What knife is this?

I

Indianbladenoob

Joined
Feb 8, 2012
Messages
598
Could the experts identify this blade for me?
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The overlay on the picture that lists the store number tells me it's part of a network of online companies from mainland China, and a little research confirms it.

I doubt that the knife itself has a name, and I doubt the company that makes it has a name, in the same way as, say, Strider or Kershaw.

There has been a lot of debate here about these companies. Some of it is about trademark and copyright infringement, and doesn't really apply right now.

Some have had poor experiences with the steel quality and heat treatment from these companies, and that is something to worry about.

Overall, the handle looks comfortable and the blade geometry ought to make it a good slicer, provided it will take and hold a sharp edge.
 
Thanks shorttime,

It is from a Chinese website. Usually they have unidentifiable folders with famous brands on them or obvious ripoffs of famous designs.. And its not difficult to tell most of the time what brand/model they are ripping off. The number of Sebenza clones is staggering. And they claim the blade on those is made of D2 at 60-62 HRC! I would not buy an obvious clone like that and cannot afford a Sebbie or an XM-18 by Hinderer (which is another highly ripped-off design).

I just could not identify the designer/maker of the original knife. I liked the look of it and it also claims to be made of D2 at 60hrc. IF that is true, it should, as you said, take and hold a decent edge. I thought it might me something copied from Spartan Blades considering the logo on the blade but I was wrong.

Maybe I am just trying to justify it to myself but $47 shipped to India for a D2 blade is very economical and tempting. I mean my Kershaw Crown set me back $45 shipped to India (Off Knifecenter). But there's a part of me that baulks at buying a ripoff. The "Navy" versions of Spyderco Designs for eg.

I do like the design but I might let this one pass.................
 
I've definitely seen the design but i can't quite place it. It looks a bit like a spyderco street beat . . anyways if it's really D2 i say go for it and don't worry about the ethics. I buy expensive american made knives and i buy cheap chinese made blades but i have never not bought an expensive knife because a cheap one was available. dunno.
 
Fifty bucks says it isn't D2, and another fifty says the Rockwell hardness is below 55. If steel that good was available in China, the Byrd line would be using it.
 
Oh I love my cheap knives. I consider myself a user, not a collector but that's just because entrepreneurship doesn't exactly leave the the disposable income to afford the expensive "collector" stuff. YMMV but it would still pain me to do to a Hinderer what I do to my Kershaws even though the Hinderer will probably take the abuse better.

Speaking of this blade, the design is what captured my eye. Its beautiful and simple and would make sense even if it was in a lesser steel. The seller on the site is willing to guarantee that it is D2 for whatever that is worth. Specs
Total length: 163mm
Blade length: 79mm
Blade thickness: 3.5mm
Blade steal: D2
Handle material: G10
Hardness: 60HRC
Net weight: 131G
With Scabbard. (appears to be Kydex.)
 
yablanowitz said:
Fifty bucks says it isn't D2, and another fifty says the Rockwell hardness is below 55. If steel that good was available in China, the Byrd line would be using it.
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Yes! Precisely how would I find out that it is or is not D2 let alone the Rockwell hardness. That's why I haven't pushed the button.
Doesn't the byrd line use Chinese steels? In fact I am told the Cara Cara 2 is actually hardened to >60hrc.
 
yablanowitz said:
Fifty bucks says it isn't D2, and another fifty says the Rockwell hardness is below 55. If steel that good was available in China, the Byrd line would be using it.
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The Kershaw Outcast was made in China out of D2 steel.

Oh, guess what, VG-10 is available for Chinese makers now because Japan lifted the export restriction a few years ago. Boker, Browning and Camillus use it.

9Cr13CoMoV is also another good quality steel available in China, used by Benchmade.

So yes, steel "that good" is available in China.
 
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Indianbladenoob said:
I am thinking at the price maybe I should risk it.................
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You are indeed risking your money and of getting a POS knife for the price. What you are not risking is the support you will be giving to a company that has no problems having folks pull their socks up, so to speak. I wouldn't even accept that knife as a gift. :thumbdn:
 
Haze said:
You are indeed risking your money and of getting a POS knife for the price. What you are not risking is the support you will be giving to a company that has no problems having folks pull their socks up, so to speak. I wouldn't even accept that knife as a gift. :thumbdn:
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As I said in my earlier post, my moral compass is what is keeping me from buying it. I do have a strong opinion on copied designs.
My thought was it would be ok if it is not a copy of someone's design/brand. But I cant be entirely sure can I, considering the sheer number of CRK and Hinderer clones floating around.

like em sharp said:
The Kershaw Outcast was made in China out of D2 steel.

Oh, guess what, VG-10 is available for Chinese makers now because Japan lifted the export restriction a few years ago. Boker, Browning and Camillus use it.

9Cr13CoMoV is also another good quality steel available in China, used by Benchmade.

So yes, steel "that good" is available in China.
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If they have the material and the expertise, why cant they make original designs? I have read the fan thread for Bee, Enlan, Navy etc. They seem to be well appreciated, but even they copy Spyderco, Benchmade and Kershaw designs. Thinly veiled too.

What if I made a knife myself to this design or had a smithy do it here? A single "custom" piece That's what I like about it, anyway.
 
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I wouldn't buy a coffee table from a crack dealer on the grounds that I would still be supporting a crack dealer.....

As to the "why" of China and coppies, try and spend a bit of time there one day and you will know all about it. I have seen enough in my time living in Asia to know that I will never go back to China and I personally want nothing to do with the country, where ever possible of course.

Indianbladenoob said:
As I said in my earlier post, my moral compass is what is keeping me from buying it. I do have a strong opinion on copied designs.
My thought was it would be ok if it is not a copy of someone's design/brand. But I cant be entirely sure can I, considering the sheer number of CRK and Hinderer clones floating around.



If they have the material and the expertise, why cant they make original designs? I have read the fan thread for Bee, Enlan, Navy etc. They seem to be well appreciated, but even they copy Spyderco, Benchmade and Kershaw designs.

What if I made a knife myself to this design or had a smithy do it here? A single "custom" piece That's what I like about it, anyway.
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Haze said:
I wouldn't buy a coffee table from a crack dealer on the grounds that I would still be supporting a crack dealer.....

As to the "why" of China and coppies, try and spend a bit of time there one day and you will know all about it. I have seen enough in my time living in Asia to know that I will never go back to China and I personally want nothing to do with the country, where ever possible of course.
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So not the product, the seller. And the implication that all that comes out of China (knifewise at least)is, in terms of design, material or engineering, a rip-off of some sort? Are there really NO original modern knife designs coming out of China?
Honest question. I have never been to China and probably never will go.

Aaaand the discussion got so much wider so quick...........................
Do I see this thread being moved?
 
There isn't really much more to make of it. The people that make these knives are just trying to pump out something to sell that they know is popular, or at least they know the original is. I frankly make no distinction between those that make these knives and those that sell them. They are as bad as each other IMO. They couldn't give two hoots about the knife industry or the people in it, I do however.

There are custom makers in China that make good quality knives, of course there is. There are lying BS artists as well though. I will never by a production knife made in China but do own hand made knives from people I know to be solid individuals. It doesn't take too much digging to figure out who is who. I just find it hard to get over and have an extremist opinion pehaps as I have actual experience of how things are really done over here and felt the burn. I have lost money through shady business practices and have had favors I did for alleged friends spat back in my face so it's easy for me to be a "hater". :)

Indianbladenoob said:
So not the product, the seller. And the implication that all that comes out of China (knifewise at least)is, in terms of design, material or engineering, a rip-off of some sort? Are there really NO original modern knife designs coming out of China?
Honest question. I have never been to China and probably never will go.

Aaaand the discussion got so much wider so quick...........................
Do I see this thread being moved?
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The shape looks loosely like any one of a number of homebaked offerings. As far as factory knives go it looks like exactly what I'd anticipate if I knew Boker Plus had released something inspired by a Swamp Rat Vex. For the measly price, proved the heat treat was good, I wouldn't care if it came in 12C27 or 8Cr13MoV rather than D2, I could still get work out of it. D2 at 60 HRC would scoop the bonus points though.
 
Indianbladenoob said:
Decision made.
I'm making my own out of 3mm thick band saw blade. Or at least try :)
I have a piece.
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Oh boy, you have a long month ahead of you if you want to try Knife making.
My advice is, take it slow, and buy quality files and sandpaper.
Even buying a cheap 1 x 30 HF belt sander would help quite a bit.

Send out to Darrin Sanders for heat treat, he won't disappoint.
 
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