Which style for 50 year olds who can't outrun anyone?

D

duller

Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Messages
242
Hi.

Can anyone recommend a basic style of defense w/ edged weapon, like a pocket folder, for a person no longer in their athletic prime and unable to outrun anyone? Also unable to do complex movements such as dropping to one knee to attack femural arteries or bending over backwards to dodge the big swipe across the chest, or other Matrix type moves. (I've saw both of those moves on youtube a few months back)

Aging and loss of ability is a fact of life. So what does a fella do who isn't ready for CaneMasters, yet, but can no longer do the complex body movements I see in so many FMA youtube videos? Or possibly the worst of all, no longer able to outrun a fella who thinks enough of his ability to attack someone?

Fyi, the ol' arms still work fine. Grip is getting weaker, though. A pocket folder seemed like a great little equalizer, btw. Which is why I mention it.
 
for knife defense techiques you might want to check michael janich's system. his system makes a great deal of sense to me.

for empty hand problems there is wing chun. wing chun is a true combat system with techniques designed to end fights very quickly.
 
duller said:
Hi.

Can anyone recommend a basic style of defense w/ edged weapon, like a pocket folder, for a person no longer in their athletic prime and unable to outrun anyone?
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I think any FMA Instructor worth a damn would be able to cater to your requirements and if they won't, well, it's either because they don't have the vision of they're just selling their stuff.

Just tell them up front and be honest with them.

Aging and loss of ability is a fact of life. So what does a fella do who isn't ready for CaneMasters...
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Get ready for the time when you will be able to utilize excellent canes like those from Cold Steel and Canemasters! Why wait until you are then saddled with one to then come back and say, "How do I fight with this thing now?"

Learn now. By the time you truly need it, you will be effective with it.

...yet, but can no longer do the complex body movements I see in so many FMA youtube videos? Or possibly the worst of all, no longer able to outrun a fella who thinks enough of his ability to attack someone?
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Youtube has some outlandish BS on it. Don't confuse self-defense combat with showmanship and other things.

Fyi, the ol' arms still work fine. Grip is getting weaker, though. A pocket folder seemed like a great little equalizer, btw. Which is why I mention it.
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Go to REI and get an excercise ball called the 1LB/One Pound Gravity Gripp. Gripp with two PPs, just like that. Buy a couple of them and wear them out, buy more.

It doesn't matter if you use a cane, blackjack, folding knife, fixed blade or handgun, if you can't keep a good grip on it, it's useless.
 
A lot of FMA systems can be practiced well into a person's later years in life. (Even in their 80's.) If a system depends upon you to be physically active and in excellent condition, then their's a problem with that.
Martial Arts came about in general as a way for the little guy to defend themselves against a big guy.
Don't mistake the fancy flashy nonsense as real martial arts. The effective systems are based off of simplicity and ease of use. They don't require a 'setup technique', acrobatics, or other such nonsense.

Don made a really good point. Learing about the cane now is better than waiting until later and then trying to figure it out as you use it.
There is no magical technique or style. Training requires time, dedication, commitment, etc., etc.... So starting to learn the cane now isn't a bad idea. That way by the time you start to actually need it in your life, you should be pretty efficient with it.
 
Also, you should be open-minded enough, as well as intelligent enough to take whatever the instructor has to offer and adapt to your own special needs and abilities. As long as you are learning some practical and common sense stuff that does not require any extraordinary physical attributes from the start, you should be on a good path...
 
50 years old is not old in my book..I am 44 soon to be 45 and feel better and better every day. It is about training smarter not harder. If your not in shape work towards getting there. There is no excuse....I have had countless injuries the last major one was 3 crushed discs from a car wreck...I took my time and healed and learned about me and what my strengths and weaknesses are. There are several ways to get tactically strong...kettle bells, club bells, body weight exercises, power walking and of course training your craft diligently, with intent and focus (smarter not harder)..I do all of the above and feel fantastic. Live a clean healthy life and you will see that getting older isn't a death sentence rather a life long journey only limited by ones lack of MANA (spirit)

And by the way my pop is 73 years young and still rides his bike 20 miles a day, goes fly fishing out in Wyoming, travels, hikes, hunts etc....tell him he is old and you will get a hardy F*** YOU....lol...! It is a mindset folks.

Now onto the aforementioned question:

If your grip is weak get it strong...hell squeeze a tennis ball..spring grips...kettle bells etc. etc. there is a plethora of devices that aid people to get better...find one and use it, religiously.

As to a system...I teach Bahad ZuBu, a southern Filipino methodology...and NO it is not a fancy system with moves that are so hokey only a spider monkey could pull it off...it is a deliberate system geared toward reality as opposed to theatrical. It deals with impact, edged, flexible and straight forward empty hands from ground to standing. As my teacher Master Yuli Romo jr. tells me " we must be intuitive and practical, that is a humans way...we are not here to copy an animal"..and BaHad ZuBu is just that..a thinking persons way. By the way he is 60 years of age and can run circles around most folks......had me puking in the bush during my last 31 day training visit with him. After 27 years of training I feel I get better and better with each passing day.

So don't consider getting older as a death sentence, embrace it, love it, live it and be an example of positive not negative...Hell getting older is a blessing in my book. And as they say today's 50 is yesterdays 30.

Best of luck.,.....Salamat

Peace

Punong Guro Michael Blackgrave
BaHad ZuBu
Western HQ
SATX

Ipagsama Katotohanan (bring truth)
 
Puting Carabao said:
50 years old is not old in my book..I am 44 soon to be 45 and feel better and better every day. It is about training smarter not harder. If your not in shape work towards getting there. There is no excuse....I have had countless injuries the last major one was 3 crushed discs from a car wreck...I took my time and healed and learned about me and what my strengths and weaknesses are. There are several ways to get tactically strong...kettle bells, club bells, body weight exercises, power walking and of course training your craft diligently, with intent and focus (smarter not harder)..I do all of the above and feel fantastic. Live a clean healthy life and you will see that getting older isn't a death sentence rather a life long journey only limited by ones lack of MANA (spirit)

And by the way my pop is 73 years young and still rides his bike 20 miles a day, goes fly fishing out in Wyoming, travels, hikes, hunts etc....tell him he is old and you will get a hardy F*** YOU....lol...! It is a mindset folks.

Now onto the aforementioned question:

If your grip is weak get it strong...hell squeeze a tennis ball..spring grips...kettle bells etc. etc. there is a plethora of devices that aid people to get better...find one and use it, religiously.

As to a system...I teach Bahad ZuBu, a southern Filipino methodology...and NO it is not a fancy system with moves that are so hokey only a spider monkey could pull it off...it is a deliberate system geared toward reality as opposed to theatrical. It deals with impact, edged, flexible and straight forward empty hands from ground to standing. As my teacher Master Yuli Romo jr. tells me " we must be intuitive and practical, that is a humans way...we are not here to copy an animal"..and BaHad ZuBu is just that..a thinking persons way. By the way he is 60 years of age and can run circles around most folks......had me puking in the bush during my last 31 day training visit with him. After 27 years of training I feel I get better and better with each passing day.

So don't consider getting older as a death sentence, embrace it, love it, live it and be an example of positive not negative...Hell getting older is a blessing in my book. And as they say today's 50 is yesterdays 30.

Best of luck.,.....Salamat

Peace

Punong Guro Michael Blackgrave
BaHad ZuBu
Western HQ
SATX

Ipagsama Katotohanan (bring truth)
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Awesome, sir! Great attitude. I had read this earlier and was going to post pretty much the same thing: age is a mindset. I intend to be strong and fast well into my twilight years. At anyrate, some folks might disagree, but fitness is going to be the platform upon which self-defense rests.

I am reading one of Pavel Tsatsouline's books on bodyweigt exercises and it seems to be working. The point is that I was imagining myself doing these exercises into my 60s and later, and it seems doable.

I didn't realize you were who you were until I saw your signature. I have emailed before re: classes. School breaks for me next week, Wed., I'll stop by on Thur.
 
look forward to meeting you. I also follow Pavels advise as well as some other folks. Life to me is precious so I do my best to put on a happy face and just live. I structure my classes so they are intense yet doable and all my guys love the workout and also the good times....if you don't have fun it isn't worth it...see ya Thursday..

PG MB
 
Most FMA will teach you basics that will work well with a folder or a cane,and you can learnboth at the same time. Go to you tube and type in "Escrima master". One of the item that should come up will be various sworddisarms done by the late head of the Illistrisimo style. I know it`s not what you had in mind,but really LOOK at it .......He`s 90 yrs old at the time. He`s not doing alot of fancy footwork. just fast basic hand work.
 
I think Michael Janich "Martial Blade Concepts" would be a good choice. I'm 54 and have been learning the system for a few years. Find a good partner, start slow (speed will come with practice) and gradually pick up the pace and power. While some of the counter blade aspects of the system will put a strain on your joints (suggestion, don't ask an 18 year old jock to be your partner :), at least not in the beginning) if you take your time you can learn the system and avoid injury.

You'll build speed and improve your technique and reaction with practice. The edge of a very sharp knife is power.
 
Look for videos of Cacoy Canete of the Doce Pares system on YouTube. He is closing in on 90 years old I believe, yet still displays amazing fighting skills.
 
Kelly Worden is another name to consider. He teaches FMA as well as Jeet Kune Do.

I haven't been to his seminars, but from what I've seen of his videos, he's quite a good teacher. What he teaches is simple, direct, and effective. I have yet to see him teach anything that only a well conditioned athlete in his twenties could perform. Anyone in reasonable health, who doesn't need an oxygen tank to get around, can learn from what Datu Worden teaches.
 
I'm 63 & seem to do ok with Bram Frank's teachings,Jandich is good,Rick Hernandez is good.Cane for OLD people...LOL...wait until you see what IT can do...you my friend are in for a eyeopening experience.Think about it...you can take it anywhere!:D
Jim
 
duller said:
Hi.

Can anyone recommend a basic style of defense w/ edged weapon, like a pocket folder, for a person no longer in their athletic prime and unable to outrun anyone? Also unable to do complex movements such as dropping to one knee to attack femural arteries or bending over backwards to dodge the big swipe across the chest, or other Matrix type moves. (I've saw both of those moves on youtube a few months back)

Aging and loss of ability is a fact of life. So what does a fella do who isn't ready for CaneMasters, yet, but can no longer do the complex body movements I see in so many FMA youtube videos? Or possibly the worst of all, no longer able to outrun a fella who thinks enough of his ability to attack someone?

Fyi, the ol' arms still work fine. Grip is getting weaker, though. A pocket folder seemed like a great little equalizer, btw. Which is why I mention it.
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Hello sir and thank you for taking an interest in FMA.

A lot of good advise has already been given you along the lines of style, technique and practicality, which is where the FMA truly shines. A lot of maestros and guros here are significantly a LOT older that you sir, yet have an understanding weapon potential and body mechanics that more than makes-up for physical frailties (as well as age).

That being said however, from what I gather from your post, it seems that first order of business you need to address before delving formally into any "martial art" (FMA included) is to have an understanding of basic SD concepts first. Things like situational awareness, assesing people, intuition-listening, carriage and personality projection, familiarity with the Targeting-Testing-Assault (TTA) paradigm, etc. First things first so to speak.

As an instructor myself, I truly believe that these are the foundations to be more prepared for "out there" in the streets.
 
Don Rearic said:
I think any FMA Instructor worth a damn would be able to cater to your requirements and if they won't, well, it's either because they don't have the vision of they're just selling their stuff.
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He is right. The beauty of FMA is it can be easily catered to the requirements of an individual.

Duller, you are still young! Was watching some FMA footage of a 90, 80 something, and 70 something year old just the other day. They were using canes, sticks, and blades.
 
I'm . . . well I'm post 50 any way, so I guess I'm in the same bracket you're talking about. My knees aren't what they used to be, but I'm doing a Fillipino based MMA class and loving it. As someone else posted here, if the instructor can't match to your ability, move on to somewhere else.

Speaking of things like that, since I've started training, my range of motion has GREATLY improved. I like the concept that the motions adapt to empty handed or weapons and that anything may be used as a weapon.
 
I recommend Mike Janich or you kids. If you have trouble doing something, he will come up with a good alternative. I'm 65.
 
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