Thanks! I will change it and add a few features, I just wanted an overall shape to start out from, and work from there. I want to respect the maker and not just copy. Thinking wider blade, serrated at the top, and maybe a second bevel at the tip.Awesome to see.
Love the 5... It's brutal.
You may want to shoot Jeff Randal a message ... Not to get in trouble using his design.
Love how you incorporated a sharpening choil in your drawing, I added one to my 5 some years ago.
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Recommendation? Which outdoor knife is your favourite?
- Thread starter MP Morgan
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Have you looked at the Casstrom SFK number 10 and the Enzo Trapper? Both available in FFG and stainless. I don't know American prices but over here they're cheaper than the Benchmade.
I've got a Trapper 115 which makes a fairly good kitchen knife when I go to work.
Simple mod to start the process... get rid of the thumb ramp and jimping on the top and reduce the guard on the bottom. Both interfere with wood working and aren't needed for protection. Look to Mora Companion's handle or perhaps Bark River for handle inspiration .
I'd argue against a swedge as they chew up batons. IMO, Buck ruined Ron Hoods Thug design when they put the swedge on the Reaper clone. Admittedly, swedge dads mall ninja appeal.
I'd argue for a thinner stock, not thicker.
I'd argue for a convex grind.
IMO, changes of these sort would both differentiate your design and make it more useful.
First, thanks for the feedback. I may need a bit explanation, as english is not my main language, and I am not too familiar with all the kniferelated terms. With "stock" what do you refer to?
I am actually kind of implementing the suggested things in the second design, which still needs some work though.
By swedge you mean the "dents" in the spine?
I want to make 2 different knives, and I know I will learn a lot in the process. And make mistakes, that's part of the learning process.
MP,
First... understand that we all different preferences for outdoor knives and I am only giving you mine, which may be out of step with your goals/preferences and out of step with those of others.
Second, your English is fine. But, knife terms are confusing and not well agreed upon.
By "stock" I mean the material used to make the blade/handle. I prefer outdoor knives with thinner blades, not thicker, so I would advocate for using steel that is thinner than what you describe. My pref is in the 3mm range for some knives and 2.5mm for others. I recommend looking to Mora for inspiration on blade thickness.
By "swedge" I mean a "second bevel at the tip" that is on the top at the spine. The Buck 110 has a swedged tip. The Opinel does not. The Buck Reaper has a swedged tip. The very similar Buck Thug does not. Swedges help with piercing cuts and are marginally useful for a hunting knife but they chew up wood batons when processing wood. I've never made a piercing cut and said, "This cut would be so much better if this knife had a swedge." On many occasions I've been splitting wood and have chewed up a baton quickly due to a swedge and have said, "This job would be so much easier if this knife didn't have a swedge."
Again and lastly... it's your knife, your design and your vision, not mine. You asked for input so I'm sharing my personal preferences.
Very interested to see how your design evolves.
First... understand that we all different preferences for outdoor knives and I am only giving you mine, which may be out of step with your goals/preferences and out of step with those of others.
Second, your English is fine. But, knife terms are confusing and not well agreed upon.
By "stock" I mean the material used to make the blade/handle. I prefer outdoor knives with thinner blades, not thicker, so I would advocate for using steel that is thinner than what you describe. My pref is in the 3mm range for some knives and 2.5mm for others. I recommend looking to Mora for inspiration on blade thickness.
By "swedge" I mean a "second bevel at the tip" that is on the top at the spine. The Buck 110 has a swedged tip. The Opinel does not. The Buck Reaper has a swedged tip. The very similar Buck Thug does not. Swedges help with piercing cuts and are marginally useful for a hunting knife but they chew up wood batons when processing wood. I've never made a piercing cut and said, "This cut would be so much better if this knife had a swedge." On many occasions I've been splitting wood and have chewed up a baton quickly due to a swedge and have said, "This job would be so much easier if this knife didn't have a swedge."
Again and lastly... it's your knife, your design and your vision, not mine. You asked for input so I'm sharing my personal preferences.
Very interested to see how your design evolves.
We do have different preferences, and being new to making knives, I appriciate all good input.
I see good reason in making thinner knives, 5 mm is quite thick. It is, however, the thickness I bought, and I might as well utilize it for a couple of fat blades. The next ones will be in some thinner Vanax, probably 2,5 mm to try something different.
You have a good point on the swedge, I will avoid it on the second knife. I think it looks good on the first one.. If it's usefull, I don't know, but I will try it out.
I will look into the designs and post pictures for more feedback. Just got the Vanadis 4E today, so it seems I will get some work done this weekend!
Thanks again
The_Iron_Joe
Knifemaker, Jeweller. Custom Books Open!
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Ok, have been working a bit more on design.. Thoughts? And just got the Vanadis today, so I will most likely start milling friday, and do the main work sunday. See how far I get.
Personally, I really like the the grind you have on the above blade for an outdoors knife; given that you're working from 5mm thick blade stock, I think you can get away with a much higher grind on the bottom knife. I also agree with what others have been saying about the guard getting in the way of wood-working.
While I like the bottom design a lot, I see it being more useful as a combat knife.
That's probably because the profile is almost exactly the same as the Benchmade Adamas fixed blade.
EDIT to add that I think you could do with some narrowing of the top blade's handle, looks a little wide for a comfortable grip.
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Personally, I really like the the grind you have on the above blade for an outdoors knife; given that you're working from 5mm thick blade stock, I think you can get away with a much higher grind on the bottom knife. I also agree with what others have been saying about the guard getting in the way of wood-working.
While I like the bottom design a lot, I see it being more useful as a combat knife.
That's probably because the profile is almost exactly the same as the Benchmade Adamas fixed blade.
EDIT to add that I think you could do with some narrowing of the top blade's handle, looks a little wide for a comfortable grip.
Yes, the bottom one is kind of based on the Benchmade shape, and then added what I would like to try. More aggressive and combat like. I may try to extend the grind on the bottom one, it could indeed look good. I just changed the handle on the top one, will post a pic when I have changed the grind on the bottom one too.
I hear you in regards of the guard, but I need to try it out to see. It's easier to remove than to add on the knife, so I'll leave it for now.
Back to the drawing board..
The_Iron_Joe
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Oh, don't get me wrong, I enjoy a good guard on an outdoors blade! One of my favourite production knives to use out in the woods is the Cold Steel Recon Scout, which is a shorter version of the Trail Master mentioned earlier. I just think that for most people looking for a woods blade don't want one.
For me, once you reach a certain spine thickness, it is better to have a higher grind to still have a decent cutting grind, while being able to split wood if need be.
Next attempt..
I like how you've thinned the foremost part of the handle out, the blade looks pleasantly choppy still.
I would consider removing the swedge from the bottom knife if you're intending it to be an outdoors knife, as others have said, but if you're aiming more for a tactical knife then keep it.
That top blade is starting to look somewhat like a Nessmuk. And that's not a bad thing!
I really like the new shape of the top blade. As Iron_Joe noted, very Nessmuk.
I'm assuming the top knife is more general outdoors knife and the bottom is more of a tactical/utility knife.
If so, keep the swedge, guard, thumb ramp and jimping on the bottom knife. You might reconsider other makers for inspiration on the handle/guard profile to make less direct of a copy of a single design, but honestly, there is no copyright on design (just ask Buck about the 110 knock offs).
Another thing I would advocate is flipping the butt end profiles on the knives. IMO, the tactical/utility knife should have more of glass-breaker/striker profile and the general outdoor knife should have more of a basic hammer/smash-thing-flat type of butt end.
Two minor nits about the bottom knife, which I think is shaping up nicely... First, I actively dislike sharpening choils on wood working knives. I want useable edge right up the end. More like traditional puukos.
Second, I have a folding knife with a blade shape similar to what you've drawn and it's a lot of fun to pull out and use sometimes. The blade is just so tall! [It's a Schrade 51 OT.] But I don't carry it often. At some point, the massive height limits where I can physically put the knife and it forces my thumb and palm to very high relative to the cutting edge when working with wood. I find I favor more traditionally proportioned blades. On your design, I would think about raising the cutting edge closer to the spine more than lowering the spine to the cutting edge. Again, I like my grip to be closer to the cutting edge.
As always, I'm giving you my personal preferences since you've asked for that. But this is your design and it should make you happy, not me.
I'm assuming the top knife is more general outdoors knife and the bottom is more of a tactical/utility knife.
If so, keep the swedge, guard, thumb ramp and jimping on the bottom knife. You might reconsider other makers for inspiration on the handle/guard profile to make less direct of a copy of a single design, but honestly, there is no copyright on design (just ask Buck about the 110 knock offs).
Another thing I would advocate is flipping the butt end profiles on the knives. IMO, the tactical/utility knife should have more of glass-breaker/striker profile and the general outdoor knife should have more of a basic hammer/smash-thing-flat type of butt end.
Two minor nits about the bottom knife, which I think is shaping up nicely... First, I actively dislike sharpening choils on wood working knives. I want useable edge right up the end. More like traditional puukos.
Second, I have a folding knife with a blade shape similar to what you've drawn and it's a lot of fun to pull out and use sometimes. The blade is just so tall! [It's a Schrade 51 OT.] But I don't carry it often. At some point, the massive height limits where I can physically put the knife and it forces my thumb and palm to very high relative to the cutting edge when working with wood. I find I favor more traditionally proportioned blades. On your design, I would think about raising the cutting edge closer to the spine more than lowering the spine to the cutting edge. Again, I like my grip to be closer to the cutting edge.
As always, I'm giving you my personal preferences since you've asked for that. But this is your design and it should make you happy, not me.
Thanks for your thoughts!
I am still looking into improvements. I kind of like this change, which will make it possible to use for batoning and the serrated edge will be kinda tactical and useful. Going to work with both knives, it's still not quite there, but will try to make them sunday.
I am still looking into improvements. I kind of like this change, which will make it possible to use for batoning and the serrated edge will be kinda tactical and useful. Going to work with both knives, it's still not quite there, but will try to make them sunday.
The_Iron_Joe
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Putting those serrations on will limit the kinds of grips you could use, say for planting your thumb on the spine for added leverage while shaving material with the knife. They do look cool, though.
Personally I wouldn't want the serrations, but I could see them being useful for cord or similar.
It's a tough choice. I am going back and forth, but need to decide before tomorrow. Really looking forward to make the blade!