Were folding traditionals ever viewed as "tactical" knives?

[Old Hunter]

When I was a 2LT, taking the Ordinance Officers Basic Course at APG MD in 1976 (imagine, an entire company of Lieutenants!), the Buck 110 and the 100 series Buck fixed blades were quite popular as your heavy field knife. A standard slipjoint or SAK was carried for normal use - knives were tools. Most were bought at the PX. OH

 

[Primble]

I also wonder if back during the world wars soldiers compared their folders and had conversations like "my Camillus has better carbon steel than your Case" or "My TL-29 is better than yours because its made by...."

I would say almost certainly.

My father and 3 uncles served in World War II and I recall knife comparison conversations between them, when I was a young boy. As I recall, local knife talk was much more frequently the topic of conversation than the local conversations of today.

 

[wackafew]

When I was in the Navy, 1969-1973, there were a lot of Buck 110s. I myself carried a case folding hunter as I liked the option of having two blades and carbon steel. :thumbup:

 

[Halfneck]

My first field exercise as an Infantry Medic (Fall '95) I was carrying an Al Mar Warrior on my belt. Seven & a Half inches of pure fighting knife. The pommel jabbed me in the ribs while in the CH-47, and the Platoon Sgt. asked me if I was expecting to have to amputate...

It quickly got stowed in my ruck and I ended up using my Victorinox Huntsman for the whole month. The saw let me clear out an area for my hooch. The scissors worked better than my issue shears for cutting medical tape. The tweezers worked better at removing splinters than the ones in my aid bag. And the knife blade quickly cut open my MREs. So while it might not work well for sentry elimination, it sure helped me with "tactical" stuff.

I bet soldiers have been discussing sharp stuff since sharp stuff has been around. I could easily imagine an American soldier & a French soldier discussing the merits of their particular knife in the Trenches of WW1.

 

[Primble]

I bet soldiers have been discussing sharp stuff since sharp stuff has been around. I could easily imagine an American soldier & a French soldier discussing the merits of their particular knife in the Trenches of WW1.

then and most likely beyond - the further you go back - the less there was to talk about and admire - blades and guns were probably the most talked about, prior to the 1900's.
Nice to hear how well the SAK served you so well.

 

[MarkPinTx]

Interesting question. Here's my theory. Back "then," whenever that was, fixed blade knives were more common on the belts of men. There was no need to imitate what a fixed blade knife would do, whether that was fighting, batoning, chopping wood, digging holes, punching into or through metal articles: if you needed that, you just carried a fixed blade.

When pocket knives came along, they were literally pocket knives for circumstances when a belt knife or fixed blade was truly inconvenient (not because carrying one was frowned upon as it would be today) or when carrying a pocket knife was truly more convenient.

I don't think there was much thought given to the principle identifying factor of a tactical knife: duplicating the functionality of a fixed blade with a folder.

So my thought would be no, there were no "tactical" pocket knives way back when.

As to the steel question, I don't think there were steel pissing contests per se, but there were old timers that were very loyal to brands based on the perceived quality of the steel. And most of em wouldn't pee on stainless if it were on fire. I would bet that there wasn't a whole lot of direct disparagement of another man's knife. That's a creature of the internet and it's anonymity and the general lack of civil discourse today. Someone might say in private that ole Hank sure was proud of his crappy ____________ with its crappy steel, or there goes Clint and his goldurned Queen with that nasty toadsucking stainless steel.

 

[Liberando]

I think MarkPinTx is right--there were no "tactical" pocket knives back in the day. If you needed something tactical, it was a fixed blade, either issued or bought at the PX/BX. A pocket knife was used for those frequent, everyday chores in the field; utilitarian in design and yet a good companion.

During my first deployment to the desert 23 years ago, I used the heck out of a SAK Tinker. Eventually added a Buck 422 to the mobility bag, and liked the locking blade and extra cutting power. But I never considered it "tactical." Both were tools, and darn good ones.

As for the old timers debating the merits of their pocket knives, real or perceived--absolutely! Shooting the breeze is still a time-honored tradition in the military and having a good bull session helps while away those long hours awaiting transportation, etc. Knives, dogs, trucks, TV shows, you name it--GIs will argue about anything, and have a good laugh while doing it.

 

[rwc53]

I spent a couple of decades in the military myself, and then another 18 years as a contractor doing much the same thing in interesting places around the globe.. Carried a number of knives during that period of time. I never bought into the "tactical knife" craze, though. For example, while assigned to SOCSOUTH in the late 80's, I carried a Randall Model 1 with a 6" blade, used mostly for cutting roots and such, a Buck Bucklite Ranger and a Swiss Army Knife with a saw. Now that SAK with the saw blade was a very handy item to have! That and the Bucklite were the two most-used knives I had.

Just my $0.02 worth!
Ron

 

[jamestap]

Sure - one of the older folding knife patterns and somewhat the grand-daddy of all of today's folding knives, the Spanish navaja, was viewed as a fighting knife.

If you mean as a weapon of war used by actual soldiers, then I believe they more commonly used swords, bayonets, daggers, and fixed blade knives rather than folding knives per se.

Don't forget the trench knives:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trench_knife

I'm sure more than a few bar-room disputes got settled with Barlow's, or whatever was in the pocket of one's bib overalls.

The word "tactical" is in grave danger of losing it's meaning from over-use. I decided this after seeing a "tactical" tomahawk at Cabelas. If we mean for use on other humans, then let's call them what they are: combat, fighting, anti-personnel knives, take your pick. "Tactical" means a specific action or mission in support of accomplishing a larger strategic goal.

 

[AreBeeBee]

The word "tactical" is in grave danger of losing it's meaning from over-use...."Tactical" means a specific action or mission in support of accomplishing a larger strategic goal.

You're entirely right, Jamestap, but I think it's far too late. "Tactical" as a word has now been taken over completely by the marketing department and used to sell everything from blades to underwear. Its original meaning has been thoroughly debased. And how many people among the general public know enough about military matters to state the difference between strategic and tactical? Not many, I'm thinking.