What constitutes a "tactical folder" in your opinion?

[Poez]

Tactical folders are essentially the way how knives are marketed.
So tactical folder basically only required a fancy story or a kind of military-like whape: everything else may vary.

 

[BladesB4Firearms]

I am glad it is working well for you. Since the steel isn't as big a factor for you as it is for me, what desirable quality or material would you require instead?

A strong lock, fast opening, and a long enough blade to be lethal, if needed. That's why the Rajah II fits my personal preferences perfectly. The only thing that would be better is if my state issued concealed weapons permits so that I could carry it without fear of the law. They only issue gun permits :grumpy:

 

[cards94]

A strong lock, fast opening, and a long enough blade to be lethal, if needed. That's why the Rajah II fits my personal preferences perfectly. The only thing that would be better is if my state issued concealed weapons permits so that I could carry it without fear of the law. They only issue gun permits :grumpy:

why would you need to walk around with a rajah 2?

 

[Jesse B.]

There has been much (rightful) discussion about the definition of the word "tactical". Sometimes pictures say more than words:

^Me and my machete, years ago, getting all tactical on a watermelon. Can't go into details, but it was part of a secret mission. So tactical.

 

[stabman]

 

[BladesB4Firearms]

why would you need to walk around with a rajah 2?

Same reason you'd walk around with a pistol. Doesn't my name say enough?

 

[cards94]

Same reason you'd walk around with a pistol. Doesn't my name say enough?

zombie apocalypse?

 

[BladesB4Firearms]

zombie apocalypse?

I plan on buying another for dual-wielding in that situation But yes, basically personal protection. I actually ALMOST had to use it the other day. Glad I didn't though. That would have been ugly. I think it's more important to diffuse a volatile situation than turn to physical violence right away.

 

[A Justice]

If black paint makes a tactical knife, then fire engine red paint makes sports cars.

No, it doesn't.

I don't think you are listening to what you're saying. You said:

"There is a big difference between a functional non glare finish and the industry practice taking any old production blade, painting it black, and calling tactical."

and there isn't. A functional non glare finish IS Black Paint. BY definition black krylon would be a functional non-glare finish. If you were in the field and for some reason needed a field exediant non-glare finish that was functional and you had a can of matte black spray paint, it would not only suffice but work wonderfully. I think you're just eager to discuss something, but this is a cluster muck discussion that is going nowhere as is. When you listed "Spyder Hole" as something that makes a knife tactical, I actually thought this was a joke or a troll.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're confused, as opposed to trolling. There is no need to, and actually no way to 'clear up the definition of tactical' as it applies to knives. It's a marketing term, and applied to something SOG sells it has very little to do with the dictionary term for tactics, or strategy for that matter. You can call anything you want tactical, and your self appointed definition of Tactical as it applies to knives (which is what you said you're asking for?) matters less to everyone else than a generalized consensus that could be applied (which is still a worthless exercise). Manufacturers certainly don't set out a criteria for labeling a product tactical - at least not in the majority of cases. This whole discussion has been had here before, I'm guessing 100 times (I've read it twice in the last month, so I assume it gets that much play over time). It's a fools errand trying to set a criteria for a term that doesn't explain anything. Asking everybody to give a different definition of tactical is even more confusing and leads to nowhere.

If enthusiasts aimed to clear up the term tactical as it applies to knives, it would help by first narrowing down the definition to combat applications. Using my existing knowledge of combat applications, it is fairly simple to list a set of criteria that lends itself to combat scenarios, but for a weapon to be combat applicable it would not have to meet all of those criteria, and would actually be combat applicable if it met a single criteria (that is part of the reason that defining tactical as it applies to the marketing term is a fools errand). For a tactical folder some of the most important would be:

1. Capable of thrusting attacks
2. Easily Accessible/ Assisted Opening / Automatic Opening
3. Matte non-glare finish
4. Corrosion Resistant
5. More than 4" blade length
6. Tough Steel / Wear Resistant
7. Ergonomic Grip
8. Ergonomics that aid in retention (why Jimping would be a plus lol)
9. Non-Snag
10. Compatible with existing military kit

Designers that aim to fill a military role and are devoted to the intention of that design have the best claim to the marketing term 'tactical' in my opinion. They will consider a list like this, and make a compromise based on each feature depending on its perceived importance. A point that is capable of stabbing is probably the primary consideration, followed by ruggedness / ergonomics, etc. Corrosion resistance is at least important enough for Stainless Steels or corrosion resistant coatings to be considered; and it is a welcome aspect of engineering that coatings like Cerakote are non-glare and resistant to corrosion. A 4"+ blade is extremely important because vital organs and blood vessels aren't on the surface of your skin, and since combat is either the primary consideration or an important dual application consideration (such as a knife that is made for medics or paratroopers, combat effectiveness will almost always be a strong secondary consideration in the development of a product).

A good example would be CRK's Green Beret. He set out with the intent to produce a combat effective fixed blade, and that intent is evident in the blade's design. It has a drop point for stabbing, utilizes a high end steel for improved edge retention, compromises its hardness with additional tempering for toughness; in addition to the highly corrosion resistant stainless S35V, it is also coated with KG Gun Coat for added corrosion resistance and a matte non-reflective finish. The knife must be capable of handling as wide of a variety of cutting chores as effectively as possible while retaining the majority of the combat effectiveness (fighting) of a Fairbarn-Sykes dagger. The best part of the design in my opinion is the ergonomics of the handle, which does not lend itself to preparing vegetables for a meal, but offer superb retention capabilities through design and materials. The full-thick tang makes the knife rugged, and the Micarta scales are ideal for a combat ready weapon. Soldiers are fairly rough on their equipment, and need equipment that is designed to accept some abuse. Chris Reeve succeeded in his mission because when tested, the very soldiers the knife was designed for opted for his design over 100 others. It doesn't mean it's the best knife in the world, just that it was developed with intent, and used design to meet as many prescribed attributes weighted for importance as possible as effectively as possible. What is telling here is that you won't see CRK calling the Green Beret 'Tactical' in their marketing (at least I don't think so, I might be wrong there). They may target people looking for a tactical knife in their marketing, but including that term puts them in the same boat as manufacturers like M-Tech, and may hurt the perception of their product by association. The word tactical is a marketing term, just like Christmas is a holiday invented by retailers. For what it's worth though, most of us know what the word implies, and can make a rough assumption of knives that would be included under that umbrella term. Modern, black, pointy blades from manufacturers that target the people that watch walking dead and own AR-15s.

The most devoted use of the word 'tactical' to describe a knife is one that is built using the aforementioned method of applying features and design to meet the needs of a modern soldier. The problem is that all design is a compromise, and different professions, even within the army, need a different feature set to be most effective. Soliders also need to be adaptable, and specific features will be more important for specific missions (if I was carrying a knife specifically to take out sentries during a covert mission, the knife I would select would be different than the knife I wold need to jump out of a plane) so several knives with dramatically different features and design can all meet that criteria.... then there's the fact that by definition, tactical has absolutely nothing to do with the design of knives, is a marketing term, and is used widely (and more often) by manufacturers that would never be considered for military use.

 

[justsomedude]

Well said A Justice, kept me reading 'til the end. :thumbup:

 

[bpeezer]

Accepted. I don't know what your experience is previously or currently, But you can understand that many people in police, military, and private life are sometimes required to employ a knife in such a manner weather they want to or not, myself included(I am a former LEO and current corporate investigator).
Not to be condescending I hope, but tactical purposes expand far beyond simply hurting someone. Your tactic may require you to break a window with your knife, cut some wires, or any number of hard use tasks associated with protecting yourself or another individual. Tactical doesn't solely mean to kill or hurt somebody.

Thanks for being understanding with me, regardless of the chaos going on around us Let me clarify a little more. I have been in situations that require self defense, but I was fortunate enough to rely on years of training instead of using a weapon. As far as the other hard use tasks? That's what my "EDC" knife is for

 

[Nyfeguy]

No, it doesn't.

I don't think you are listening to what you're saying. You said:



and there isn't. A functional non glare finish IS Black Paint. BY definition black krylon would be a functional non-glare finish. If you were in the field and for some reason needed a field exediant non-glare finish that was functional and you had a can of matte black spray paint, it would not only suffice but work wonderfully. I think you're just eager to discuss something, but this is a cluster muck discussion that is going nowhere as is. When you listed "Spyder Hole" as something that makes a knife tactical, I actually thought this was a joke or a troll.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're confused, as opposed to trolling. There is no need to, and actually no way to 'clear up the definition of tactical' as it applies to knives. It's a marketing term, and applied to something SOG sells it has very little to do with the dictionary term for tactics, or strategy for that matter. You can call anything you want tactical, and your self appointed definition of Tactical as it applies to knives (which is what you said you're asking for?) matters less to everyone else than a generalized consensus that could be applied (which is still a worthless exercise). Manufacturers certainly don't set out a criteria for labeling a product tactical - at least not in the majority of cases. This whole discussion has been had here before, I'm guessing 100 times (I've read it twice in the last month, so I assume it gets that much play over time). It's a fools errand trying to set a criteria for a term that doesn't explain anything. Asking everybody to give a different definition of tactical is even more confusing and leads to nowhere.

If enthusiasts aimed to clear up the term tactical as it applies to knives, it would help by first narrowing down the definition to combat applications. Using my existing knowledge of combat applications, it is fairly simple to list a set of criteria that lends itself to combat scenarios, but for a weapon to be combat applicable it would not have to meet all of those criteria, and would actually be combat applicable if it met a single criteria (that is part of the reason that defining tactical as it applies to the marketing term is a fools errand). For a tactical folder some of the most important would be:

1. Capable of thrusting attacks
2. Easily Accessible/ Assisted Opening / Automatic Opening
3. Matte non-glare finish
4. Corrosion Resistant
5. More than 4" blade length
6. Tough Steel / Wear Resistant
7. Ergonomic Grip
8. Ergonomics that aid in retention (why Jimping would be a plus lol)
9. Non-Snag
10. Compatible with existing military kit

Designers that aim to fill a military role and are devoted to the intention of that design have the best claim to the marketing term 'tactical' in my opinion. They will consider a list like this, and make a compromise based on each feature depending on its perceived importance. A point that is capable of stabbing is probably the primary consideration, followed by ruggedness / ergonomics, etc. Corrosion resistance is at least important enough for Stainless Steels or corrosion resistant coatings to be considered; and it is a welcome aspect of engineering that coatings like Cerakote are non-glare and resistant to corrosion. A 4"+ blade is extremely important because vital organs and blood vessels aren't on the surface of your skin, and since combat is either the primary consideration or an important dual application consideration (such as a knife that is made for medics or paratroopers, combat effectiveness will almost always be a strong secondary consideration in the development of a product).

A good example would be CRK's Green Beret. He set out with the intent to produce a combat effective fixed blade, and that intent is evident in the blade's design. It has a drop point for stabbing, utilizes a high end steel for improved edge retention, compromises its hardness with additional tempering for toughness; in addition to the highly corrosion resistant stainless S35V, it is also coated with KG Gun Coat for added corrosion resistance and a matte non-reflective finish. The knife must be capable of handling as wide of a variety of cutting chores as effectively as possible while retaining the majority of the combat effectiveness (fighting) of a Fairbarn-Sykes dagger. The best part of the design in my opinion is the ergonomics of the handle, which does not lend itself to preparing vegetables for a meal, but offer superb retention capabilities through design and materials. The full-thick tang makes the knife rugged, and the Micarta scales are ideal for a combat ready weapon. Soldiers are fairly rough on their equipment, and need equipment that is designed to accept some abuse. Chris Reeve succeeded in his mission because when tested, the very soldiers the knife was designed for opted for his design over 100 others. It doesn't mean it's the best knife in the world, just that it was developed with intent, and used design to meet as many prescribed attributes weighted for importance as possible as effectively as possible. What is telling here is that you won't see CRK calling the Green Beret 'Tactical' in their marketing (at least I don't think so, I might be wrong there). They may target people looking for a tactical knife in their marketing, but including that term puts them in the same boat as manufacturers like M-Tech, and may hurt the perception of their product by association. The word tactical is a marketing term, just like Christmas is a holiday invented by retailers. For what it's worth though, most of us know what the word implies, and can make a rough assumption of knives that would be included under that umbrella term. Modern, black, pointy blades from manufacturers that target the people that watch walking dead and own AR-15s.

The most devoted use of the word 'tactical' to describe a knife is one that is built using the aforementioned method of applying features and design to meet the needs of a modern soldier. The problem is that all design is a compromise, and different professions, even within the army, need a different feature set to be most effective. Soliders also need to be adaptable, and specific features will be more important for specific missions (if I was carrying a knife specifically to take out sentries during a covert mission, the knife I would select would be different than the knife I wold need to jump out of a plane) so several knives with dramatically different features and design can all meet that criteria.... then there's the fact that by definition, tactical has absolutely nothing to do with the design of knives, is a marketing term, and is used widely (and more often) by manufacturers that would never be considered for military use.

From paragraph 3 down, I am with you 100%. For the above part, a few things. First I do admit it was foolish to try and define anything. I thought I was being helpful to some members who seem bothered and confused by the term, second I never asked for a definition, I was soliciting what traits or materials people felt contributed to a good "tactical" folder and it got turned into the type of threads you see over and over again. One trait I feel contributes to an effective tac folder is the spyderco hole. Not that simply having a spyderhole makes a knife tactical. Reread my original post if you are confused by this.
About the paint, there was more to that than you may have realized. I was defending myself poorly. Long story short, you are right there is no difference but originally I was trying to say to another member color in itself does not make a tactical folder just like a Spyderhole doesn't make a tactical folder. Other qualities must be present as well, and that Must not have come across right. I am new to the forum and I obviously didn't see how my simple question was being steered into the path of that age old discussion, otherwise I may have been able to navigate it better. Anyway I got the information I wanted and your post here was helpful as well. Thank you.

 

[Nyfeguy]

Thanks for being understanding with me, regardless of the chaos going on around us Let me clarify a little more. I have been in situations that require self defense, but I was fortunate enough to rely on years of training instead of using a weapon. As far as the other hard use tasks? That's what my "EDC" knife is for

Hey man everyone can use a little understanding. I give it to get it! If people would just read a post before responding maybe we would be swirling in the chaos eh? Anyways I am glad you had the tools and training to come out of your jobs safely in the past and I am also glad you have options for today, gotta love the EDC

 

[Bryan J]

The gentleman in the photo below is the ultimate authority on what constitutes a tactical folder. He has some videos to teach you this. Find them and let the learning begin.

 

[Bugout Bill]

The gentleman in the photo below is the ultimate authority on what constitutes a tactical folder. He has some videos to teach you this. Find them and let the learning begin.

Hahahah! Nice picture. He is also the man responsible for the belief that an "EDC knife" is an actual type of knife.

 

[A Justice]

I am new to the forum and I obviously didn't see how my simple question was being steered into the path of that age old discussion, otherwise I may have been able to navigate it better. Anyway I got the information I wanted and your post here was helpful as well. Thank you.

I am new to the forum too, but I have spent enough time here over the last few years to know how literal some of these questions end up being construed. It is actually one of the things I dislike about this community in particular; we ALL have an idea of what tactical means, and some times people will flat out act like you're talking Japanese if you use it. That's about as far as it gets though - that we all have a general idea of what it means. The industry controls the adjectives they use, and they aren't interested in setting a criteria. Much like quality; this community demands high quality, and it's safe to say that most of us will prefer a higher quality knife, but we're a small percentage of knife consumers. Average buyers trust brands like Smith & Wesson and Colt, and they are enticed by aesthetics more than some of the features knife enthusiasts go for. The manufacturers play right in to that.

It takes a minute to get used to this community (always be clear in what you are asking, and I think it's good to try and convey the magnitude of how much personal bias and opinion you want in responses. BF is a rare community that actually has some control over their objectivity, and most of the clarity is just so responders know whether you want fact or opinions), but it is a good community. I don't know if I'm in a position to suggest you hang around, but enthusiasm for knives is definitely the first requisite, and people go out of their way to help others here. It is worth hanging around I think.

 

[Eightleggedfreak]

I am new to the forum too, but I have spent enough time here over the last few years to know how literal some of these questions end up being construed. It is actually one of the things I dislike about this community in particular; we ALL have an idea of what tactical means, and some times people will flat out act like you're talking Japanese if you use it. That's about as far as it gets though - that we all have a general idea of what it means. The industry controls the adjectives they use, and they aren't interested in setting a criteria. Much like quality; this community demands high quality, and it's safe to say that most of us will prefer a higher quality knife, but we're a small percentage of knife consumers. Average buyers trust brands like Smith & Wesson and Colt, and they are enticed by aesthetics more than some of the features knife enthusiasts go for. The manufacturers play right in to that.

It takes a minute to get used to this community (always be clear in what you are asking, and I think it's good to try and convey the magnitude of how much personal bias and opinion you want in responses. BF is a rare community that actually has some control over their objectivity, and most of the clarity is just so responders know whether you want fact or opinions), but it is a good community. I don't know if I'm in a position to suggest you hang around, but enthusiasm for knives is definitely the first requisite, and people go out of their way to help others here. It is worth hanging around I think.

Agreed. Hang in there nyfeguy!

 

[HwangJino]

I guess one that is designed to damage flesh? And batman looking styling.

 

[olybears57]

Grip, Reach, Ease of deployment, Slicer/penetrator blade geometry/grind.

 

[SOLEIL]

Tactical knives are made SPECIFICALLY for the purpose of self-defense. Kitchen knives are not tactical. Slip-joint folders are not tactical. Shovels are not tactical. Pencils are not tactical. Even though an item can be used for self-defense, doesn't make it truly tactical.

LOL, gotta throw the BS flag on this one. There are plenty of so called "tactical" shovels and pens out there. There would be tactical pencils and butter knives if someone thought they would sell. There are tons of slipjoints that could fit into the "tactical" realm just by looks alone. You just don't get it, it is a label, not a style. At one time it may have been. But now it is just a selling point.