...last desktop in my house came with ME, and my current one has Vista Home Premium. The only problem I've noticed with it is it won't rip music because of copyright BS. So I have some freeware for that that I'm gonna try out.

Does anyone have any experience with Linux? I'm thinking about getting my hard drive partitioned and running Linux on one half and bare-bones Vista on the other...or maybe just switching over to Linux entirely.

If you change to linux and give yourself 2 month's you will never go back. I have used linux for years here are the some advantages, can't get spy ware or a virus , all the free software you can imagine. Very stable and very secure , it is actually the backbone of the Internet . Most servers are UNIX based. Linux is not a ram hog . You just let it run. I knew of a guy once that ran his linux box for over 6 years without a reboot . Now the only disadvantage I can think of linux is not good for gaming. People often ask me why I use linux and I simply reply it just makes sense. Just think about no more hard drive defragmentation no more updating your anti virus or spy ware cleaner (there is no registry to clean! ) all the free software for whatever you can imagine legal and free. Things like the firefox browser are linux apps that have been ported to M$ .

 

[Midwest Ninja]

If you change to linux and give yourself 2 month's you will never go back. I have used linux for years here are the some advantages, can't get spy ware or a virus , all the free software you can imagine. Very stable and very secure , it is actually the backbone of the Internet . Now the only disadvantage I can think of linux is not good for gaming. Things like the firefox browser are linux apps that have been ported to M$ .

*Snip* The gaming is the main reason I'd keep Vista there- I do love a good flight sim. What do I need two months for? I assume I'd need to back up all my files first, but what else is there?

 

[spikedog]

Midwest Ninja:

*Snip* Thanks for the info Spikedog. How difficult is it to do the actual partition? I may be young, but I'm no techie. And my computer is pretty dang new-an HP Pavilion desktop, btw.

The Linux installation will recognize existing partitions and only allow you to create a partition from your unused disk space. Therefore, you must resize your M$ partition (basically release space) so that the Linux installer can use it. I believe there are some Win applications to do this, i.e. partition editors. Be very careful in using these utilities. Backup your important stuff.

I am not familiar with the dual boot, but I think there is a lot of information on the net.

Good luck.

 

[phatch]

*Snip* Thanks for the info Spikedog. How difficult is it to do the actual partition? I may be young, but I'm no techie. And my computer is pretty dang new-an HP Pavilion desktop, btw.

The easiest thing to do is buy a second drive and install it. 80 GB drives of good quality can be had under $40.00. Then install Linux on that drive.

This protects your MS data and lets you use the automatic partition tools built into Linux. Linux detects the MS Windows OS and installs a boot loader called grub. When you boot your computer you are presented with a list of bootable OSes for your PC. There will be a "SAFE" Linux boot like Safe mode for windows, Linux and Windows. Use the arrow keys to make your selection, press enter and enjoy the boot of your choice. You'll be able to see the contents of the MS drive so you can use those files in Linux. MS might be able to see the linux drive, but there are variables there it's not worth going into right now.

If you don't like Linux, you'd end up with a bonus data drive for your HP.

Phil

 

[Midwest Ninja]

Thanks a lot for the info guys! I think I'm going to wait until I can have somebody at my side who knows what they're doing, but you have convinced me that I don't have anything to worry about as far as usability is concerned.

 

[Bob W]

Does anyone have any experience with Linux? I'm thinking about getting my hard drive partitioned and running Linux on one half and bare-bones Vista on the other...or maybe just switching over to Linux entirely

The best way to see Linux for yourself is to download some of the LiveCD distributions that boot and run from a CD. I think most major distros have a LiveCD version, plus there are lots of specialized LiveCD distros as well.

You may have to change the BIOS settings to allow the computer to boot from CD. I always set the following boot order:
1- Floppy
2- CD
3- Hard drive(s)

The Linux installation will recognize existing partitions and only allow you to create a partition from your unused disk space. Therefore, you must resize your M$ partition (basically release space) so that the Linux installer can use it. I believe there are some Win applications to do this, i.e. partition editors. Be very careful in using these utilities. Backup your important stuff.

I am not familiar with the dual boot, but I think there is a lot of information on the net.

The most reliable method is to repartition the hard drive from scratch. Basic steps:
1) Use a bootable CD with Ranish Partition Manager (freeware) installed.
2) Delete the existing Windows partition
3) Create new Windows partition on a portion of the drive.
4) Install Windows on new partition.
5) Install Linux. The Linux installation tool will create the proper partitions in the remaining space and install the tools necessary to dual boot.

The easiest thing to do is buy a second drive and install it. 80 GB drives of good quality can be had under $40.00. Then install Linux on that drive.

I agree! A piece of cake compared to re-partitioning an existing drive. The main hurdle will be to set the hard drive jumpers for Slave and Master if you have IDE drives.

 

[Bob W]

but you have convinced me that I don't have anything to worry about as far as usability is concerned.

Just depends on what you use the computer for. Linux is a piss-poor choice for gaming. But it's perfectly capable for internet, email, office work, etc.

Many (but not all) Windows programs can be run within Linux by using an emulator like WINE.

The Linux weakness that affects me the most is all of the accessories I plug into the computer come with Windows-only software. PDA, GPS, calculators, cell phones, etc.

Good luck exploring!
-Bob

 

[Geraldo]

I've been reading these types of threads for a while now and it sounds like Linux or Ubuntu may be for me. No games, but I do need to run Palm (plus a couple of TPAs my wife uses at work), Ipod, and MS Word/Excel. Can I do this?