What next? (Looking for a strong mid-size folder)

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pharminator

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Nov 23, 2014
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As this is a really long post, here is a quick summery. Read below for more detail.

Looking for a mid-sized folder that sits between a Spyderco Cat and BK-10 in duty tasks. My main criteria are:
  • Heavier duty than a Sypderco Cat
  • Deep Pocket Carry
  • Good to superior steel
  • Non-serrated
The following knives are on my radar:
  • Kershaw Cryo II
  • Spyderco Delica4
  • Spyderco Centofante3
  • Spyderco Paramilitary4
Read below for my takes on each knife and where I’m leaning.

Longer Version

My Current Collection (Ordered from light --> heavy duty)
  • Spyderco Grasshopper
  • Kershaw Leek
  • Spyderco Dragonfly2
  • Spyderco Cat
  • Becker BK-10
I have a spectrum for my EDC choices. On one end is my little Spyderco Grasshopper, and at the other is a BK-10 (obviously not an EDC, but it can step in for really heavy duty tasks). I’m actually pretty happy with all the knives in this rotation as they all fill a particular niche. The Grasshopper is carried for the most discrete occasions, Dragonfly 2 in the middle, and the Spyderco Cat for when I want an EDC with a little more meat on its bones. The Leek sits in a really weird zone for me. It’s a fun little knife with decent steel that sharpens up great, but the blade geometry bugs me. With such a long, thin blade, there is almost no belly of the blade to cut with, and I find I’m cutting with the extremely fine tip most of the time. I’ve also heard that tip has a tendency to snap. This relegates it to light duty cutting. The clip annoyed me to the point of taking it off. It carries too high in my pocket, and on days I’m wearing jeans I just toss it in the pocket.

So, why am I back to the knife purchasing well? Same reason why we’re all here, we just can’t get enough. I find that I have my knives laid out, and I pick the one that I think will be most suitable to the day ahead. For example, I knew I was spending this week at my mom’s, and I knew there would be a host of little jobs to do, so I bought my Cat along for the week as it was small enough for discrete EDC, but strong enough to handle heavier household tasks than the Leek (or D2, though it can probably do more than I would give it credit) could accomplish.

In looking for my next knife, I want something that fits above the Cat in a folder. For really heavy use, I have the formidable and awesome BK-10, but I want something in folder that sits somewhere between those two. I have some criteria that need to be fulfilled.

  • Heavier duty than a Syperco Cat
  • Deep Pocket Carry
  • Good to superior steel
  • Non-serrated
Now, let’s talk about what has caught my eye so far. As you can see from my collection, I’m a Spyderco fan. I really find their quality/price ratio to be quite good. I also love their blade geometry for the most part and I prefer a Spyderhole to a thumb stud. So here is my current short list.

Kershaw Cryo II
This knife has been on my radar since the very beginning days of knife fever. The shape of the blade really appeals to me on a number of levels. First and foremost, it has a nice, strong point, but there is a great belly behind it so if I’m cutting a material on the surface, I can use it instead of the point to cut. This is a big plus for me. I also like frame locks. From my understanding (and correct me if I’m wrong) it a strong type of lock, but it can be easily operated one-handed. Speedsafe is fun and it has a thoughtfully designed clip that will allow very deep pocket carry. Unfortunately, I Canada, the price on this knife is much higher ($46 CAD) than the US and I don’t want to deliver to states and bring it across as I don’t want to explain to a customs officer why speedsafe is not considered a switchblade.

Spyderco Delica 4
This knife needs no introduction. Love the steel (VG10) and it’s been a cornerstone in the EDC world for 25+ years. I see many positives but here are the concerns that I have about the knife.
  • Relatively flat blade. It reminds me of the reasons why I don’t like the Leek (but to a lesser degree). Am I too paranoid about this?
  • Non-wire clip. It will carry higher in my pocket than my D2 or Cat.
  • Back lock. Not that there’s anything inherently wrong with a back lock, but they are more prone to blade play (my experience with my D2) and they are harder to operate one-handed.
  • Oddly, the knife doesn’t speak to me. It’s a weird intangible, but I’m not immediately drawn to the design.
I don’t know if any of these concerns are valid.

Spyderco Centofante 3
This is the knife on the least that I know the least about. I have watched a couple of reviews, and they was quite favorable. I like the VG-10 steel, blade geometry (again, and I overly concerned with overly flat blades??), and overall look of the blade. Concerns are:
  • Riveted construction. No tightening or dismantling possible.
  • Back lock
  • I have heard rumors about quality control issues
Spyderco Paramilitary 2
It’s almost not fair to put this knife of the list considering the huge disparity in price. Basically, I looked at the Delica 4 and Para 2 and looked at why I would like the Para 2 more, and would those be worth the large increase in price.
  • Big upgrade in steel. (CPM-S30V vs VG-10)
  • Compression lock (love, love, love it compared to back lock)
  • I prefer the blade geometry
  • Likely a much heavier duty knife
For me, the Para2 hits every bullet point for what I’m looking for in this new knife’s role. Due the Spyderco’s weird pricing in Canada, it’s actually not as crazy as it looks. Doing a quick look among Canadian suppliers, I can get it for ~$150 vs the $90 for the Delica or ~$100 for the Centofante. Obviously I’m spending more, but I’m getting waaay more knife. Knowing this is the dream knife on my list, could I be satisfied with any of the other knives?

So, does anyone have any advice? Anything that should be on my list that’s not? I would prefer to keep is sub-$100 CAD (~80 USD) but I’d be willing to go higher if something like the Para2 blew my socks off. Thanks!!
 
I honestly would go for a benchmade griptilian or if you can find a benchmade 710 for a good price. Both are great knives and heavy duty folders. The grip can be found for around $80 and has 154cm bladesteel, holds an edge well and probably my favorite steel to sharpen due to it being easy to get a hair popping edge. And the 710 is great if you don't mind a larger folder, don't worry about it being d2. Not that hard to sharpen and it doesn't rust that easily with it being a satin blade.
 
I have some grips and a para 2.For heavier use I would choose the grip because the point is stronger.The para feels much more premium in hand and for fine cutting with the tip would be superior.Depending on what you are going to do either is an excellent knife.
I am glad I have both.
 
Wow! The Griptilian wasn't even on my radar. Very, very interesting knife. In comparison to the Delica, I prefer the steel and the lockup. How does 154CM compare to CPM-S30V? Also, how do the lockups compare? I doubt if I would be pushing the Para2 enough to endanger the tip (though I appreciate you bringing that up as it was a huge concern for me in the Leek). I also like the blade geometry and the fact that it has a Spyderhole like deployment. I need to ponder this for a bit. Does it knock the Para2 out? Hmm....
 
You do have to maintain 154cm a little more than s30v but it still holds a good edge and if you have a strop it will be easy to sharpen when it needs it. Both the grip and para2 are solid knives, just depends on if you want to spend the extra money to get a para2 I would say that it has better blade geometry for most use. But not significantly better. Both knives are great for edc.
 
154cm is a decent steel that has been around for a VERY long time.
Ernie Emerson uses it in his products. Protech uses it a great deal.
The steel takes a good edge and can be resharpened rather easily, but is NO match for S30V in edge-holding capability.
Certainly, the parameters of steels that a person finds desirable may depend upon his needs and availability of sharpening tools.
 
I've edcd my light weight manix 2 in bd1 for a month or so and can't get it out of my pocket. It is utterly sufficient. Worth a consideration. 2 youtubers I think highly of, nutnfancy and Gideon's Tactical, both have videos out there that are worth a watch and might sway you in, what I think is, a good direction.
 
The Manix2 looks like a great blade, love the shape and geometry, plus I heard that the ball bearing lock is pretty phenomenal. Another great plus is that it has Spyderco's wire clip, which I love on my Dragonfly2 and Cat. When I did a quick pricing, I'm only seeing it $15 less than the Para2.

For sharpening, I have the Sharpmaker with Medium, Fine, and Extrafine stones.

I have to say I'm pretty enamoured with the Paramilitary 2. It just looks oh-so-pretty and it does have the materials and workmanship to back it up. Both the Manix2 and the Griptilion look like fantastic knives, but the Para2 is still winning out as far as I can tell. The Griptillion looks like an extremely solid knife, and I'll probably revisit it after I let my funds build up again. And with regards to the Para2, I'm not in a particular hurry to buy, I just want to expand my collection, and a robust mid-sized folder is something that I don't have yet. I appreciate all the advice so far, and I'm definitely interested in seeing alternatives that I haven't considered yet.
 
Jurgs18 said:
I've edcd my light weight manix 2 in bd1 for a month or so and can't get it out of my pocket. It is utterly sufficient. Worth a consideration. 2 youtubers I think highly of, nutnfancy and Gideon's Tactical, both have videos out there that are worth a watch and might sway you in, what I think is, a good direction.
Click to expand...

Appreciate the insight on your experience. Love the look of the Manix 2, and as you can tell, I'm a big Spyderco fan. I'll pop over to and have a look at Nutnfancy and Gideon to see what they have to say. I also like The Late Boy Scout, and I'll see if he's looked at that knife too.
 
I would do this...
...in fact, I DID. Very happy with it.
However, given that you are a younger person, and this is rather expensive (~$300). If you're not working full-time, then your choice of a Spyderco PM2 makes good economic sense. Great choice of steels available, and can start at about $100 for one in S30v. I have one (in camo G10), and only one at this time, although I once had a nice collection of PM2's and Military models, and they are both great folders with heavy-duty capability.
There are so many GOOD folders out there, that you should have fun in looking and choosing. Lots of good suggestions so far...
http://www.bladehq.com/item--Spyderco-Slysz-Bowie-Frame-Lock--20415
 
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Sorry to throw another option at you, but I'd check out the Buck Marksman, or the Benchmade Bone Collector 15020 (discontinued though so you'll have to look a bit).
 
I just went to my local knife store here in good ole san gabriel valley
and I'd say you should take a look at either the Benchmade Mini-Barrage or the Mini-Griptilian.
The thing I liked about Benchmade is the Axis lock which makes closing & opening the blade a Breeze
I was astounded by Benchmades quality.

I'm seriously considering a Benchmade Barrage M390 :D
 
pharminator said:
Mmm, it grabbed my attention with the Spyderco wire clip. Why don't they put that on all their knives?? Unfortunately, it's a bit out of my price range at the moment, but thanks for the suggestion.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry I threw you a curve ball with that expensive knife. I didn't mean to.

The wire clip is on MANY of their knives, and I've never had the first problem with any... I actually prefer them; they are light, strong, flexible, durable, and tend to be much more difficult to spot on your pocket than a more "conventional" pocket-clip. They are easy on your pocket, and I've never even come close to losing a folder with that clip.
I love Caly models and Sage models and they all sport those clips also. Many of their more "massive" folders also use the exact same style of clip, and I love 'em.
BTW, the Spyderco Sage 2, all titanium scales, is one of my very favorite knife models...EVER. About $165 new, but you can find them quite often on our Exchange...as-new...for about $130. They really are great knives....in S30v.
:)

some pics of the Sage 2...and of the Para 2 (PM2)...


 
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Many thanks to the forum for your advice. It certainly gave me a lot to think about. I watched a few comparison videos between the Manix2 and Paramilitary2, and it seems both are exceptional knives, and it seems to come down to use and personal preference. Benchmade Griptillion has its legion of fans as well, and it has been added to my “May Purchase Someday” spreadsheet. So, after sleeping on it, and giving it a lot of thought today, I’ve come to the following conclusion.

Based on my original criteria, the Manix2 is probably the better choice. Considering it carries the same steel as the Para2, it should have similar edge and strength characteristics. As the Spyderco Cat is probably my favourite folder at the moment, the Manix is most similar in that it is a “super-leaf” shaped blade and would likely have more tip durability and a good belly to cut with. Both are available in G10 scales with metal liners (I forgot to mention I wanted metal liners) so it would be equal to the Para2 in that respect. It also has a innovative and strong lockup, so it ticks that box as well.

So in the end, the logical part of my mind says to buy the Manix2. But my heart still yearns for the Para. It’s such an iconic design from my favourite company (so far). It just screams awesome and it has lots of curb appeal. The Manix is more “quietly awesome”. Nothing wrong with that at all, but at this moment, for this purchase, I think I’m still leaning towards the Paramilitary. As I said, I’m not running out to buy it next week, but will probably give it a month to percolate so there’s lots of time to mull over my decision. But boy, would I love to reach into my pocket and pull at that G10 Cammo version coupled with that gorgeous blade.

Thanks again to everyone for their views and suggestions. It gave me a lot to think about and I've added a few entries to my list of knives to consider!
 
One more thing to consider, neither the G10 Manix 2, nor the Para 2, have a deep carry clip. Due to the clip location though, the Manix 2 rides significantly lower in the pocket, a bonus if you're trying to be somewhat discreet. In either case, if you get the satin blade you will get a mirror polished pocket clip which definitely draws attention to the knife in your pocket. The black bladed versions come with a black clip. Another option would be to replace the clip with a titanium one which I've found blends in better than either of the factory clips.

Overall, I find my Manix to be more comfortable in-hand and prefer the blade shape. My Para operates more smoothly and I prefer the compression lock. If I had to choose one it would be the Manix, but you really can't go wrong with either one as far as I'm concerned.

You might also consider hunting down a Superleaf. They're discontinued but were a great design. The fit and finish isn't on par with the Manix and Para but it's still pretty nice. I'd love to see it reintroduced in an upgraded version made in either Golden or Taichung.
 
Buck Vantage Pro in s30v should definitely get some consideration with what you're after.

Ergo's are good, steel is great, deep pocket clip, definitely more HD then the cat in every way, price is right, and has nice flipper action too though I'm not sure how that fares with regards to the law in your portion of Canada? Also a great no questions warranty...
 
Bear OPS Rancor, mc-100 series are a solid option in s30v as well that should fit your budget without a flipper; Not true deep pocket clips, but close to it.

A couple more options to throw in the hat.
 
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