Which is best? 52100 high carbon, Nitro V stainless, CPM-3V tool steel, Z Wear tool steel, Cru Wear tool steel

I wish I had known sooner, because silly me was hung up on Z-Wear, which limited my supply options!! But I just got a bunch of MagnaCut, which may be my new go to, since my only regret with Z-wear was the so-so corrosion resistance.

Maybe it's just me, but when I look into opinions on knife steels online, on Youtube, etc., it's surprising how so few rate Cru-wear very highly. Maybe it's because they have only tried the cast variant and don't realize there is a difference? It's a shame they didn't give it a different name. But then again, a lot of people place a lot higher value on high edge retention steels than I do, which also skews the results. It was nice to see Larrin's article about edge geometry, because my problem with those high carbide high edge retention steels is that they would chip like crazy with a low angle edge.

It was nice to see Wako (Virtuovice on Youtbube, if you follow him) finally make the switch to Cru-wear!
 
Mobius1 said:
I wish I had known sooner, because silly me was hung up on Z-Wear, which limited my supply options!! But I just got a bunch of MagnaCut, which may be my new go to, since my only regret with Z-wear was the so-so corrosion resistance.

Maybe it's just me, but when I look into opinions on knife steels online, on Youtube, etc., it's surprising how so few rate Cru-wear very highly. Maybe it's because they have only tried the cast variant and don't realize there is a difference? It's a shame they didn't give it a different name. But then again, a lot of people place a lot higher value on high edge retention steels than I do, which also skews the results. It was nice to see Larrin's article about edge geometry, because my problem with those high carbide high edge retention steels is that they would chip like crazy with a low angle edge.

It was nice to see Wako (Virtuovice on Youtbube, if you follow him) finally make the switch to Cru-wear!
Click to expand...
So so on the z wear?? Did u actually experience corrosion in use ?
 
Mobius1 said:
I wish I had known sooner, because silly me was hung up on Z-Wear, which limited my supply options!! But I just got a bunch of MagnaCut, which may be my new go to, since my only regret with Z-wear was the so-so corrosion resistance.

Maybe it's just me, but when I look into opinions on knife steels online, on Youtube, etc., it's surprising how so few rate Cru-wear very highly. Maybe it's because they have only tried the cast variant and don't realize there is a difference? It's a shame they didn't give it a different name. But then again, a lot of people place a lot higher value on high edge retention steels than I do, which also skews the results. It was nice to see Larrin's article about edge geometry, because my problem with those high carbide high edge retention steels is that they would chip like crazy with a low angle edge.

It was nice to see Wako (Virtuovice on Youtbube, if you follow him) finally make the switch to Cru-wear!
Click to expand...
It is as close to stainless without crossing the threshold as you can get. I have a coring knife that just slightly discolored after processing 100lbs of tomatoes. I have basically no patina on a petty I have used in my kitchen for 2 years. No, it isn’t stainless, but as far as non stainless steels go, it is just below the stainless threshold.
 
So now I am confused. Hoss, you said Z Wear is made by Crucible? I thought it was made by Zapp, hence the "Z" prefix. I thought "Cru Wear" was "Cru"cible (a USA company) and "Z Wear" was "Z"app (A German based company). Are these two companies linked somehow?
 
This is what NSM said:

"Z-Wear is the same exact thing as CPM CruWear. They are both melted by Crucible Industries and rolled at Niagara Specialty Metals. We process the Z-Wear for our customer who resells to industrial customers or distributors. You can visit our online store at nsm-ny.com and get sheet up to .250" thick."
 
samuraistuart said:
So now I am confused. Hoss, you said Z Wear is made by Crucible? I thought it was made by Zapp, hence the "Z" prefix. I thought "Cru Wear" was "Cru"cible (a USA company) and "Z Wear" was "Z"app (A German based company). Are these two companies linked somehow?
Click to expand...
Zapp doesn't make the steel.
 
Sometimes I see these "Which is the best steel" posts and chuckle. It is often like asking someone Who is the best supermodel* - Jerry Hall, Iman, Marissa Berenson, Margaux Hemmingway, Christie Brinkley, Cheryl Tiegs? Are any of them bad supermodels.

* - Anyone under 50 will have to google those ladies.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
Sometimes I see these "Which is the best steel" posts and chuckle. It is often like asking someone Who is the best supermodel* - Jerry Hall, Iman, Marissa Berenson, Margaux Hemmingway, Christie Brinkley, Cheryl Tiegs? Are any of them bad supermodels.

* - Anyone under 50 will have to google those ladies.
Click to expand...
Yeah.....haha 😁

If the Worst thing that could happen was his knife was made from 52100???

that's going to be an Awesome knife!
 
So if Zapp doesn't make it, what does Zapp have to do with it? I just don't understand the steel industry when it comes to these things. The only thing I can guess is Zapp designed the steel at around the same time Crucible did? I really don't know. So if Zapp didn't make it, why is there a Zapp Z Wear and then a Crucible CruWear?
 
samuraistuart said:
So if Zapp doesn't make it, what does Zapp have to do with it? I just don't understand the steel industry when it comes to these things. The only thing I can guess is Zapp designed the steel at around the same time Crucible did? I really don't know. So if Zapp didn't make it, why is there a Zapp Z Wear and then a Crucible CruWear?
Click to expand...
They pay for Crucible/Niagara to make it, put their name on it, and sell it. They may do some other type of processing like shearing, surface grinding, etc. It’s not much different than any other steel supplier they are just bigger than the operations that specialize in knife steel. It seems their main business is in other areas like wire. It’s not clear from their website if they are making the steel for the wire either or if they purchase steel and then do the wire drawing. There are a lot of steel processors, suppliers, etc that offer a range of services and they typically all refer to themselves as “steel companies” even if they don’t actually produce the steel itself.
 
samuraistuart said:
So if Zapp doesn't make it, what does Zapp have to do with it? I just don't understand the steel industry when it comes to these things. The only thing I can guess is Zapp designed the steel at around the same time Crucible did? I really don't know. So if Zapp didn't make it, why is there a Zapp Z Wear and then a Crucible CruWear?
Click to expand...
The original alloy was VascoWear made by Vasco. I think Crucible was the first to make the (C)PM version. It is now copied by several companies, it is a good one.

Hoss
 
Does the CPM CruWear finish beyond the old 60 grit scratch finish of VascoWear days?
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
Sometimes I see these "Which is the best steel" posts and chuckle. It is often like asking someone Who is the best supermodel* - Jerry Hall, Iman, Marissa Berenson, Margaux Hemmingway, Christie Brinkley, Cheryl Tiegs? Are any of them bad supermodels.

* - Anyone under 50 will have to google those ladies.
Click to expand...

Though I agree most knife steels are great and get the job done, I do think that asking this question has a lot of merit.

I just last week told my wife that I am grateful to be a knifemaker right now and not decades ago, because of all the amazing innovations in modern steel.

Especially as custom knife makers, I think it's even more important to understand the best steels for the application, because generally we want to make a better knife for people than what they would buy at the store.

I absolutely can't stand low alloy steels for my personal use. I so much as breath on them and they rust!! I don't have to deal with that with these modern steels. I even stopped using O1 because it practically begs to rust.
 
So I’m assuming NSM is the only place to buy Cru-Wear then? Haven’t seen it elsewhere, same with 4V.
 
Fitzo, I have a 63HRC large petty that on Friday I just finished to 400 grit. With the right abrasives, I suppose you could mirror finish it. Diamond films will help speed that process up quite I bit, tho.

Thanks for the clarification Hoss and Larrin.

Ren01228, I get the PM ZWear from Alpha Knife supply.
 
Selecting the best steel requires context of use at a minimum. Though some are better than others! 😁
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top