What to do when you pay and then get blown off by a knifemaker?

Hale Storm

Hale Storm

Kydex Whisperer
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Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
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Simple question really. I posted on the forum looking for a particular type/style blade. Was pm'd by a new, novice maker here. After some discussion and pics, decided to order and sent the money. Money order requested to 'keep knife funds separate from house funds'. No sooner than the money got there, the communication drops off. After a few emails, I get a story about the wife leaving and a pending divorce and all that jazz about my knife being delayed and no real dates anymore. Okay, I've been there. Take care of the family I say, especially the kids. My little knife can wait.
Trying to be patient and understanding and let the timeline get dragged out beyond what was agreed to before the money was sent. Now a few emails in the past few days to follow up and nothing. No response. Sent one to personal email. No response. Sent one through BF email. No response. On the other hand, the maker has posted a time or two on the forums since my emails were sent.

At what point do I post publicly here since I've been taken? I'm not a hard guy to get along with and try to keep my word all the time, every time. At some point, I even said the maker could just refund my money and not worry about it. No hard feelings. Get the family stuff and your own mental state squared away. Thought I've done everything right so far on my end.

No need for names yet. No refund. No knife. No communications.

I know many have been through this here so what is the reasonable, HONORABLE thing to do?
 
I don't think there is an excuse for blowing a paying customer off. But in Good, Bad, and the Ugly (GBU), down below, they tell people to NEVER pay upfront. I suggest you ask a mod to move this to GBU.

To the guy above: OP seems to say he paid my money order.
 
Who is the maker? There might be others in the same boat who haven't surfaced yet. The Money order thing makes it suspicious to me since you can keep you paypal account separate from the rest of your money without issues. Not to mention the lack of communication and the excuses.......
 
Hale Storm, in cases like this I tend to look towards the environment I am in, and was in, when I made the deal. Having said that just look at the rules of the 'for sale' forums. Blade Forums makes it pretty straightforward, say what you will do, and do what you say. (of course I'm paraphrasing here, but that's the jist) so being as this is the 'community' where you made the deal, I think based on what you have relayed it is certainly time to 'out' this maker.

One other thing I might suggest, is seek out, directly, the advice of one of the mods, either in the forum where you struck the deal, or in this forum, where you posted.

Best wishes to all concerned in this post--and hopes for an equitable outcome.
 
dfarmerknives said:
NEVER PAY UP FRONT!!!!! NEVER!!!!! Ever.....


Did I mention ever?
Click to expand...

As a practical matter the buyer ALWAYS pays up front, as most anybody will expect payment in full before even a ready made item is shipped. So this can happen with an immediate sale in addition to a special order.

The reputation AND feedback of any seller more important in my mind than how it's paid for.
 
I think I would search the forums to see if the knifemaker had good or bad feedback from other people here. I'm assuming you had some evidence that the person was really a knifemaker and not someone posing as a knifemaker to collect deposits. I think knifemakers are more into making knives and less into business, but I've ordered a good number of custom knives and had good luck getting them although it sometimes takes awhile.
 
I had this happen to me on a production knife (not through this form). Unfortunately after 8 weeks of a run around and then no communication I had to file a police report at the sellers local police department. I called them and they put me in touch with the detective in charge of internet fraud. I traveled all over the county for work and was able to meet the detective to give him a statement and copies of e-mails and the money order stub. Lucky for me three weeks later I received a cashiers check from the detective, I guess the seller did not want to be charged with grand larceny in Kentucky. Being polite and understanding with a seller is correct course of action, but if you get no response or a repeated run around do what you have to do to get your hard earned money back. Good Luck!
 
joejeweler said:
As a practical matter the buyer ALWAYS pays up front, as most anybody will expect payment in full before even a ready made item is shipped. So this can happen with an immediate sale in addition to a special order.

The reputation AND feedback of any seller more important in my mind than how it's paid for.
Click to expand...

No. I have ordered a number of custom knives, and have never paid upfront. First the knife is finished, then you pay. (Via paypal just in case!) I have never even had to put down a deposit when ordering a knife.
 
Sorry to hear of your troubles Hale Storm. I never ask for payment upfront even though some customers just send the funds anyway ahead of time. I always show progress pics of the goods usually the day before they ship if I'm doing custom work and then ask for the funds and ship the next day. Heard this story too many times lately and it is a bit disheartening. I can understand some kind of a deposit if the materials are expensive but paying in full upfront leaves too much room for something to go wrong. Hope you get a happy ending.
 
After asking for my money back, I would wait a week for a response.

If I didn't receive a response, I would go ahead and name him here.

No sense in letting him scam anyone else.

Never pay for a knife up front!
 
Sorry to hear that bro. Is that the neck knife you texted me about? If so, it's been a while...

I'd "out" his ass. It's been plenty of time. I'd send him one last email telling him what will happen if your money is not refunded, or a knife is not produced, then wait a few days...

If you don't get a response, expose dat ass. No excuse for that. Not even family problems. Don't return my emails? I'll give you a week. Then you're getting posted as "ugly" on GB&U.
 
Redbeardo, I agree. I have always told my custom order customers that I'm "old school" and will get paid when the work is done (Thanks Dad for teaching me that). I have some customers who pay immediately anyway and a few who always seem to add a little extra. I did the same when I made my order since those type of guys are great customers and I appreciated their business. I wanted to be that guy that trusted the maker, and is a stand up person when I'm the seller/maker.
I did hear from him tonight and my patience is still there. He may have even read my post and knows about this because the emails came quickly.
I still refuse to out him because I don't think I'm there quite yet.
Reading everyone's responses has made me feel I should take the high road and wait a little longer. If I'm going to out somebody here, you can be damn sure that I'm sure it's gone South. If it's the way he say it is, then I genuinely feel for the guy and have been in his shoes when I was younger. I'll wait this one out. I'm still betting he's a good guy in a bad situation, and for that, I'll stand pat for the moment.
THANKS for everyone's input. My mind is a little more at ease.
 
AntDog - Always good to hear from you. I agree with what you said but if you read my post, maybe I'm jumping the gun. I'm not on the timeline that you stated so even by your standards, I need to wait a little longer.
 
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