Whats the deal with the Armed Forces folder?

StuntDouble

StuntDouble

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TJT,

I came across this thread, http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=407586 discussing the Armed Forces folder, and I must admit, there is a strong resemblance to the Strider and CRKT M16 folders. I understand that there are going to be similarities among some knives, but that handle looks very similar to the Strider style. Could you shed some light on origins of the design?
 
There's really nothing to be explained because there's no explanation or excuse. The front of the handle and blade are stolen shamelessly from the CRKT M16, the rear end of it from Strider. I never thought either of those handles looked too good, but when you put them together :barf:
 
Unless I find out that Boker got the "OK" from Strider & Kit Carson/CRKT, I've lost all respect for them as a knife company.

Best wishes,
3G

P.S. Thank you, Chris, for asking the question here.:thumbup:
 
3Guardsmen,

No need to thank me. I figure it couldn't hurt to ask. Boker seems like they're a rather reputable company, with enough original designs of their own. Even looking through their Magnum line, I couldn't find anything that I would call a knockoff. They even got permission from Spyderco to use the opening hole on one of their higher end folders. I guess we'll have to wait and see what info TJT may have on the subject.
 
Man, to think that at one time Boker had Walter Brend designing for them.

Now they stoop to this. What a drag.
 
Everyone knows the so-called PX Shops that you can find on U.S. military bases all over the world. U.S. soldiers can buy additional equipment, like knives, privately. Aside from the regular manufactured brand knives, the ARMED FORCES develops some special models that perfectly fit the needs and requirements of the fighting soldiers. Boker, under the new label BOKER PLUS, is now producing three models that meet the critical demands of the ARMED FORCES. This new series will be produced with strict instructions and quality checks by our well-known business partners in the Far East. The main characteristic is that all models are designed to perform under any circumstances with the best price performance. Titanium nitride coated 440C stainless steel blades provide the best edge-holding ability, ideal for rugged field use. The handles are made of solid G-10, which will hold up even under rigorous field use. A deep checkering prevents slipping of the handles. The first choice of the ARMED FORCES on their worldwide use.
Click to expand...

who wrote this tripe?
 
First, let me say this is not the style of knife that appeals to me. Far too "tactical" for my taste. I like my knives to look like knives, not weapons of mass destruction. Nor do I care for CRKT or Strider, the former has no styles I care for, and the latter because it's overkill for the simple cutting I do.

Second, before you dog pile Boker, why not let them explain where the design came from. I'd love to defend them, simply because everyone else seems to want to stone them outright, but I don't know what thoughts went into this design, so I'll have to defer to Terry.
 
smcfalls13 said:
Second, before you dog pile Boker, why not let them explain where the design came from. I'd love to defend them, simply because everyone else seems to want to stone them outright, but I don't know what thoughts went into this design, so I'll have to defer to Terry.
Click to expand...

It's fair, I think, to offer criticism of a this product which resembles the named others beyond coincidence - the product is itself a statement.

Still, I look forward to any information on what inspired this design
with an open mind.
 
rifon2 said:
Still, I look forward to any information on what inspired this design
with an open mind.
Click to expand...
To provide this information, I will now post the response from
the owner of Boker.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Being currently in the US, I was made aware of the very strong opposition being currently published in the various internet discussion groups.
Here is the comment of the man who is at the end responsible for any activity of the Boker groups, and that includes the design of the Boker Plus
knives.

Up to today we are enjoying a very positive recognition for our work within the knife industry. High quality in workmanship paired with innovative designs, locking mechanisms and introduction of new materials for blade and handle helped us achieve this most valuable position.
Three examples:
1. Back in 1979, Boker was the first offering Damascus steel blades in folders.
2. The Speedlock design in the 90's turned loose a lot of copies os aluminum handle designs with kraton inserts. I remember a knockoff being so exact that we could exchange blades and both knives would operate beautifully as an automatic.
3. This year we introduced with SubCom, Turbine and Reality Based Blade.
ALL authentic Boker designs which might inspire competition again.

The history of the 3 Boker Plus designs go back to the special demand of AAFES. They wanted to offer to their soldiers a knife product not being available on the knife market in terms of design, materials for blade and handle, locking mechanism, all over finish and price.
I have to agree with our critics that the result is getting us very close to the Strider handle design. The facts that our knives are different in size, don't show the recessed fingergrooves and that the grip grooves are running around the complete handle make them different- however not different enough. The versatile way of having our clip design fixed on to the handle and the completely different blade design to Strider made us agree to what this extremely valuable knife customer really wanted us to produce.

Let's discuss the blade design. Here I take a different stand against the critics saying this is a cheap copy of CRKT's M16.
Boker Germany is the importer and distributor of CRKT in Germany and Austria for a number of years. When Columbia came out with their M16 series and the Tanto shape blade, Boker was already on the market with our H&K knives and the Superliner, the award winner as Overall-Knife-Of-The-Year at the Blade Show 1997. Both series were offered with drop point and Tanto blade shapes. It never donned on me to call the M16 a cheap copy of our designs. The tanto is an historically related Japanese blade shape, freely available to all knifemakers. The differences between the Tanto's of Benchmade, Cold Steel, CRKT, Boker and others are minor compared to the unique contour and it's four typical grinding lines. Rod Bremmer, president of CRKT, has seen the Boker PLus knives both at SHOT and IWA in Nuernberg.
We had many things to discuss. The blade shape was not part of it.

To cut a long story short:
1. I take the blame to have produced a handle design that is similar to the Strider.
2. All other features of the knives, and that includes the blade, and the fixed blade, make this Boker Plus line a different enough product to stand on its own.
3. I learned out of this discussion and will do my bestnot to get Boker even near to be a suspect of copying designs from others.

Ernst Felix,
President, Boker
 
Sorry all, didn't mean to lock it when I stickied it.
TJT
 
Hell, I'm going to buy one. :cool:

The blade design is not something I would call proprietary to CRKT, and although I think the handle is Strider like, I think it looks much more ergonomic.

In any event, I think if Stider is worried about a $30 knife with a handle that looks somewhat similar, maybe they should be rethinking their approach to the market. In all reality, I don't think any Strider customers will be over looking Strider knives for a $30 Boker.

It may not seem right, but I doubt it's of any consequence to Strider.
 
I have a dozen of each on my shelf (BO216, BO114, and the BO112). For the price they tickle my fingers. I haven’t found anyone that handled one to be unhappy, just a smile. A rugged tactical knife gives us old Marines a warm feeling. I hope Boker explores the Boker Plus line a little further.
 
An honest and detailed response to a real concern.

Sounds like 'integrity' to me...:thumbup:
 
I own one of the Armed Forces folders. I can confirm that they are being sold in at least my PX, on account of the fact that that's where I bought mine. The only difference is that theses were sold under the "Art Of War / A.O.W." brand name, but they are Bokers. The packaging has Boker mentioned on the back, stating that they are warrantied by Boker. I'm no knife-a-holic, but it is a really nice knife for the money, IMO.
 
If we faulted every company for putting out a copy of someone else's knife ... guess there would be just one knife company left. Case in point how many companies have a "Buck knife" in their line-up? ... the 110 is quite possibly the most copied design ever! If this was a blatent, unauthorized clone ... Strider sure has the resources to sue. Innovation is usually built off of someone else's idea ... very little comes from stratch these days. You just have to make enough changes to your design to avoid litigation. ALL knife companies are guilty of this. No one has a 100% original design.
 
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