Why a Magnesium alloy Fire Stick over a "shave and spark" Fire starter?

udtjim said:
I have used them both with so-so results. Neither works anywhere near as good as a Match or lighter. However these matches are not as cool I guess.;) However I have to confess that matches are my number one choice when I need a fire NOW. I carry bith of the other devices just in case I ever run out of matches.
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I think that is where they shine, I however do things different. I always try to build a fire with a mag bar or flint and if I fail, pull the bic out. If you can reliably build a fire with a flint or magbar, matches or a lighter is a walk in the park. Chris
 
I prefer the mag block ones, but I usually have a ferro rod with me as well.
 
I am talking about the absolute need to build a fire, not playing in the woods. I have had to start a fire where I was to cold to mess with several extra steps to get the fire started. I will go with something dead sure in a real emergency. I certainly enjoying playing with other stuff when it's just for kicks. I will take matches over any other item including a knife. My fire and tinder kit is on my belt whenever I am off road. I have four kinds of matches and the Magnesium block and Vaseline cotton balls and alcohol and two lighters and a small bag of shredded cardboard. There is a fire steel on my sheath but in a pinch I wouldn't use it unless it was a last resort.

JMO and they way I do things, no problem with what anyone else uses. I am well past 60 so I am fairly well set in the way I do things. Always great to learn more though. When I can't learn from others, I am ready to check out.

BTW Walmart here has the Magnesium block model.
 
If you could only have one which one will you pick? Typical ferro sticks are ok in many instances, but aren't in the same league as rat type fire sticks, when conditions are at their worst I.E. soaking wet, or heavy snow. These types of condition can make finding dry material difficult, this is where rat type strikers come into their own.

Rod vs slab

Rod by design is a stronger structure than slab, I would think that slabs would break, and would probably break on you when you really really need it. :(
 
I certainly believe in having some variety in your fire kit and something like the Doan can be a part of that. However, like k_estela, I like the 1/2" ferro rod in winter, the 3/8" in summer.

Last night, I was out on one of my snowy, windy ridges (on the ranch) with temperatures right around 12-degrees. Decided to take a rest and brew up some *quick* tea in my kit. I shaved off a 1/2" piece of punk wood onto my small leather swatch, and one strike, one spark from my 1/2" rod brought it to life. The more the wind blew, the hotter my little coal became, and in no time I had a small, comfortable little fire going. Now, had I only the Doan firestarter with magnesium, chances are with the wind swirling around like it was, my magnesium pile would have been offered up to the god's before I could get it going. A divot or depression in the frozen ground or snow would not have made a difference (wasn't going to build a shelter). Though, I could have used the rod on the Doan to drop some sparks effectively. Matches would have been worthless in those cold winds with little shelter. A shortened 1/2" rod and PJ cotton ball, or tinder fungus, is what works for me in the winter environment in which I live currently. Warmer weather rolls around and I will make some small adjustments to my kit. :)

The 1/2" rods I prefer to use, and make, are on the left.
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I have started fires in blizzards with matches as well as lighting cigars in gail force winds when I smoked many years ago. It's all in knowing how. Thats why I use what I use. to each his own.
 
udtjim said:
I have started fires in blizzards with matches as well as lighting cigars in gail force winds when I smoked many years ago. It's all in knowing how. Thats why I use what I use. to each his own.
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Matches are also part of my kit. I usually carry something like the REI Storm Proof matches in a beautiful, custom-made match safe that was given to me by one of my students. In our classes, I strongly advocate redundancy, choices, variety, flavors, etc., when it comes to the small and light weight fire making kit. I agree, udtjim, knowing how to properly use matches requires preparation and skill. :)
 
Yeah. Give a smoker one match and one cigar in a wind storm. he will get it lit. Those were the bad old days:D
 
udtjim said:
I am talking about the absolute need to build a fire, not playing in the woods. I have had to start a fire where I was to cold to mess with several extra steps to get the fire started. I will go with something dead sure in a real emergency. I certainly enjoying playing with other stuff when it's just for kicks. I will take matches over any other item including a knife. My fire and tinder kit is on my belt whenever I am off road. I have four kinds of matches and the Magnesium block and Vaseline cotton balls and alcohol and two lighters and a small bag of shredded cardboard. There is a fire steel on my sheath but in a pinch I wouldn't use it unless it was a last resort.

JMO and they way I do things, no problem with what anyone else uses. I am well past 60 so I am fairly well set in the way I do things. Always great to learn more though. When I can't learn from others, I am ready to check out.

BTW Walmart here has the Magnesium block model.
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One thing I notice on this forum is the tendency to combine bushcraft, survival, and traditionalim.

This is probably because survival and survivalism are a little jumbled together, so I think people tend to look for "permanent" solutions to firestarting, or solutions that don't depend on modern, disposable, consumer society to work.

It happens that I'm not a big fan of modern, disposable consumer society so I like stuff that seems a little more long term, like firesteels, or flint-and-tinder, or whatever.

But when I need heat to survive, I will use whatever method works fastest, best, first. If I emerge from a canoe accident in a freezing Canadian lake in winter, I am not screwing around with a flint and tinder. I want a god damn road flare and gasoline!

So for me there is a pretty big disconnect between short term survival and long term survivalism, even though I like both.
 
I agree with the redundancy crowd. I have NATO matches, a firesteel, a Spark-Lite, and a Bic in all my fire kits. I also have a few different types of tinde r(Tinder-Quik, Wet-Fire, PJCB) , some Coughlin firesticks, and a candle. I don't make many fires out of need but I believe I have what I need to make one in most instances.

I just got a box of fatwood kindling today so I'll likely throw a couple of those in each pack too.
 
CSG said:
I agree with the redundancy crowd. I have NATO matches, a firesteel, a Spark-Lite, and a Bic in all my fire kits. I also have a few different types of tinde r(Tinder-Quik, Wet-Fire, PJCB) , some Coughlin firesticks, and a candle. I don't make many fires out of need but I believe I have what I need to make one in most instances.

I just got a box of fatwood kindling today so I'll likely throw a couple of those in each pack too.
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what happens when you get to higher altitude ? I find it can be quite challenging what does everyone use?
 
Me too My fire kit contains both common type fire steels and blocks. Zippo lighter Bic lighter, Wind/water proof matches. strike anywhere matches, book matches, strike on the box matches, cotton balls with Vaseline, fire sticks , spray bottle of alcohol(. Better that Gas) band aides knife sharpener and a Vic classic. In my other small pack is a Tabasco sauce bottle of lighter fluid for the Zippo or tinder. small flashlite and a space blanket along with paracord. I feel pretty well set and this stuff fits very easy in a small fanny/waist pack.
 
When you use magnesium - you shave off (using the small chunk of COARSE blade you have) a pile of shavings - get your tinder ready - then spark into the magnesium. The magnesium takes this spark and gives you a LARGE, BRIGHT, burning ball for about 15 seconds. It works is wet weather or no.

If you have your tinder ready - this is all you need.

I like the Doan's bars. Softer magnesium - imbedded mishmetal - and a striker all on a stainless lanyard.

TF
 
Okay, I like the LMF firesteels because of the shower of sparks I get off them. Also a LMF will produce many more strikes then the tiny firesteel on a doan stick.

On the other hand, I find that the tiny firesteel on the Doans work pretty good. What is even better is that the magnesium part gives you a great hand hold to steady the striker. I actually find that I can make more controlled on the Doan firesteel than I can on a normal firesteel because of the way the doan is held. So now, I often grab the Doan first for setting my fire and use natural tinder or PJCB rather than messing with the magnesium shavings. Its nice to know that the magnesium is there if I need it.

Like others have said. If I need a fire now, out will come my little blow torch. That think will set anything on fire and will hold a hot, blue windproof flame continuous for 20 minutes.
 
Anyone find other tools work better for mag bars ? Saws on Swiss Army Knives, small Stanley Surform files, vegatable peeler, small cheese or nutmeg grater etc ?
 
runningboar said:
I think that is where they shine, I however do things different. I always try to build a fire with a mag bar or flint and if I fail, pull the bic out. If you can reliably build a fire with a flint or magbar, matches or a lighter is a walk in the park. Chris
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+1 :thumbup: When I want a fire when hiking or camping, I always use a ferro rod. (Maybe this year I'll add using a bow drill. :o) When I need a fire, I'll go with the easiest method available. Thermite grenade, anyone? :D

-- FLIX
 
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I once worked for a large company and worked in the raw materials vault cutting all kinds of metals and stuff. We had a special room for cutting Magnesium (which I never did) but a few of us went to the Adirondacks mountains hunting we filled film canisters full of the mag saw chips. We put them under the kindling wood and set a match to them, we had fire right away. It worked real well for getting the fire going that way. Doug
 
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To prove a point to a friend, I eschewed the lighter fluid (left) and started the fire using only what Joe calls a "shave and spark" fire starter; it was easy and fast, since we had some old newspaper on hand, and I guess that much was cheating. But still, I've never had any problems with either method.
 
I like the magnesium block fire starters.

They are half the cost of a scout model ferro rod.
They last a long time
I have never had one break
I rarely fail to light natural tinder with Doan tool sparker
Outside of demonstrations I have only used the magnesium in wet weather and it worked well

I have a Doan tool laced onto the machete sheathes I use for my course. Each guy gets a Doan tool as his primary fire lighter. Like Chris (Runningboar) I consider the Bic as a back-up when training.

I have found the squared off spine of a Mora a great tool for scraping the shavings. A knife blade tends to cut in too deep. The main problem is that people get impatient and stop scraping too soon. Keep at it, pass it off to someone else so they can keep at it. Build a small windbreak with rocks if you have to. Use a piece of tape to collect the shavings. Cut off a 1/2 inch ring of bike inner tube and collect the shavings inside the ring of rubber. The magnesium will ignite the rubber and give lots of long lasting flame.

I think everyone should own a Doan tool. They are everywhere. Take the time to learn how to make one work. Often I encounter people who bought one, tried it a time or two and gave up. Mac
 
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