What do you consider to be a "Custom"?

BePrepared

BePrepared

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I've been on this site for a long time now, and i've noticed that there is a huge array of what can be called "custom" knives.

A few of the definitions i've seen (though not always DEFINED at all)

1. A custom is a knife designed for a specific user, with user chosen steel, shape, construction, etc and is typically a one off

2. A custom is a knife made by an individual maker, that is produced with some customization IE scale material, bolster material, blade material, but the knife itself is based upon an existing design or pattern with only aesthetic changes. Often this general model is reproduced based upon individual ordering.

3. A custom is a knife designed and made by a specific maker, with that maker choosing materials, steels, construction etc. and is made by that persons own hand often dozens, or hundreds are made and sold based upon a specific design with little or no variation on the specific models

4. A custom is a knife designed and made by a specific maker, with that maker choosing materials, steels, construction etc. but made partly by employees or associates and then "finished" by the designer, often dozens, or hundreds are made and sold based upon a specific design with little or no variation on the specific models

5. A custom is a knife designed and made by a specific designer or group of designer but is produced in large quantities by a few (or several) employees with little or no direct contact with the designer or designers.

I have seen every one of these referred to as a "custom knife" so which do you see as custom, and where is the point at which it becomes "production"?
 
OK as a maker this is how I see it. My opinion only.

1,2,3 are custom knives because of the relationship between the maker and the product.

4 is a "mid-tech" knife. I believe Ken Onion coined this phrase to describe knives that were cut, ground, and HT and then the maker/designer does the final fit and finish to insure quality. http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/293969-What-are-quot-Midtech-quot-knives

5 is a production knife. A lot of people may disagree with me here but this is obvious to me.
 
I appreciate the input. I'd really like to hear from other makers on this one, since they are the ones who's reputations are tied to this definition.

Of course, the thoughts of everyone are welcome
 
I think the confusion around the word custom stems from the fact that many makers started off making 100% custom knives and as demand grew they shifted toward more volume based production solutions like CNC and dedicated staff. Rick Hinderer is a perfect example, his knives are of great quality but Rick doesn't grind out the majority of those blades anymore.
 
those types of examples ( i won't give anymore examples to avoid controversy) are what got me thinking about this subject.

There are quite a few incredibly popular "custom" knifemakers, that don't seem to fit the first 3 definitions on my list, but i wasn't sure if what I consider to be "custom" was in line with everyone else
 
I feel it is important to separate custom knife makers and custom knives when asking questions of this nature.
That a custom knife maker chooses to do limited production runs of knives, employing others to make them, in no way diminishes the maker's standing as a maker of custom knives, so long as they continue to do so. I hope that makes sense.
 
Lorien said:
I feel it is important to separate custom knife makers and custom knives when asking questions of this nature.
That a custom knife maker chooses to do limited production runs of knives, employing others to make them, in no way diminishes the maker's standing as a maker of custom knives, so long as they continue to do so. I hope that makes sense.
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It certainly does, so long as the knife in question is sold as a production knife. Lots of people refer to their hinderers or sebenzas as "customs" but if i'm not mistaken, those are effectively production knives
 
I think #1 is the only true custom, #2 & #3 are handmade, & #4 & #5 are factory/production. I think another term should be added and that is "sole authorship" , meaning the same person performs every single step in the process of making the knife. I will add that I don't think it is necessary to make the steel itself or the handle material to be sole authorship. Just my .02.
 
I'd be inclined to agree with William Woods. That's about how I'd put it too. I think there's also gotta be a distinction between sprint run and custom.

I think William Wood's definition works well, because as you move from the maker no longer actually making the knives, they become more of a designer, and as the production ramps up, then it moves from mid-tech to full production.
 
ah- sole authorship!
now that's an interesting topic on its own.
 
I'm gonna agree with Darrin on this one. In the truest sense of the term, only #1 is a custom knife. Probably a lot of the dilution of the word "custom" comes from people who've bought high dollar production knives and then want to justify the cost by calling it a "custom".
 
My definition of a custom knife is a knife designed for a specific person or task, by that person. I do not refer to any of my own knives as custom, as I personally have issues with this practice. I refer to my knives as handmade
 
I pretty much agree with Darrin but #2 is kind of borderline. If you were commissioning a knife, you'd already have a fair idea of the type of knives that maker makes and you'd be selecting them on that basis. So the knife you commission would probably be along the lines of "Just like the one you did for XXXX but with a longer blade, or a little bit wider or X thicker." At which point in this process does this cease to be an existing design or pattern? It's not previously Ht'd blades where you're just attaching different handles etc.
If you look at cars, at what point does a car become "Custom"?
 
darrin sanders said:
I think #1 is the only true custom, #2 & #3 are handmade, & #4 & #5 are factory/production. I think another term should be added and that is "sole authorship" , meaning the same person performs every single step in the process of making the knife. I will add that I don't think it is necessary to make the steel itself or the handle material to be sole authorship. Just my .02.
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Josh Mason said:
My definition of a custom knife is a knife designed for a specific person or task, by that person. I do not refer to any of my own knives as custom, as I personally have issues with this practice. I refer to my knives as handmade
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I agree with Darrin's assessment as well. A "custom", to me, is custom-made for a particular customer. Then there is (again, in my opinion) handmade/handground, and then production.
 
chris975d said:
I agree with Darrin's assessment as well. A "custom", to me, is custom-made for a particular customer. Then there is (again, in my opinion) handmade/handground, and then production.
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BINGO!!!!
I don't like makers trying to glorify their product to self place themselves towards the top of the pack. Handmade is the perfect definition for knives where the. Isomer has zero input on the knife they want.
 
My thoughts:

1. is "Bespoke". Yes, very much in the tailoring sense. (Eg. Can't think of any makers/knives)
2. is "Made to Order". (Eg. Yuna)
3. is "Hand-made". (Eg. Direware)
4. is "Mid-tech". (Eg. Les George's VECP)
5. is "Production". (Eg. Spyderco)

So looking from a tailoring perspective, imo only 1 and 2 can be considered truly custom.
 
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