What do large knives do that small ones cannot?

Vivi said:
Confederate, why do you continue to speak blatant misrepresentations about Spyderco? Really, what do you get out of it? Anyone can go look at their catalog and see the Captain, Tasman Salt, Kuhkuri, Barong, Kiwi etc. Anyone can see they offer yellow, orange, purple, green, white, silver, carbon fiber and other handle options.
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Yes, they have been somewhat better about it in some models with various colors, but the knives are boringly similar, wider at the hilt and slimmer towards the tip. The shapes may change subtlely, but they all look very much alike and the blade sizes are very similar. Some knives like the Civilian sport innovative blades, but they make it out of VG-10, all the while saying it's not for utility work. Well, we all know what it's for, but why not make it with a more affordable steel? Discounted it goes for about $130, which is still on the pricey side. Self defense knives don't have to be made of premium steels, after all. What I'd like to see is for Spyderco and Cold Steel (and others) offer the same knives in different colors. And Spyderco needs to get away from the 2- and 3-inchers and offer beefier blade shapes and sizes. I know they're shooting for a cetain look, but I do find the overall look and feel to be somewhat repetitive.

Yes, they make a lot of black handled knives with leaf shaped blades, but it's not like that's ALL they make. You know what? Cold Steel makes a lot of black handled knives too. Why aren't you complaining about that?
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I do complain about that. If a blade is black, fine, but why can't a blade and handle be blue? Or green? CS makes Bowies, they make tantos, spearpoints and offer the same knives at times with the customer's choice of blade size, type and configuration. It's largely a matter of opinion, but I think CS knives are far more attractive and appealing than Spyderco's...still, they could all offer colors. Cold Steel also could add some better steels to their selections.

I clearly demonstrated in response to one of your previous posts the variety of blade shapes Spyderco offers. Look at my EDC rotation even, which is only a sampling of the blade shapes they offer. [/quote]
If you're happy, I'm thrilled. They all look like beans out of the same pod to me. But still, I have nothing against Spyderco. I find some of the Byrd selections to be more reasonably priced, but it all gets down to what one is looking for in a knife. For a utility knife, I'd pick a Spyderco. For self defense, it would be a Cold Steel. I also find their Voyagers and Gunsites to be intriging combinations of both utility and self defense.
 
Tripton said:
No. They don't.


They don't make anything.
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Not this sh!t again...

Spyderco doesn't manufacture a majority of their knives. Rat Cutlery doesn't make ANY of their knives. IIRC, Rowen Manufacturing does.

Nothing wrong with that, the companies design, make available, and provide customer service for their knives.
 
darthsoaker said:
Not this sh!t again...

Spyderco doesn't manufacture a majority of their knives. Rat Cutlery doesn't make ANY of their knives. IIRC, Rowen Manufacturing does.

Nothing wrong with that, the companies design, make available, and provide customer service for their knives.
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Rat Cutlery doesnt claim to make any of their knives personally. Rowen is laser cut into the blade. Rowen Manuf. is also in the USA, and yes, I think that does make a difference.

Jeff Randall and Mike Perrin also have a little more background and integrity rather than internet videos of "Watch me cut a piece of beef brisket with this premium priced piece of mediocre steel."

Who makes Cold Steel knives? Where? Does it say so much on the blade? Why, if they "make" knives that are purported to last for "many years" do they only offer a one year conditional warranty on them?


I am beginning to wonder if Confederate works part time for both Cold Steel and CRKT...and that is fine and dandy. Personally, I like to support companies that support bladeforums.
 
Tripton said:
Rat Cutlery doesnt claim to make any of their knives personally. Rowen is laser cut into the blade. Rowen Manuf. is also in the USA, and yes, I think that does make a difference.
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Does CS claim to make their own knives? I've seen tons of BS from CS, but never a false manufacturing claim.

Many imported knives do not name the factory or company that produced them.

Tripton said:
I am beginning to wonder if Confederate works part time for both Cold Steel and CRKT...and that is fine and dandy.
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No need for that. Confederate is probably just a fan of a companies product, not unlike the hordes of Spyderco or Benchmade fans.
 
darthsoaker said:
Does CS claim to make their own knives? I've seen tons of BS from CS, but never a false manufacturing claim.

Many imported knives do not name the factory or company that produced them.



No need for that. Confederate is probably just a fan of a companies product, not unlike the hordes of Spyderco or Benchmade fans.
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Notice how initially I never said anything about CS EXCEPT pointing out that they do not make their products. It was a simple correction.



Secondly, no need for what? A tongue in cheek statement about someone's undying loyalty for knife companies that are not highly regarded by knife knuts? No harm intended. Clearly.






To avoid further hijacking the thread, I will add that I like the larger knives mainly because I have huge hands. They are more comfortable.
 
Truth be told, I think the largest knife I have is a Delica 4. Might have to get something larger just for kicks.
 
Well, it's not entirely true that CS doesn't make any of their knives. I recall when the Night Force came out and the CS catalog didn't even identify the steel's attributes like they do the others in the front of their catalogs. Not knowing much back then, I called CS and talked to one of their techies. He wasn't exactly a spring of information and he finally admitted he didn't much care for 440A. What happened, he said, was that CS got a chance to buy a big batch of it at a very good price. So they used it to produce the Night Force, the Pro-Lites, Ti-Lites, the Recon 1s and maybe one or two others. After the run was finished, he said, he didn't know which knives would be continued with better steels (sales would determine that) but, he added, he couldn't wait for it to be gone. I subsequently bought every single knife mentioned and found it to be extremely well heat treated. In fact, I don't think I could tell the difference between that and the AUS8 stuff. It sharpened to scary sharp and held its edge for a very long time. When it was gone, the Night Force and Pro-Lites were dumped whilst the Recon 1s and the Ti-Lites continued with the better AUS8.

I don't know who makes CS knives, but I know they exercise a remarkably consistent control over quality. My other 440A knives (Gerber and others) sharpened as well, but lost their edges quickly. One had the Walther name and seemed very well constructed, but its 440A wasn't as good as the 440A in my Cold Steels, even though the black finish was as lustrous as deep bluing on a quality revolver.

Cold Steel accepts the designs and tests the heat treat of its blades, so in my view that's as good as if they made them in the warehouse basement. Smith & Wesson knives, on the other hand, range from piss poor to actually pretty good. I have several knives with 440C steel blades and they keep a decent edge, but the construction suffered, especially in the liner locks. Some cut very well, whilst others would dull in a spring breeze. But I don't think S&W really cares. It's like those ball point pens that have company's names on them. Some are really nice whilst others were throwaways.

I also believe Spyderco exercises tremendous influence over its knives. You just don't get crap in a box from Spyderco. Even their Byrd line should bear the Spyderco name proudly. My first reaction to buying the G10 Cara Cara was, what have I gotten away with? This thing can't cost twenty-something dollars! One of these days, someone with Spyderco is going to get out of bed and say, "We're not charging enough for those things...." Or so I've feared. You slap a bow on one, give it as a gift and it's friends for life. So you've got to give companies like that the ownership they deserve.
 
Confederate said:
Well, it's not entirely true that CS doesn't make any of their knives. I recall when the Night Force came out and the CS catalog didn't even identify the steel's attributes like they do the others in the front of their catalogs. Not knowing much back then, I called CS and talked to one of their techies. He wasn't exactly a spring of information and he finally admitted he didn't much care for 440A. What happened, he said, was that CS got a chance to buy a big batch of it at a very good price. So they used it to produce the Night Force, the Pro-Lites, Ti-Lites, the Recon 1s and maybe one or two others. After the run was finished, he said, he didn't know which knives would be continued with better steels (sales would determine that) but, he added, he couldn't wait for it to be gone. I subsequently bought every single knife mentioned and found it to be extremely well heat treated. In fact, I don't think I could tell the difference between that and the AUS8 stuff. It sharpened to scary sharp and held its edge for a very long time. When it was gone, the Night Force and Pro-Lites were dumped whilst the Recon 1s and the Ti-Lites continued with the better AUS8.

I don't know who makes CS knives, but I know they exercise a remarkably consistent control over quality. My other 440A knives (Gerber and others) sharpened as well, but lost their edges quickly. One had the Walther name and seemed very well constructed, but its 440A wasn't as good as the 440A in my Cold Steels, even though the black finish was as lustrous as deep bluing on a quality revolver.

Cold Steel accepts the designs and tests the heat treat of its blades, so in my view that's as good as if they made them in the warehouse basement. Smith & Wesson knives, on the other hand, range from piss poor to actually pretty good. I have several knives with 440C steel blades and they keep a decent edge, but the construction suffered, especially in the liner locks. Some cut very well, whilst others would dull in a spring breeze. But I don't think S&W really cares. It's like those ball point pens that have company's names on them. Some are really nice whilst others were throwaways.

I also believe Spyderco exercises tremendous influence over its knives. You just don't get crap in a box from Spyderco. Even their Byrd line should bear the Spyderco name proudly. My first reaction to buying the G10 Cara Cara was, what have I gotten away with? This thing can't cost twenty-something dollars! One of these days, someone with Spyderco is going to get out of bed and say, "We're not charging enough for those things...." Or so I've feared. You slap a bow on one, give it as a gift and it's friends for life. So you've got to give companies like that the ownership they deserve.
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Dude this has nothing to do with my original post/question. WTF?
 
David Lowry said:
Can we please keep this on target here folks?

Please stop derailing my thread with arguments.
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It's called discussion. Your original question was answered, there's not much more to say on it so do we need permission to talk about something else? Going on a tangent is perfectly normal
 
Since I'm not in too much danger of a moray eel or grizzly bear attack here in Ft. Worth a 2 1/2" - 3" blade works out just fine for me. :D I currently rotate a small bocote inlaid Sebenza (3") with either a Buck/Mayo TNT (3 1/8") or Waimea (2 1/2") as an edc... That said, nothing wrong with larger blades if that's your cup of tea. You know, different strokes, to each his own, and all that stuff.
 
David Lowry said:
Can we please keep this on target here folks?

Please stop derailing my thread with arguments.
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That's the right thing to do...I apologize for my slight derailment yesterday!

And let's try not to make this another humongous knife community argument. :D
 
I've been wrestling with the question of knife size lately. I've been experimenting with smaller and smaller blades, and have discovered that a very small slipjoint is all you really NEED for most cutting tasks. Unless you are carrying for SD, pretty much any real-world cutting task can be handled efficiently with a Case peanut. If you need to chop something, then you need some blade length, but in most cases, you don't need to chop.

As an experiment, over the weekend, I decided to make a fire with nothing more than a Case tiny-trapper. A tiny-trapper is even smaller than a peanut, and is probably the smallest non-miniature knife on the market, at just over 2.25" closed. Guess what? I was able to easily make a fire using just that tiny little knife. I did quite a bit of batoning with it, just to see if I could. It worked like a charm- I was quite suprised with how much I was able to do. I followed the guidelines that Reid Hyken has posted on Bark River's site, and was able to baton surprisingly large branches, without any damage to my little knife.

This link is the best guide to batoning I've ever seen, and may be the most conclusive evidence that a large knife is not really needed, except in the most extreme circumstances.

http://www.barkriverknives.com/docs/batoning.pdf

The basic premise is that if you keep your handle higher than the point of your blade, you can baton pretty much any knife without damaging it. I tested this theory, and yes, you can baton a slipjoint without the knife even trying to fold, if you pay attention and do it right.

A small knife can cut anything up to the thickness of its main blade, and can usually do it more efficiently than a large knife, because smaller knives tend to have thinner blades and edge geometry.
 
A 4" stockman with a 3" blade give me a big working knife.
A 3 1/2" whittler or a 3 1/4" stockman gives me a good working 2 1/2" blade with two small blades for fine work.

I find I do not have to cut thru an apple, rotating it work just fine to slice thru it!
 
I find a larger 3.5 to 4.5 blade folder for EDC is more functional and practical. I carry a Manix or ZT200 in pocket with a little Byrd on keychain for smaller tasks.
 
moonwilson said:
...a large knife is not really needed, except in the most extreme circumstances.
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Are they necessary for most things? No. But they can make certain tasks a lot easier to perform. I've seen people carve a ball-in-cage using a broad axe to challenge themselves, but it doesn't mean that an axe is the best tool for intricate carving--let alone one of that size.

It's wonderful that you were able to accomplish so much with so little blade, but I'd rather use a larger blade if the option was available to me.
 
FortyTwoBlades said:
It's wonderful that you were able to accomplish so much with so little blade, but I'd rather use a larger blade if the option was available to me.
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Oh, me too. Believe me, I'm a big fan of big blades! I'm just curious about how much work a truly minuscule knife is capable of. Turns out, little knives can do quite a bit. Not that you'd ever catch me with only a little knife on my person. I carry a little Case slipjoint to avoid scaring non-knife people. But that's not ALL I carry. But- I'm starting to think I can get by with a small Sebenza instead of the large. And maybe a Bravo 1 is enough to carry in my bag, instead of a Bravo 2. And whenever there's even a remote chance that I'll be in the woods, a big Busse is still coming along for the ride. :thumbup:

Big knives may not be strictly "necessary", but they sure are fun!
 
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