Warning About Battening

The log that was being battened during the accident, wouldn't stand up by it's self so I was holding down low. The first wack that would normally only sink the knife down about half inch or so into the log, split the log all the way down to my hand.

So if I understand this correctly, you weren't batOning at all, you were chopping?

All you anti-batoning guys really need to give it a rest. Using an axe is much more dangerous than batoning. In fact had the threadstarter been using an axe, he would be short one finger.
 
Aye, the initial set-up the OP used sounds plenty dangerous! Not sure quite how hefty said log was, but when I baton, I usually hold the log upright, then gently place the knife on the top end, and that's usually enough to hold the log upright before grabbing the baton and goin' at 'er.

Yes, an axe or hatchet is generally more effective for splitting large piece of wood... it's also heavier! If you're not going to need to do much splitting, it's probably easier to lug a medium sized knife and baton, rather than hike lord knows how far with an axe on top of the rest of one's gear.
 
When I batton, I just place the edge on the piece, and smack the back with the batton. I don't get it started first if it won't stand up, for just this reason. I don't want any of my little piggies any shorter.
 
Well I hope your finger heals ok. I have never batoned and made hundreds of camp fires . Im not anti batoning , just never needed to.
 
Excellent video that shows the axe 101 basics. Personally i never owned or carried an axe, i just find them too heavy and large for my backpack, plus i like to consider myself a light-backpacker so things of that size is out of the question.

Sometimes i get the notion that all the anti-batoning members out there live in dry places where theres an abundance of deadfall or they always carry some gasoline with them.

I consider myself being pretty able in the wild, but i still struggle to keep a fire in the fall/winter here in wet and rainy scandinavia.
Got no problem starting it, but keeping it going after the first 2 min is the problem (without batoning). Once i baton and split some wood i can keep a fire going anywhere.
 
This reminds me of the guy at the pistol range with the itchy head. Scratch, scratch, BOOM. Just kidding. I hope your finger heals soon.
 
kmm .....I am an anti baton person. Half of my fires have been in wet weather. I use deadfalls and forest floor litter to start and fuel a fire. I don't carry gasoline or bring fire wood with me. I do bring a lighter and an axe.


If you don't have a dry climate or an abundance of deadfall, what do you baton and split ?
 
I do bring a lighter and an axe.

An axe won't fit in my pocket. I only bring one on overnights. I don't see a need to pack one everytime I enter the woods. Maybe you do, and hey,thats fine for you.

If for some reason a day trip turns into an overnighter I can still split deadwood if needed.

100_0936.jpg
 
kmm .....I am an anti baton person. Half of my fires have been in wet weather. I use deadfalls and forest floor litter to start and fuel a fire. I don't carry gasoline or bring fire wood with me. I do bring a lighter and an axe.


If you don't have a dry climate or an abundance of deadfall, what do you baton and split ?

Some of us don't car/RV camp. ;)

I am NOT carring an Axe along with everything else... A large Fixed blade like a Busse FBM or CS TM will take care of just about anything an Axe would and do most things faster. THey are one heck of a lot lighter too. ;)

Really though a good solid 6-8" fixed blade is fine for most things.

One like this 6" Busse Tank Buster will do just fine for just about anything.



 
People do make mistakes by lapses in judgement. This was obviously negligence caused by cutting toward your own flesh. You never cut towards yourself. csgraves had it perfectly right when he said to use the knife to gently support the upright piece of wood, by placing said blade where you want the wood to split. Then you use the other hand to do the actual battoning. While I've never battoned, I certainly would if the situation called for it. i.e. I had no axe/hatchet but only my knife. That being said, I realize that battoning requires even more attention to detail then a hatchet, because of the considerably longer blade edge. Just like using a hatchet, there is no reason that you can't batton when required, if you pay attention to the details of safety.
 
kmm .....I am an anti baton person. Half of my fires have been in wet weather. I use deadfalls and forest floor litter to start and fuel a fire. I don't carry gasoline or bring fire wood with me. I do bring a lighter and an axe.


If you don't have a dry climate or an abundance of deadfall, what do you baton and split ?

There are lots of clever ways to gather wood with just a medium sized (or smaller) fixed blade but you'd probably think they are stupid too :rolleyes:
 
I have hiked and camped the whole eastern seaboard, smokey mountains, appalachians, poconos, green mts, white mts and never felt the need to baton.

But I think it is a matter of preference.

Some people find it useful, some don't.

Carl-

Try it up here in the Pacific North West.... 300 inches of rain, and everything is wet year round in the temperate rain forrest....

But you are right, it is a matter of preference. I keep my axe razor sharp, so I use it for fine cutting and detail work, and use my knife for splitting wood... Is that wrong!?!?!?!?
 
I'm pretty sure if I had to split a bunch of wood for survival use, I'd just burn the log in half and keep flipping the halves till you have a bunch of usable logs.
I do that a lot at campfires anyway.
Battoning to make kindling comes in handy since I'd rather use a knife than a 5lb axe, and I don't usually go hiking with a 5lb axe.
 
kmm .....I am an anti baton person. Half of my fires have been in wet weather. I use deadfalls and forest floor litter to start and fuel a fire. I don't carry gasoline or bring fire wood with me. I do bring a lighter and an axe.


If you don't have a dry climate or an abundance of deadfall, what do you baton and split ?

I was more annoyed with the batoning is dumb comments coming from others.

In wet and boggy areas there is often a lot of standing dead trees whereas anything on the ground is waterlogged. You can take them down with axe or knife. Typically an axe is the best option for taking down a tree, but a knife can be put to the task easy enough provided you are tackling something of appropriate size. In these cases, forcing the split to get kindling is important.

There are often multiple ways to do things in the woods. If you didn't have a knife with you, I'm sure you can improvise. If you didn't have an axe with you, you can improvise. If you didn't have matches or lighter with you, well you can improvise there too using primitive methods.

I for one am one of those guys who likes practicing primitive skills. I don't start every fire I use with a bowdrill, but if I'm not using bowdrill, I'm almost always using flint and steel and charcloth (not to be confused with a modern day firesteel). These methods begin a fire with a coal, not a flame, and one of the things the method teaches you is the importance of preparing your tinder and kindling ahead of time. Jeff Randall of RatCutlery and part owner of the RAT Jungle Survival Training school states 'you gather as much tinder and kindling as you think you will need, then triple that amount'.

Nursing your coal into a little flame, and that flame into a full fire is very rewarding. I also admit to the fact that I just get a lot of pleasure from making the fire by this route even if its more tedious then pulling out a pocket blowtorch. Its more of a ritual for me than just trying to get a cooking fire going. If you use this approach, its considered a real silly thing to do to go to all the effort of getting a flame, only to have your fire die out on you because you didn't prepare your tinder accordingly. So I usually make doubly and then triply sure, I have secure kindling to build a solid base of coals before starting my main fuel logs up.

Despite this being a pain, there is much said to using a methodical method to fire building. If, I had to a get a fire going now, hell yes, I would you a lighter to do so. But I would also go about making sure that I built up my tinder appropriately to get the task done. There is a lot less energy expired doing this than trying to get by on the minimum and failing as a result.
 
I'm pretty sure if I had to split a bunch of wood for survival use, I'd just burn the log in half and keep flipping the halves till you have a bunch of usable logs.
I do that a lot at campfires anyway.
Battoning to make kindling comes in handy since I'd rather use a knife than a 5lb axe, and I don't usually go hiking with a 5lb axe.

Depends on the size of the log, I tried that with a good sized log once, and it took a full day to burn in half. - (if it's a small log you can often just break them into pieces)

Who ever said they never need to split logs before throwing them on the fire must know something I don't, since most big logs tend to just smolder slowly when I try it.
 
That being said, I realize that battoning requires even more attention to detail then a hatchet, because of the considerably longer blade edge. Just like using a hatchet, there is no reason that you can't batton when required, if you pay attention to the details of safety.

And on the other hand, batonning can be safer than swinging a hatchet or axe to split, since there's no great sweeping movements with the actual bladed tool. I have however, had the misfortune of smacking my knife-hand with the baton. :D
 
Depends on the size of the log, I tried that with a good sized log once, and it took a full day to burn in half. - (if it's a small log you can often just break them into pieces)

Who ever said they never need to split logs before throwing them on the fire must know something I don't, since most big logs tend to just smolder slowly when I try it.

Oh for sure if you drag a ten inch thick tree over to the fire pit you won't see much progress on that. Anything you can easily move (thus being worthwhile) is four or five inches thick, and goes through reasonably quick.
After enough of those, then you can tackle the ten incher.
(Note that these trees are usually standing and dead, or at least mostly off the ground.)
 
kmm .....I am an anti baton person. Half of my fires have been in wet weather. I use deadfalls and forest floor litter to start and fuel a fire. I don't carry gasoline or bring fire wood with me. I do bring a lighter and an axe.


If you don't have a dry climate or an abundance of deadfall, what do you baton and split ?

If i was out backpacking in dry weather why would i want to baton and split??

Please note that i differentiate between standing deadwood and deadfall, in the fall/winter seasons i usually dont bother picking something up from the forestfloor unless i can split it and get to the dry wood.
Knowing that my knife can baton means that i can look for both standing deadwood AND deadfall littered around the forestfloor.

Ive yet to see somebody, in winter-rainweather, running around gathering wet and soaked firewood from the forestfloor and turning it into good fire in reasonable time.
 
I have hiked and camped the whole eastern seaboard, smokey mountains, appalachians, poconos, green mts, white mts and never felt the need to baton.

But I think it is a matter of preference.

Some people find it useful, some don't.

Carl-

As a Eastern mountain guy over 50, I've yet needed to baton anything. Harvesting materials from the woods by hand, leverage is your friend. Google doesn't help here. :D
Most camping or outings with only a slip joint (Barlow or Stockman) in the early days. (Money what's that?)
As a lad before my ol pappy even put a knife in my hand, he would teach and quiz me on wood species and there uses. (Guess he figured I'd get lost someday or hoping :D)

On the Pro Batoning side, I been reading about batoning on the forum since I joined and am going to give it a try for the first time, after I order a knife I want and don't care if I beat the heck out of it:D for processing Fat Wood for starters, just to kick the tires on Batoning.


Sorry to hear this happened to you Flashpoint. Glad to hear that you still have all your Fingers. Take care out there, ya hear.:)
 
Back
Top