Why Baton?

[Gryffin]

Wow, for once I agree with Cliff. Someone make note of the date.

I'm not going to address the OP's issues about alternate tinders. Vivi did a splendid job of that already. :thumbup:

For myself, I've done it both ways: I sometimes pack a Ratweiler and baton my firewood, sometimes a Vaughan Mini Hatchet and split it.

It's really the same thing: a sharp edge + wedge shape + force = splitting. Heck, you could carve wedges out of wood, or split them off rocks, and use those instead; it's the same principle.

One difference I can think of: if your axe or hatchet breaks (actually, the handle is what breaks), you can make a new one with a knife. If your knife breaks while batonning, good luck trying to make a new one with your axe!

Some folks would rather just have one tool, a knife, do double duty. I can understand that. Personally, if I ever found myself in a survival situation, I'd rather have more than one sharp edge to rely on.

 

[HoB]

Well, for those people that think that batoning is useless, go out in the yard and try it. It is really a very useful technique for simple yardwork and firewood and has not necessarily anything to do with survival. If I have only a hatchet and a decent sized knife, I would always choose batoning the knife over using the hatchet....it is simply much easier for most logs. Yes, a nice fullsized axe with a good chopping block is better, but that is often not around...expecially when it is not my yard I am working in. Besides, as Owen already said: Its not something that should be a challenge for any decent fixed blade. I will admit, I never believed it either, till I tried it.

Why you would baton a folder is a mystery to me though, aside from simply trying to see what it will hold up to.

 

[Vivi]

Althought it stresses the pivot quite a bit, most folders seem to be able to endure it. I've tried an Endura, Manix, 110, various SAKs and Opinels, Byrds and a couple others. The biggest drawback when batoning with a folder is most of them don't have an effective enough blade length. That's why my Opinel #10 goes with me to the woods so often, and it's also why I want to trade for a #12.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Why you would baton a folder is a mystery to me though ...

For the same reason you would carry a folder in the first place.

Althought it stresses the pivot quite a bit, most folders seem to be able to endure it.

This is mainly an issue of improper technique, either don't engage the lock or impact between the piviot and the wood.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=419107

-Cliff

 

[Gryffin]

That's why my Opinel #10 goes with me to the woods so often, and it's also why I want to trade for a #12.

Drop me an email. I've got a No. 12 and a coupla No. 10's sitting around here, brand new.

 

[HoB]

For the same reason you would carry a folder in the first place.
-Cliff

I got a good laugh out of that one, Cliff! No, my folders are pampered in comparison to yours . Mine might see some contractor work but rarely do they have to go out and earn their living in the fields and woods.

No, honestly, if you say it has some uses, that is good enough for me, but it is not why *I* am carrying a folder in the first place . Even my RD9 is earning its keep as a yard tool (a very useful one, I might add), cleaning up storm damage etc., rather than as a hiker/camper/survivalist.

 

[lambertiana]

Generally speaking, I don't feel a need to baton. But, I will give you one personal experience where it helped a lot.

I do a fair amount of backpacking, and I don't carry a hatchet because of weight issues. Earlier this summer, I backpacked 71 miles across the Sierra, west to east, with over 13,000' vertical gain at high elevation (between 7000' and 14,505'). So weight is an issue with me.

On that trip, we were on an unmaintained trail when we reached the Kern River. Right at the water's edge where the ford is, an aspen had fallen down. The trunk was chest high, and there were numerous branches that were 1-2" diameter, going up and down, that effectively blocked access to the ford. I searched upstream and down for a good crossing point, but the only good crossings had thick brush blocking the way. So it was back to dealing with the aspen tree. I had a small saw (a Cabelas AG crosslock), but it would have taken a while to cut all those branches off. So I took out my Northstar (which only got to go on the trip after much deliberation, I wasn't sure if I wanted to add the weight because I had never needed a fixed blade on a backpacking trip before). By batoning with the Northstar, I was able to cut off all of the offending branches in no time. It goes to show you that you never know when you might need to baton with a knife.

 

[gud4u]

Batoning very much applies in cutting applications requiring precisely controlled cuts of difficult materials. You maintain cutting precision by applying force in controlled increments.

A very practical application of batoning - in your own kitchen - would be cutting through a large parsnip, turnip or rhutebaga. Given the combination of round geometry + dense material, the forceful high-speed swing of either a cleaver or an axe is inadvisable. Something is likely to be damaged - but perhaps not the intended target vegetable.

 

[SkunkWerX]

I have a baton.
I painted it red.

I call it Baton Rouge.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Batoning very much applies in cutting applications requiring precisely controlled cuts of difficult materials.

Indeed, cutting up a piece of cable or heavy wire is a lot easier on a knife with a light impact on the spine than trying to pull the knife through like you would for rope. Nice perspective on considering the possiblities of the application and not a focus on a particular implementation.

... but it is not why *I* am carrying a folder in the first place...

It was an attempt at being clever. Generally you carry a a knife because it is more efficient on occasion than trying to separate things by hand. You impact the spine for the same reason, on occasion it is more efficient than doing otherwise.

-Cliff

 

[Bastid]

Must be nice to know it all:jerkit:

Did not say I knew it all. Just said in my experience the I felt the task (with a knife) is silly and I still feel that way.

Come to think of it the statement you made above is with the smilie is equally silly.

 

[sodak]

If I have to baton wood, then I didn't bring a big enough knife!

Seriously, I don't see it as a big deal. It's a fast and easy way to be more effective with a knife, once you've practiced it. No big deal. If a fixed blade can't handle batoning, then it's not going to be the *only* fixed blade that I carry into the woods, for safety's sake. I have some knives that I would not consider batoning with, but they tend to be more special-purpose. If I'm carrying a smaller knife as my only carry, then it's going to be robust enough to get whacked.

If I'm carrying a bowie or khukuri (which I usually am), this is all academic anyway.

 

[Ron Athay]

Batoning on a daily basis? I learned batoning first and that got me interested in knives and steels. Now every day (twice a day actually) I use my Griptillian D2 folder to baton my Diabetes pills in half (careful, controlled force).
I have also batoned up a half dozen alder trees teaching my 9 grandsons to baton just for fun and fire building. My 7 year old grandson remembered that my RAT-3 was made of D2 steel six months later. Why baton? Because we can and it is fun. It is also much safer than a 7 year old with an ax.
Ron Athay