Which Knife Has Disappointed You The Most, Which Has Pleasantly Surprised You?

Biggest disappoint: Zero Tolerance 560 with Elmax steel. While I like the smooth opening and the way it fits my hand, I was pretty disappointed with the mediocre factory edge. Worse yet, it did not hold the edge nearly as well as I expected for a so-called super steel. I also find it pretty bulky to carry around. I had a pretty hard time putting a decent edge on it despite using an Apex Edge Pro.

Biggest surprise: My go to knife for the longest time was the Benchmade 710. I have one in 154 CM, 2 in D2, and one in M390. I love how this knife fits in my hand and how smooth it is to open. A friend who has been a really bad influence (causing me to have serious knife envy and buy more knives) showed me some of his higher end knives made me doubt the ruggedness of my Benchmade (thin blade and possible spring failure). I still carry the 710 ever so often and I still love the feel of the knife.

Another massive surprise and my new carry knife is my Microtech LUDT in S35VN. The LUDT is probably the BEST factory edge I have ever seen and the edge retention is phenomenal. I was able to sharpen it up using a Japanese water stone and a leather strop. While the knife is a little thicker than some, it fits my hand well. It doesn't have much aggressive texturing or jumping which some people may not like. I like that it doesn't tear up my pants like some other knives do. I got it for a great price ($180) and I almost cried when I misplaced it (in my pocket at the bottom of the hamper).

Impressed: I went crazy one day and bought a Chris Reeve large Sabenza with a Devin Thomas Damascus blade. Now I know what they mean by bank vault solid! While the blade is sharp, I feel the Microtech LUDT may have actually been sharper out of the box. I just ordered a Sabenza 21 Insigo blade with a carbon fiber scale. I love how that knife looks!
 
By the way, sorry for pulling up a somewhat dormant thread.

When I said my friend has knife that will cause knife envy, I think his collection would make most people drool. His collection includes: Scott Cook Lochsa, Rick Hinderer XM-18, Zero Tolerance 777, Chris Reeve Sabenza, as well as many others I can't recall (or haven't even heard of). I think I'm going to take it easy for a while... Especially considering I just got a Spyderco Domino, Spyderco Manix 2 XL, and The carbon fiber scale Chris Reeve this past month!
 
It was a semi-common problem with Elmax blades from ZT. The edge overheats during factory sharpening, ruining the heat treat. Hopefully they've got it sorted out now.
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Moxy, I understand the concept but has there been any actual proof this is what occurred? As in sent back and tested for grain structure and actually looked at by someone other than you tube self appointed experts? As I understand it the knives sent back have been pretty rare. Who has proof of this, not just expert opinion?

Anybody can point me to test results showing burned Elmax on ZT's , Kershaws, or others? Not you tube cutting tests but actual evidence of this having occured or being a culprit?

Also, does anyone know if Kershaw/ZT does a Cryo on it's Elmax blades?

Thanks,

Joe
 
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The Mastiff said:
Moxy, I understand the concept but has there been any actual proof this is what occurred? As in sent back and tested for grain structure and actually looked at by someone other than you tube self appointed experts? As I understand it the knives sent back have been pretty rare. Who has proof of this, not just expert opinion?

Anybody can point me to test results showing burned Elmax on ZT's , Kershaws, or others? Not you tube cutting tests but actual evidence of this having occured or being a culprit?

Also, does anyone know if Kershaw/ZT does a Cryo on it's Elmax blades?

Thanks,

Joe
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I understand what you're saying but it strikes me that if there was a problem of this nature you wouldn't necessarily have everyone notice it or many, if any send knives in--it would manifest itself only as poor edge retention, which for folks who use their knives would probably cause them just to sharpen them and move on.

I've noticed relatively unimpressive edge retention on the two ZT Elmax knives I use, but I haven't sent either of them anywhere either--I just sharpened them and learned not to try to get my ZT edges too thin. If my knives have an issue I doubt it's burnt edges, I'd be more willing to believe it was just that they run their Elmax extra soft (extrapolating from B-U's own CATRA testing TCC:930@62, 761@60+, Elmax would have edge retention pretty close to 440C at RC 58) for toughness than it was ZT burning edge after edge on knife model after knife model.

This is just a WAG, though, as I don't have access to a hardness tester to test the HRC of my blades. Besides, it's a lot easier to just sharpen the knives and reduce my expectations for their performance. If my 0560 requires sharpening a touch more frequently than my 710 in D2 that doesn't make it useless, it's still a very nice knife. If anything I wish it was lighter more than that it had better steel.

From my limited experience I don't think ZT's Elmax does very well for edge retention, but I don't really care and would never send in a knife for diagnosis for this--I'm no steel snob, though.
 
Thanks EvilGreg. The low tempering temp is in the high 400's F up to 900'sF so it might very well be. I just haven't seen any real posts that had evidence or hard facts in them yet some are speaking about it as if it's established truth. It may very well be, but until it's official it's just opinions.

I have found better performance on a couple steels after a sharpening removes steel. It's an opinion without evidence and I usually notice it on the stones first. Another opinion I have is that I seem to notice the effect on powder steels more than ingot steels for some reason. Once again, that isn't an established fact but an opinion.

I do believe in this case with Kai/Kershaw/ZT it has likely affected sales. That isn't something I would feel comfortable contributing to without real evidence. Civil Liability isn't the issue, it's more a moral thing.

Regards,

Joe
 
Biggest disappointment was probably my Bark River Bravo 2. The thing was sharp as hell but the fit and finish was noticeably super duper terrible. Not to exaggerate, it was the first knife I ever purchased that the actual product didn't look like the picture on its website.

Best good surprise: My Busse Sar 6. I expected the fit and finish to be spectacular and the actual end product was. Super sharp, super comfortable to hold and very beautiful.
 
My biggest disappointment was a Chinese made folder by a very popular maker! Enough said!

My biggest surprise was my ZT 0301! New it would be a beast but had no idea it would keep looking so good for so long!
 
Disappointment - spyderco tenacious: heavy too big in the pocket and uncomfortable in hand.
Surprise - kabar dozier: lightweight sheeple friendly holds a good edge. Comfortable in hand.
 
At this point in my life I have determined what I like in my folders and I can say that I am rarely disappointed in any that I get. I have a very specific set of specifications that I look for in a knife. But now and then I take a chance. I have never really cottoned up to the style of folder that has one titanium scale, and one G-10 scale, even when it does have a metal liner on it's backside. I found myself liking the sculpted look of the ZT0560 series and the large size was also to my liking. But I eventually got rid of it. Then I decided to try the ZT0550 because it was smaller yet still had the thicker blade and the same weight of the larger 0560. But after getting it and playing with it I simply did not like it and it now sits in my drawer and will likely never be carried. So I would place it as my greatest disappointment for the year.

I biggest surprise for the year has turned out to be the ZT0801. I wasn't really expecting to like it as much as I have, and I really do like it. I have been contemplating getting a second one, and I also have the LE 0801CF on order. The size, the heft, the all titanium construction, and the flipper have really gotten my attention. I had my Sebenza moment and I did/do like those knives, and the price does not throw me off of them as you pay for quality. But the ZT0801 is everything I had wished the Sebenza to be, a beefier and heftier version. Though I carry my large folding knives I rarely have to use them so the Elmax steel controversy does not really bother me that much.

Now the knife that has exceeded my expectations is the ZT0600. I would still love to have a second one on this model!!
 
Tough question hmm. I think for my biggest disappointment has to be the 2 Sog knives early on in my collecting which has only been 4mo. No matter what I did lockup did not feel secure there was always blade play.

Now onto to my biggest surprise has to be my xm 18 I thought it was all hype boy was I wrong talk about a work of art everything about the knife from fit & finish to ergos and wow factor is off the charts. Did not take me long to grab another now I have 1 spanto and1 slicer grind. Now I am looking for a xm 24. Oh and another one that blew my socks off is the Paramilitary 2, another knife I thought was all hype but once I got it in my hands everything about the knife felt right.
 
No real disappointments, though the zt 0350 was not as impressive as I expected. Real surprise was the Cold Steel Recon 1. Quite a knife for the money.
 
Biggest dissapointment: CRKT Razzel, I bought one of these before I was really into knives, I owned maybe 5 others at the time, I bought it on the recommendation of several well respected members of m4carbine.net thinking I would use it for everything. Every job I said I needed to do I was assured the Razzel could not onl handle it but excell at it too, well I never found one job it was truely great for and it was just so hard to maintain and sharpen with its multiple cutting edges that I delegated it to horse trailer duty and have not since seen it.

Most impressed: benchmade mini-grip 555, now being my first benchmade I had high expectations and it didnt dissapoint, I have always been a sheepsfoot guy, so that plus the hole opener did it for me. At the time I was modding every knife I bought (some of them very heavily) but the 555 has remained 100% factory. I did enjoy it so much that shortly after it beat every one of my EDC rotation knives out of my pocket I ordered a custom 551 (thumb stud, drop point, D2 w/ tangerine scales & all black hardware/furniture) which I'm still waiting to receive from BM, I do have plans to mod it including grinding a wave in the spine of the blade and sanding the roundness out of the scales.


This is a really great thread btw, thanks.
 
Biggest disappointment: Spyderco Southard. Mainly because everywhere I looked reviews said it was so awesome. My expectations were probably a little high. I have large hands which are not a good fit for the Southard. At least for me. Not that awesome of a flipping action, the tip of the pocketclip digs into my hand when I grip it firmly. I am happy with the fit and finish and will keep it around for light duty but it was not what I thought it would be.

Most impressed: Sebenza 21. I looked at some, played with a few but never saw myself owning one. Found a decent deal on a used one picked it up and now I really like the knife. Light enough to carry easily, tough enough to do what I need. It is now in the rotation with a Military, PM2 and couple of customs.
 
My Socom Elite was a bit of a let down. It was not smooth to deploy. It took some breaking in. It did take some getting used too. And if any civilians were nearby. When ever I pulled it out to use. You could hear them gasp, at the sight of it.

My Spyderco Poliwog was a Great knife. I picked it up for its size and being all stainless. But with out any regret. I gave it to my Doctor. He had admired it. I just want to thank him for keeping this old body going.

I have been looking at a Boker Pipsqueak to take the place of the Poliwog
 
I have 2 that surprised me. I don't have a good knife store close to me, so I have been buying here on the forum to check knives out.
I picked up an Emerson cqc7 mini and I love it. It's been in my pocket every day since I got it.
Yesterday I got a pm2 user and it had kicked the Emerson out of my pocket for now.
I'm not a spyderco fanboy, but it lives up to the hype. It's a larger blade than I usually carry, but it is light and carries like a smaller knife. It fits my hand very naturally. I hit it with my sharpener, and this is the sharpest blade I own. I didn't expect to keep it more than 24 hours, but today it is riding with me.
 
My biggest disappointment was Spyderco Navaja. My fault. Schempps Persian is one of my favorite knives and I expected something similar. The knife was in development for several years and I was patiently waiting. I bought it on the first day, when they hit dealers shelves and put in my pocket right away. The first cut brought first disappointment. The grind was quite thick and the angle on the edge too obtuse. After reprofiling at 30 degrees I noticed improvement, but not to satisfactory level. Thickness of the blade behind the edge was thicker than on my big old Manix. Tom Krein was still taking orders and he did a great job regrinding. The knife was cutting like a laser. I carried for couple weeks and realized that I have difficulties to operate the lock because bolster covering it. That was enough.

My biggest surprise Native5. I like FFG blades, but the knife fits into my hand just perfectly. Great quality of build. I own four different variant and all of them near perfect. 2013 Spyderco Forum knife is the best. I like dark green, but just looking at the original picture, posted by Kristi I was not so sure about diamond pattern. Also I didn't have high expectations on S1100V due to statement that average user will not be able see the difference between this and that steels, h/t concerns and so on. I absolutely love the knife. Scales look great, blade rocks. It is quite differently goes through cardboard than S30V, S35N or VG10. I hope I will not change my mind after I will need to reprofile it. WE is on my side. :)
And I told about ergos already. I think that, if I decided to go custom EDC, than Forum Native5 would be one of my top choices. Dark green scales, medium size FFG blade from top of the line steel, hefty handle.
 
I guess different knives have different purposes, even though almost any knife can be used as a self defense tool in a pinch. With that said, I was pretty disappointed when I received my Benchmade 530 in S30V. This was when S30V was just becoming popular and the expectations were pretty high. The problem with the 530 is that it feels so incredibly flimsy. The blade is super thin and the plastic handles (even with the stainless pieces inside) feel really cheap. knifeworks.com gave me some crap about returning it so I'm stuck with it.

While I would not say I am completely disappointed by the Zero Tolerance 560, I am less than impressed. The knife is pretty substantial in size making it difficult to carry. The flipper works great, but the thumb studs are very hard to use (too close to the pivot point for good leverage). The Elmax steel is very over-rated and does not hold and edge for that long.

I also have a DPX Extreme. While the knife is bult like a tank and offers some interesting features, it is one of those features that really bothers me. The blade has a notch cut out of it so that it can be used as a bottle opener. While this is a "nice" feature, it snags on my pocket everytime I go to pull it out. In a self defense situation, that would obviously be pretty bad. I do like the rotating lock (a la Lion Steel) and the thick beefy blade. The nut driver is a "nice" feature as well, but of limited practicality.
 
stephen426 said:
The blade has a notch cut out of it so that it can be used as a bottle opener. While this is a "nice" feature, it snags on my pocket everytime I go to pull it out. In a self defense situation, that would obviously be pretty bad.
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I have heard several people say that they use it like an Emerson Wave, and in that case it would be pretty good for a self defense situation :)
 
Biggest disappointment was the ESEE Izula line of knives...overpriced for a 1095 knife with aircraft carrier flight deck non-skid coating; the Becker BK-14 a better value, cost's less, and the finish is subtle, and nicely done, as well as made in the USA, as is ESEE.

My other gig disappointment is the Strider PT, which I bring up to compare with my pleasantly surprising Zancudo, which is 10% of the cost of that over-hyped Strider.
 
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