What is wrong with pump action rifles?

zenheretic

zenheretic

Joined
Oct 29, 2005
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Whenever someone is considering a (non-semi-automatic and non-bolt action) rifle they almost always reach for lever action models. Other than far more caliber/maker choices, I don't know why folks don't reach for pump action rifles. I know Remington makes a pump action rifle that operates the same as their ultra-recomended 870 pump shotgun. So why don't folks reach for a pump action rifle?

I find the pump action far superior for a quick second shot and when firing prone. So am I missing a flaw or is everyone else missing the boat? :confused:
 
I've got one and I love it! (Old Winchester .22, the one with the exposed hammer.)

It's always been a mystery to me why there aren't more pump action rifles available. If they were available I think people would buy them.
 
I'm with you Zen!!...Pump action rifles are right on the money...I think people are missing the boat on this one.....Doc:D
 
I think it would be neat for either mossberg or remington to make a pump carbine in revolver calibers based on their shotguns. Maybe use the .410 frame. It already feeds rimmed rounds from a tube magazine, so adapting it shouldn't be too hard.
 
Cougar Allen said:
I've got one and I love it! (Old Winchester .22, the one with the exposed hammer.)

It's always been a mystery to me why there aren't more pump action rifles available. If they were available I think people would buy them.
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The classic Winchester and Remington .22 pumps would make anyone love pump rifles. :cool:

I believe Rossi copies some of the old designs...fit and finish isn't near as good but should still be a joy to shoot.
 
SaMX said:
I think it would be neat for either mossberg or remington to make a pump carbine in revolver calibers based on their shotguns. Maybe use the .410 frame. It already feeds rimmed rounds from a tube magazine, so adapting it shouldn't be too hard.
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There are very few pump rifles in pistol calibers. I think Beretta and IMI make them. Unaware of anyone else.

I have been meaning to get a pump rifle in .357 but Berettas are expensive in this case and IMI are rare. :(
 
Dr. Snubnose said:
I'm with you Zen!!...Pump action rifles are right on the money...I think people are missing the boat on this one.....Doc:D
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Hiya Doc...good to see you around these parts.

I still love my Ruger SP101, but have just got into a Kahr PM40. :p
 
There were some problems with the earlier Rems but I don't remember now what the problems were. A lot of real anal rifle people thought accuracy was poor because of the lock-up. Ya they weren't benchrest accuracy but thats not what they were made for. They were made to hunt.
I really like some of the Rem pumps with the various engraving scenes on the recievers, I thought they were classy looking.
Trends have changed, now everyone wants light weight, plastic stock and the latest greatest cartridge that will shoot 3/4 inch groups. Only problem is 95% of people shooting them can't shoot that well....

I would like to have a nice Remington with upgraded wood, engraving on the reciever, quality 2 or 3 leaf express sights and chambered in 338 win mag.. Sweet
 
If one settles for a lever action over a bolt action then one should pick a pump over a lever action...assuming it is available in the desired caliber. A pump design is superior to a lever action for operational purposes...IMO.
 
338375 said:
There were some problems with the earlier Rems but I don't remember now what the problems were. A lot of real anal rifle people thought accuracy was poor because of the lock-up. Ya they weren't benchrest accuracy but thats not what they were made for. They were made to hunt.
I really like some of the Rem pumps with the various engraving scenes on the recievers, I thought they were classy looking.
Trends have changed, now everyone wants light weight, plastic stock and the latest greatest cartridge that will shoot 3/4 inch groups. Only problem is 95% of people shooting them can't shoot that well....

I would like to have a nice Remington with upgraded wood, engraving on the reciever, quality 2 or 3 leaf express sights and chambered in 338 win mag.. Sweet
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As far as accuracy goes, when he was 19, my cousin took a buck with a Remington pump action rifle in 30-06 at what measured out at.........wait for it..............560 yards. Surely there was some luck involved, but the lad is a good shot too. He has taken a couple of dear at what I would be considered max range or more for an inline muzzleloader.
 
I think 338375 has it. It's been a while, but what I can remember from articles I've read in the past the "problem" with pump-action rifles had to do with lock-up and accuracy. Other than that, I can't imagine why they wouldn't be more popular.
 
zenheretic said:
If one settles for a lever action over a bolt action then one should pick a pump over a lever action...assuming it is available in the desired caliber. A pump design is superior to a lever action for operational purposes...IMO.
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I agree, I also like a pump over a Bolt or Lever action. I wish they made more of them.
 
Cimarron makes a copy of the Colt Lightning in 38/357, 44WCF, and 45 Colt.
Beretta makes their copy of the Colt called the Gold Rush in 38/357 and 45 Colt.
Pedersoli makes a copy in 38/357.

LightningRSFullLength.jpg


Also you have the IMI Timberwolf in 38/357 and 44M. We sold a few of these but again had some feeding issues,

357.gif


In rifle calibers Remington makes the 7615 in .223 and the 7600 is available in .270 and 30-06.

remington_7615_police1.jpg


DPMS makes an upper for the AR in .223 in a pump action, the Panther Pump.

dpms_RFA2-PU_ar15.jpg


In firearms that are out of production Universal Made a version of the M1 Carbine in a pump chambered for the 44 mag called the Vulcan. I had one of these but sold it, it had feeding issues.

ZapSnap_001.png


There was a AK made called the PAR-1 that was a pump action AK-47 made during the AWB.

par1a.jpg


And I am sure I am missing some others such as the various rifle calibers and models made by Remington. Also Browning made the Browning BPR in various rifle calibers. Savage made the 170. And there are a slew of 22 rimfires.

Why aren't they more popular? Same reason few people drive a Model T, technology surpassed them. Now before you ask why are pump shotgun so popular then, I will answer that as well. The majority of shotgun are fired less than 10 times a year, you can neglect a pump and it will still work whereas a semi-auto needs more care. Also the recoil in a shotgun is actually helpful in working the action, in smaller calibers that advantage goes away. Most pump rifles lack the accuracy found in bolt actions, semiautos, and even lever actions as well.

I am not knocking the pumps, in places where semi-autos have been made verboten they make sense. I thought about buying one of the Remington 7615 for a car gun till I discovered they had feeding issues. (proper R&D could solve that) For SASS I think one of the Colt Lightning copies would be great. Pumps are much like revolvers these days, most people want the newest and most faddish.
 
Thanks for the info. Lever guns seem to be on the increase in popularity...partly due to the cowboy action interests...so the obsolescence of the pump theory doesn't quite hold true for my thinking. Didn't know about feeding issues as have only experienced .22 pumps and shotguns so that is just the type of info I was looking for. You mentioned the Remingtons having issues...is that the latest releases or something back in your gun store days?
 
I had one of those Remington .22 pumps as a kid; great gun. Reliable and accurate.

For those with long memories, Chuck Connors' The Rifleman show had an episode where the "inventor" of the above-depicted Colt Lightening showed up to challenge Lucas to a shooting contest to see which design was better.
Lucas won, of course....
 
The Remington issues have been with the new 7615. Those I know who bought them seem to feel a longer feed ramp may be the cure. Otherwise they say buy a bunch of mags and go through them till you find ones that work well, they need to lock in as high as possible for reliable feeding. As I have always said, never buy a gun when it first comes out, gun companies these days seem to think customers should be unpaid R&D testers.

As for th popularity of the lever over the pump is SASS...I think the price factor may be a big part of that. For the price of one of the Lightning copies you could buy a couple of levers.
 
I have been meaning to pick up a Remington 7615p but I am waiting for something in a little bigger caliber. Hopefully a 308. The only professional training I have ever had was a 3 day tactical shotgun course. And as of right now if I had to run out of the house with a long gun I would forego my HK G3 and take my Rem 870. I am just more comfortable with it.
 
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Looking closely at the Remington 7615, I see it comes in 223 Remington so that makes it about worthless. At least they could have done it in Nato 223...geez.

I could swear they had a 308 pump. That sucks they should make one. Mossberg used to make one back in the day.
 
zenheretic said:
Looking closely at the Remington 7615, I see it comes in 223 Remington so that makes it about worthless. At least they could have done it in Nato 223...geez.

I could swear they had a 308 pump. That sucks they should make one. Mossberg used to make one back in the day.
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The 7516p I know for a fact shoots the 5.56 Nato round. I have seen it shot loaded with a AR-15 magazine loaded with military 223.
 
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