Where to Practice Survival Skills

[billygoat162]

A problem I've run into is finding places where I can legally practice survival skills. Finding a place where I can practice fire building is easy (depending on the fire danger), but it seems shelter-building is typically frowned upon on public land (from what I've read, it's specifically forbidden in the Uintas and many other places). Where do people usually go for this kind of stuff? Is private land the only option? I live in northern Utah but don't mind driving 4-5 hours if I have to after the snow melts. I've been wanting to do one of those survival school field courses for a long time, but they are EXPENSIVE, and to be honest, I don't mind going at my own pace and staying close enough to my truck to bail if I have to (I'm sure I will do a field course someday though). I've built shelters before, but not since I lived near friends with enough private land and the desire to practice wilderness survival skills themselves. Are there any BF members who don't own land but have found a way around this conundrum?

 

[olybears57]

Go into dnr land (forestry land) if you have any around, and just use standing deadwood. Still not entirely legal, but not really hurting anyone/thing

 

[Bob W]

but it seems shelter-building is typically frowned upon on public land (from what I've read, it's specifically forbidden in the Uintas and many other places).

If you clean up after yourself (No Trace) and don't chop any live trees, it's unlikely that anyone will ever know or care that you built a shelter with branches.
Dig a shallow fire pit and save the topsoil to go back in, let the fire (when allowed) burn the wood to white ash so there's no charcoal mess left behind, don't build a "fire ring" (scars the rocks), and dismantle the shelter and re-scatter the branches. If you No Trace properly and follow basic outdoor etiquette, no one will ever know you were there. :thumbup:

 

[Tallahassee]

What's the deal with Federal lands where you are? Must be plenty of Fed agencies with big tracts in Utah. Check with Sierra Club, Audubon, Park Service & see where they send you.

Get a good twig wood stove like the Emberlit and you'll never need a big bonfire ever again.

 

[Codger_64]

Gather brush and other materials from tree and landscape trimming and lot clearing, take them home and practice in your own back yard. Or a friends if you don't have a yard.

 

[Tallahassee]

Of course it's freezing outside in Utah now. So if you don't have a yard and you don't have any friends, just bring Codger's tree brush debris and yard trimmings on into the middle of your living room and practice your fire making and hut building in warm, wall-to-wall comfort.
Always a hit with the ladies of the house, guaranteed to bring them intimately into your wilderness experience in a way they never imagined before. And then you'll be back outside before you can say "But, honey!"

 

[Codger_64]

Of course it's freezing outside in Utah now. So if you don't have a yard and you don't have any friends, just bring Codger's tree brush debris and yard trimmings on into the middle of your living room and practice your fire making and hut building in warm, wall-to-wall comfort.
Always a hit with the ladies of the house, guaranteed to bring them intimately into your wilderness experience in a way they never imagined before. And then you'll be back outside before you can say "But, honey!"

In that case there is always the garage or... the doghouse. Seriously though, some of the best experimenting and "play" can be found in your own back yard. By the way I am old, single and Jake my dog thinks anything I do is interesting and acceptable.

 

[Tallahassee]

True, your own back yard is a great testing ground for gear & a safe place to 'play' with new skills.

@Codger, from your pics in another thread Jake looks to be a great dog. You may be blessedly single but you are definitely not alone.

 

[Codger_64]

True, your own back yard is a great testing ground for gear & a safe place to 'play' with new skills.

@Codger, from your pics in another thread Jake looks to be a great dog. You may be blessedly single but you are definitely not alone.

Jake is a 24/7 companion and a survival aid. We've been practicing our survival skills here in the house this winter. Three times so far my airway has shut down while I was asleep and he noticed, got out of his kennel and tugged and pulled until I woke up and realized the problem and took my meds. problem is that if you pass out from lack of oxygen while asleep, it is kinda sorta sometimes permanent.

He is often also my ears. He is a hearing assist and medical alert service animal. And yes, a friend and partner in crime. We keep each other entertained and he likes it when I practice my firebow in the house, cleans up deer meat scraps when I am butchering and tests the jerky for me to see if it is done. And we have fun in public. He always wins something at local dog shows (Most spots? How could he loose?), and is about the only dog around allowed in eating establishments and grocery stores. But mainly he is a friend and survival item.

 

[22-rimfire]

The traditional places you might "practice" are generally off limits legally. It is like shooting. In my state, you can't even take a walk in the national forest (woods) with your trusty 22 rifle and do some plinking anymore. It is pretty sad actually.

I don't know the answer to your question unless you own the land or know someone who will allow you to "play".

 

[neeman]

Out of sight out of mind
What the eye dont see the heat wont grieve

Part of survial skills is not being seen
Fire skills practice in a state park picnic area
Collect downed wood somewhere else

 

[Codger_64]

Out of sight out of mind
What the eye dont see the heat wont grieve

Part of survial skills is not being seen
Fire skills practice in a state park picnic area
Collect downed wood somewhere else

Our tresspass laws, and park usage laws trend toward controlling peoples' activities. In some cases it is needed to assure the rights of property owners and in the case of parks, to reduce the damage done by overuse and unsound outdoor practices. Many times, though not often enforced, removal of plants, rocks, animals etc. is forbidden under penalty of law. Importation of some items is likewise banned for fear of spreading invasive palnts, animals and insect pests. Merely hiding one's activities does not make it legal and courts make little distinction for "I didn't mean to..." or "I didn't know...". So it is a very real concern.

 

[leghog]

Part of survial skills is not being seen...

That would be evading skills. I'd suggest a larger part of survival skills is to signal and to be seen so as to end the survival scenario.

 

[neeman]

I guess my attitude is cultural

 

[22-rimfire]

I hold to the out of sight out of mind approach a lot, but seldom recommend such on public forums. It is one of those do as I say, not as I do approaches.

It also depends on what "skills" you are trying to practice. Building a tarp shelter or plastic sheeting is much preferable to some sort of shelter with branches, pine limbs, and so forth. Not really that hard to carry a tarp with you. You can do pretty much everything you want to at primitive campsites in many state parks and national forests short of cutting a bunch of trees down. But do clean up after play time is over.

 

[Codger_64]

I guess my attitude is cultural

As is ours. It's only natural. And not a negative reflection on anyone. :thumbup:

 

[sideways]

This is a valid topic that doesn't get discussed often enough.

I do my fire making and shelter building on privately owned property. Everywhere else I adhere to leave no trace principles.

If private property was not a possibility I would look for government owned land with permissive rules. In practice that means remote national forest land well away from any of the high traffic hiking routes and parks.

Open fires are off limits most places so I would practice with a stove at home or at a barbeque stand somewhere. A twig stove out in the wild places is probably OK as long as it does not scar the ground underneath the stove.

Shelters are more tricky. Debris huts from dead wood might be OK, but even if you only use stuff that has fallen naturally you will still be creating an eyesore for whoever comes after you. Imagine going for a relaxing hike and seeing a debris hut every couple hundred meters. :barf:

Building brush huts and fires on other peoples private property is not cool IMHO. I have found traces of fires and campsites on my property. Some people have been so cheeky that they use the fire pit next to my cabin and leave their junk there. It is very annoying. I even had some turkey walk right into my camp on my land (before the cabin was put up) and start telling me about how it was a common land and that he had every right to be there.

My advice is to look at the map and check with the proper authorities about which land suitable. Getting land of your own is also a possibility. With everyone moving into the cities there are plenty of rural properties on the market.

 

[Codger_64]

On the twig stove, I have gotten individual permission from a State Park Ranger before to use mine outside of established campsites after I demonstrated it for him on a picnic grill and he saw how little deadwood it used, how little fire danger there was, and how little ash and disturbance was left behind. He also understood my LNT ethic and allowed me to camp wherever I pleased, not just in the established designated areas. And When I left those sites, no trace of my having been there could be found other than some compressed duff under where my tent had beem pitched. Many landowners will be accomodating as well if approached in advance and given an understanding of your practices and intent, and that you will respect their property.

 

[Bob W]

I could understand someone in Northern Illinois or Iowa not having access to land. But Utah?!?

Most public land in Utah is BLM land, which have very little restrictions. You can camp, hike, hunt, and fish practically anywhere. National Forest land can be more restrictive, especially with regards to fire bans in dry seasons, but generally you can still camp and hike anywhere with no permits or fees.

National Parks and State Parks can be restrictive by comparison. Camping is often by permit only and may be restricted to designated campsites. Off-trail hiking and exploring can be restricted in some parks, but not in others. You might even need a permit to hike in certain parks to keep popular or sensitive areas from being over-run.

Shelters are more tricky. Debris huts from dead wood might be OK, but even if you only use stuff that has fallen naturally you will still be creating an eyesore for whoever comes after you. Imagine going for a relaxing hike and seeing a debris hut every couple hundred meters.

Like I said, it's no problem as long as you clean up afterward. There's No reason to leave a mess for others to see. :thumbup:

 

[Bob W]

70% of the state of Utah is public land, including Eight Million Acres of Forest Service (US Department of Agriculture) and 30 Million acres of BLM (US Department of Interior). There are also publicly-accessible lands in administered by the Department of Defense, State of Utah, city Open Space Parks, and private organizations like The Nature Conservancy.