What is your minimum steel?

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fishbulb

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Sep 18, 2001
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It is fairly common around here to see people say things like "I really like the design, I would buy one if it wan't only (steel)" or "It is a great knife, except for the (steel) blade".

Granted that all steels are tradeoffs, so the idea of a "best" steel is hard to nail down, but there is sort of an accepted hirearchy that I have noticed, starting with 420, then 440 and AUS series, then stuff like 154CM and ATS34, and finally "super steels" like S30V and BG42.

So what do you consider the minimum steel that you will accept in a knife?

Personally, I have no problem with 420HC for light user blades or pocket knives. I find 440A and AUS6 to be just fine for most uses. And 440C is my favorite steel that I have used.

I actually wish they would make more high end knives out of 440C or other true cutlery steels rather than all this super-hard stuff they use.
 
You're right -- "minimum" steel is hard to define. In your accepted hierarchy, for example, I'll buy AUS-8 (jump at the chance to do so, in fact), and I'll settle for ATS-34, but I won't buy BG-42.

In order to answer your question, I'd probably have to figure out my own hierarchy -- but I'd have to have a couple of them, since I'll pick AUS-6 over 440V if I'm living near water, and I'd pick AUS-8 over almost anything else except when I need a really hard-use knife.

But to give you a totally subjective answer... probably AUS-8 or 1075, with the caveat that there are lots of steels higher up in your hirearchy that I just don't want.
 
Alot of people complain about AUS6 but I like it in a user. 1095 works good also and my favorite is 52100 (nonstainless). I just can't bring myself to buy one of those super hard steels.


Dean
 
Dean - why is it that you cant bring yourself to buy oone of the super hard steels?

My EDC is a small sbenza with an S30V blade and it touches up quite easily on my sharpmaker.

I am not sure I would want it to get really blunt however.
 
I don't really have any minimums, especially when it comes to production knives. I've had well heat-treated 420HC that worked great, and badly heat-treated 154CM that was good for nothing. I judge each knife on its own merits.
 
Harvey, to be honest it's a sharpening thing. I have no trouble maintaining the steels I listed but I'm afraid I will not be able to maintain a good edge on a harder steel blade. I maintain my users very well and I almost never let them get dull but when they do I can get them back. BG-42 or S30V I just don't know.


Dean
 
JamesA, I'm confused here. You say that you would jump at the chance to buy AUS8A, but will settle for ATS34 and will not buy BG42? I like AUS8A a lot, and buy a lot of knives with it. The other part is what confused me. ATS34 is an improvement over AUS8A(given proper heat treat), and BG42 is even better yet. Why, what do you have against BG42. More difficult to sharpen maybe?

By the way, my minimum steel is 440A and AUS6. I do not like 420HC.
 
My "minimum steel" is AUS-6, but my "favorite" steel is VG-10.
 
Minimum would by 420 or 440a. Aus8 as heat-treated and serrated by Cold Steel has never failed me.
 
I have a Cold Steel Peace Keeper made of 420. Because it's just for having a dagger 420 is ok, but i wont take it for a user knife, because its just to soft.
My favourite steel is M2 (on a BM 814). It's very hard (62 Rockwell) but I can resharp it easyly (razor sharp). VG-10 should be great too, but I hadn't a chance to test it, because all the knives i have, which are made of VG-10 should stay in new condidion. And of coures 154 is also great!
About A2, S30V, Bg-42 I don't have an opinion how good they are, because I don't have any knives made of.

So my minimum for a user would be 440C or ATS-34/154.
 
Generally, I go with the higher end steels, like 154CM and ATS34, but depending on the knife I will go lower, like 440C on the Griptilians.
 
My favorite is a tie between M2 and S30V, but that's one of two different questions:

1. What is your favorite steel?
And those would be my answer

2. What are Thom's favorite steels?
And those would be the correct answers

Sorry. Had to.
 
If the price is OK, I'll go for anything but 420J2. The HC version of this steel, Aus-6 and 440A are acceptable - as long as the knife is inexpensive. But I sure wish CRKT would use better materials in most of their knives, because I think their design and worksmanship can almost match Benchmade's, while the steel certainly can't. So as long as their as cheap as they are today, I still consider them very fine products.
 
Satainless steel is AUS 8
Carbon steel is any tough tool steel(L6, O1, 5160, etc.)
 
I would say that it depends on the price.

  • $1 - $40: 1095/420HC/AUS6
  • $41 - $75 : AUS 8/440C
  • $76 - $115: ATS-55/VG10 & Equivalent
  • $116 - $200: ATS-34/154CM/D2/CPM 440V
  • $200+ : The latest/greatest steel - BG42/S30V/etc
  • $600+ : Something very special - damascas, hand forged, talonite, etc.
These are only rough figures, but are a good guide to what I expect in a knife.

Like it or not, steel type is a selling point in knives - much like gigahertz is in computers or horsepower is in cars.
For example, if BMW produced a new 7-series that had all the best luxury features - leather interior, all wheel drive, traction control, 300 airbags, top end bose audio, etc, but only had 140hp, sales would probably be pretty poor - even if 140hp is enough for 95% of daily driving use.

Likewise, if Dell were to sell a luxury computer with a 70" plasma screen display, the latest graphics and sound card, a huge amount of hard drive space and ram, but only a 500mhz processor, sales would be poor - even if 500mhz is enough for 95% of internet and word processing use.

If you buy an expenive item, you expect it to have expensive features, and you don't expect the manufacterer to "cut corners" - even if it probably won't effect you.

When I hear about disappointment in a knife's steel, I think about what I would want for the price.

I think a lot of the complaints about CRKT knives are not that AUS 6 is particularily bad, but that it would not increase the cost significantly to upgrade to AUS 8.

Another example is the new Ralph/Wilson Combat series, which is a very cool knife. It was advertised as having D2 steel, but when it came out it was 440C. Darrel Ralph says that with the heat treat - 440C performs at similar levels to D2, and if he says it's true, I believe him.

While 440C can be a great steel, IMHO it can be outperformed by many other "fancier" steels.

Even if a different steel increased the cost, I don't think it would hurt sales much. Actually, if it were switched to S30V and the cost went up by $50, I bet it would sell better. Not that I don't highly respect Darrel Ralph and his folders, it's just that 440C does not meet my minimum standards for a $275 knife.

Just my $.02

-- Rob
 
It's fairly rare that I'd say that. I don't mind 420HC, as long as it has a good heat treat on it. It seems that Kershaw Scallion & Chive are 420HC, but they're still very sharp.
Of course, I have reservations for Cold Steel's 420 sub-zero quench... after hearing so many people's comments about it.
 
Originally posted by Buzzbait
I don't really have any minimums, especially when it comes to production knives. I've had well heat-treated 420HC that worked great, and badly heat-treated 154CM that was good for nothing. I judge each knife on its own merits.
Click to expand...

Amen. I agree completely.

It also depends on what the knife will be used for. Is it a light duty pocket carry? A sharpened prybar? A tactical folder?
 
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