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what is a "high end" knife
- Thread starter sab13
- Start date
High end is not the highest price but the hightest quality.It won't never be cheap.
An high end gun = Holland and Holland and it will cost over 100.000€
High end knives in Europe Alessio Salsi, most over 1.000$
O9r Korth revolver , over 7.000$ an Dell full integral knife
An high end gun = Holland and Holland and it will cost over 100.000€
High end knives in Europe Alessio Salsi, most over 1.000$
O9r Korth revolver , over 7.000$ an Dell full integral knife
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2009
- Messages
- 2,161
I don't understand. Unless you're buying the knife specifically to have a 'high end' knife, at what point does price have anything to do with the 'level of finish' (e.g custom, high end, semi-production, ect) the knife is? I mean... that's really all it's about at that point, a status symbol. If you like a knife, and the materials are what you desire, you buy it and that is it.
Everything else... is just... pointless.
People will spend they're money how they choose, you spend yours how you choose.
Everything else... is just... pointless.
People will spend they're money how they choose, you spend yours how you choose.
- Joined
- Dec 10, 2006
- Messages
- 5,978
Well....It is difficult to define what specifically classifies as 'high end'. Generally speaking IMO it involves an amount of hand finishing and very high tolerances and attention to detail. I generally refer to Sal Glesser and some of the statements he has made.
The benefit of tight tolerances is usually for long term durability as well as smooth function. Long term durability is difficult to determine in a short term decision. That's why reputation is important.
sal
High dollar knives are high dollar because they cost more to make. It might be materials (Titanium, unubtanium, etc.), it might be tolerances (Chris' has lotsa zeros after the decimal before hitting numbers), it might be labor (carving, engraving, etc.).
Sometmes those differences are difficult if not impossible for even the trained eye to detenct, generally impossible for a new student.
Just because you can't see the difference, doesn't mean it isn't there, sometimes it just means you can't see it.
sal
More profit is usually associated with higher price. That's normal. Profit is usually a percentage of sales price. To think that a high priced auto should garner the same proft as a low priced auto is not in accord with business. It might be the same percentage, but being more expensive, it will be more profit.
Unless you are a manufacturer, familiar with close tolerance manufacturing of heat treated steel & Titanium parts, you are not likely to be able to see all of the differences between one of Chris' knives and others. For example; CRK keeps 0.0005 tolerance on surface grinding. That's one sixth the thickness of a hair. Do you have the knowledsge and equipment to discover that tolerance?
In the end, it's all about trust. CRK took many years to build and maintain their repuation. Built with consistent focus. Even those trying to make a "cheaper" version must "leave out processes" or "soften their tolerance", or they will cost as much.
Rarely do you pay for the "name". That's a bullshit sales pitch made up by the ignorant claiming to offer the same for less. Money valuation between countries might offer a "deal" for a while until the money value balances, but all in all, you will get what you pay for.
sal
Well, I cannot speak for Chris Reeve Knives, but I will offer an opinion.
I've known Chris and Ann for many years. We worked together when Chris was in South Africa.
A CRK knife is not a custom knife, nor is it a production knife. They are in a class by themselves. They've taken many years to develop their reputation.
Each piece is custom made by skilled custom makers. CRK tolerances and standards are the highest I've seen in processes like surface grinding and heat treat. There is a limit to their production capacity.
Chris is pretty anal on quality. "Quality is time. = Time is money". He pays his craftsmen a fair wage, and he charges a fair margin, he gives the world a product like no other. Chris and Ann work hard and they make a good living. "Enormous profits" is an inside joke that Chris and I laugh about. Frankly, I think they'd feel guilty if they made too much money.
The "Market" will determine if his business strategies work, regardless of what they are. If they don't work, adjustments are made....that's how businesses survive.
BTW, the flip side of a "bargain driven" market is manufacturers are forced to import product (export jobs) from China to compete in the need for the "lower price". More complications.
sal
I know CRK is mentioned a lot, but there seems to be a target on their back as to why a knife so plain costs so much. I like to keep these things in mind when looking at a knife to see if it falls in the 'Higher end' knife category.....
1. Materials used
2. Fit and finsih
3. Overall quality (feel)
4. Specific design purpose (this varies since you get Art knives that are also high end but not users)
5. Execution (how does it all fit in place 1+2+3....should eqaul a knife that I can be happy to own and last me a life time)
There are some production knives that hit all the nails. The Spyderco Gayle Bradley is one. I regard it as a high end knife that has been given to us at a great price, there are those out there, but they are far and few between.
The people here have given some great makers and there are THOUSANDS of great knife makers out there that we have not heard of.
The benefit of tight tolerances is usually for long term durability as well as smooth function. Long term durability is difficult to determine in a short term decision. That's why reputation is important.
sal
High dollar knives are high dollar because they cost more to make. It might be materials (Titanium, unubtanium, etc.), it might be tolerances (Chris' has lotsa zeros after the decimal before hitting numbers), it might be labor (carving, engraving, etc.).
Sometmes those differences are difficult if not impossible for even the trained eye to detenct, generally impossible for a new student.
Just because you can't see the difference, doesn't mean it isn't there, sometimes it just means you can't see it.
sal
More profit is usually associated with higher price. That's normal. Profit is usually a percentage of sales price. To think that a high priced auto should garner the same proft as a low priced auto is not in accord with business. It might be the same percentage, but being more expensive, it will be more profit.
Unless you are a manufacturer, familiar with close tolerance manufacturing of heat treated steel & Titanium parts, you are not likely to be able to see all of the differences between one of Chris' knives and others. For example; CRK keeps 0.0005 tolerance on surface grinding. That's one sixth the thickness of a hair. Do you have the knowledsge and equipment to discover that tolerance?
In the end, it's all about trust. CRK took many years to build and maintain their repuation. Built with consistent focus. Even those trying to make a "cheaper" version must "leave out processes" or "soften their tolerance", or they will cost as much.
Rarely do you pay for the "name". That's a bullshit sales pitch made up by the ignorant claiming to offer the same for less. Money valuation between countries might offer a "deal" for a while until the money value balances, but all in all, you will get what you pay for.
sal
Well, I cannot speak for Chris Reeve Knives, but I will offer an opinion.
I've known Chris and Ann for many years. We worked together when Chris was in South Africa.
A CRK knife is not a custom knife, nor is it a production knife. They are in a class by themselves. They've taken many years to develop their reputation.
Each piece is custom made by skilled custom makers. CRK tolerances and standards are the highest I've seen in processes like surface grinding and heat treat. There is a limit to their production capacity.
Chris is pretty anal on quality. "Quality is time. = Time is money". He pays his craftsmen a fair wage, and he charges a fair margin, he gives the world a product like no other. Chris and Ann work hard and they make a good living. "Enormous profits" is an inside joke that Chris and I laugh about. Frankly, I think they'd feel guilty if they made too much money.
The "Market" will determine if his business strategies work, regardless of what they are. If they don't work, adjustments are made....that's how businesses survive.
BTW, the flip side of a "bargain driven" market is manufacturers are forced to import product (export jobs) from China to compete in the need for the "lower price". More complications.
sal
I know CRK is mentioned a lot, but there seems to be a target on their back as to why a knife so plain costs so much. I like to keep these things in mind when looking at a knife to see if it falls in the 'Higher end' knife category.....
1. Materials used
2. Fit and finsih
3. Overall quality (feel)
4. Specific design purpose (this varies since you get Art knives that are also high end but not users)
5. Execution (how does it all fit in place 1+2+3....should eqaul a knife that I can be happy to own and last me a life time)
There are some production knives that hit all the nails. The Spyderco Gayle Bradley is one. I regard it as a high end knife that has been given to us at a great price, there are those out there, but they are far and few between.
The people here have given some great makers and there are THOUSANDS of great knife makers out there that we have not heard of.