Why buy a Sebanza when customs cost the same?

Big Dave

Big Dave

Gold Member
Joined
Dec 18, 1998
Messages
548
Help me figure this out!

I want a high quality fighter / utility knife. Being detailed oriented and obsessive compulsive (aka knife nut) - I can’t figure out the following:

A large plain “semi-custom” Sebanza cost $325.

For an additional $25 (or a little more or less) you can get a “custom” knife from Crawford, Carsen, Corby and others.

The Sebanza seems to be an all time favorite but it is not cheap. So, if your going to drop $300 + on a knife why buy a Sebanza when you can get a custom?

What are your thoughts?

Big Dave

Oh, you might want to know what I'd use it for. Nothing really.
 
Tom:
Thanks for the reply. I know that the Sebanza is a great knife. But, I have read some posts where people say that it does not come close to a Crawford…

Following are “customized pattern knives” for under $400. Do you think the Sebanza is a better, stronger, cooler knife than some of these?

Dave


Corby:
 LL Model 1: Tactical Side-lock Design $300
http://www.knivesbycorby.com/My%20Documents/folders.htm

Carson:
 Model 4 Clip Point $350
http://www.kvnet.org/knives/ph1.htm

Crawford
 Aluminum Point Guard $300.00
 Titanium Point Guard $375.00
 The New Shark $375.00
 Kasper #1 Combat folder Standard Model $375.00
 The Combat Folders $375
http://www.crawfordknives.com

 
Big Dave,

TomW is right to a degree (by the way Tom, who are you. It appears youve been around custom knives for awhile). Most Tactical/Utility folders have moved into the $400+ range.

The main question here is why would you pay $325 for a factory knife. Since Chris by his own admission has not made any of his knives for over 18 months. While the Sebenza is a very well made knife, the main reason it was priced at $325 was because Chris (or so we thought) made the knife. We will leave the question of integrity alone.

First Big Dave what do you want the knife to do. Then are materials a consideration, if so what are the considerations. Are the elements of nature a consideration i.e. salt water, Extreme heat or cold, etc. Next what legally and functionally do you need the blade length to be.

There are numerous knives that can accomplish what you want, you just have to figure out what you want the knife to do. If you do want a Sebenza, wait for awhile there are several dealers across the country who are starting to lower their prices on Sebenza's. I for one have already done that.

TomW has a point, try and attend a large custom knife show (not gun and knife show)and feel them in your hand. This will narrow your focus quickly. You have already experienced "opinions" from others concerning the Chameleon. It's best to make up your own mind.

Les Robertson
 
you don't know who i am yet les? i'm the big guy with the beard selling all them knife pouches at the shows. talked to you you at Ttimonium but didn't try to sell you anything- speaking of timonium what did you thinkof them folders by Fred Slee?
decent very affordable knives in my opinion. There is the knife for guys looking for a nice low priced user. solid knives
 
A lot of people really brag about their Sebenza, and I think it has something to do with the fact that it is the first knife they bought when they moved from regular production knives to something more expensive and beefier. I didn't say "all people", so please, everyone spare me the stories of how you are the exception, I just mean that many people carry Benchmades and then make the big move up to a Sebenza, so they really don't know what to compare it too. I have said before that I think the extra $100 or so in a custom is just for the fact that it is a custom. I think that a production Sebenza is worth about $200. Just like a production Emerson Commander is worth $200, while a Custom Emerson of the same exact feel and specs is $500 or more from Emerson. People pay that extra amount to have the MAN, the ARTIST himself make it. I have a Sebenza, one of the older ones that was definitly made by Chris, and I like it a lot. It is a good knife, simple and perfectly functional. But, next to my Kit Carson, I just don't think there is a comparison, especially if you are comparing a Production Sebenza to a Custom Carson or Lightfoot. That is what I mean by that, many of the hardcore Sebenza fans have never owned a Carson or Lightfoot, so they think the Sebenza is the baddest, toughest folder around. I have to say, my Carson next to my Sebenza...I dunno, I just really like the Carson. It is beefier, has a super comfy handle, is smooth as glass and is huge like an Abrams in your pocket!
The Sebenza is a good knife, simple and perfect in that way, but IMO, when you put it next to a similarly priced cutom Carson or a little more expensive custom Lightfoot, you would immediatly see the difference.


JMHO,
thaddeus
 
BTW- Tom is right, the Sebenza is better than many customs and will outlast most. I am very picky about the custom folders I would buy, and at the moment the only ones the I have found to be worth the money and that I would consider better than the Sebenza are Carson, Lightfoot and Crawford. I am relatively new (couple years) to the custom knife game though, so by no means is that a complete list, but it IS much shorter than the list of makers that I would NOT buy from.

thaddeus
Anxiously awaiting his hot pink Crawford Kasper Fighting Folder with the Rolling lock!
wink.gif

 
Why do people buy a Sebanza instead of opting for a custom? Probably because they are much more well known and have such a strong following.

Performance wise I have yet to see a detailed comparasion of them against any of the more common production blades let alone any of the decent customs.

-Cliff
 
Terzuolas are a few notches above Sebenzas. As I mentioned in my previous post in the Custom forum, you pay about $150 more, but you get your money's worth.

It's like comparing a Heuer to a Rolex.
 
I'm one of those people who upgraded from a
Benchmade to a Sebenza. Eventually, I began collecting, and using true customs. Needless to say, I've yet to come across any custom or production folder that I have more confidence thhan the Sebenza.
in. I've used this knife hard, for the last
4 years, and it still locks up just as tight
as the day I got it, no play whatsoever.
I think the knife is so well designed that it's almost boring, but it's definetely the one folder in my collection that I would carry if my life really depended on. I have not handled the Carson of Crawford knife, and have only briefly handled Terzoula and Lightfoot knives (and very impressed with them). I would like to know what exactly makes these knives much better than the Sebenza. (In other words, give me an excuse to buy one from each maker
smile.gif
)
 
mgkrame,

If you are really a knifenut, eventually, you'll buy them
wink.gif
.

We have to admit that custom knives somehow jumped outside the role as a tool. It's an art-form, even without engraving or scrimshaws. Think of the different mechanisms, locks, blade shapes.....

But in my opinion, why ppl like Sebanza is it's reproduceablity... hehe... I know I am able to replace one if I break one. And with that in mind, I'll use it hard and then discover that it CAN BE used hard. How will you know a knife worth several thousand dollars is tough if you can't abuse it?

If a maker just make the knife once in his life-time, will you use that knife? If I lose my sebanza, I know I can buy another one with exactly the same features and durability. Then I can say that it is one of the best..... hey not the best yet.... how can you compare with the others? I, for example possess a Terzuola with "wootz" blade, I know it's good, very much wanted to carry and use it, but probably will never use it!! Still the plain old Sebanza in my pocket.

Joe Leung
 
Oooh. Good answers.

Like I said, I won't really use it for anything. My work doesn't require that I have one. Envelopes and the occasional hang nail is about it. A $15 Swiss Army knife would suit my needs better than any anything.

I do not have the option to see most of these knives except on the web (due to being in Hawaii). So, really it's just seeing what looks cool and hearing your opinions.

If I were to carry it, it would need to be around the small Sebanza size. I really like the BRIAN TIGHE: TIE TAC III listed on Les's web site. But it's $450.
http://www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com/rcc/tigtac.htm

True, you may be less likely to use it - but I don't care. I rarely use pocket knives anyway. For me, it's just the joy of having it in my pocket. It does not make a whole lot of sense - oh well.

The points are well taken.

I am grateful to all of you who participate in the forums and also to those of you that provide the forum.

Aloha!

Dave


Wow- I just found out I am now a MEMBER of the forums. In the short amount of time I have learned a great deal! Yes, my junior member days are behind me. Thanks again.

[This message has been edited by Big Dave (edited 05 January 1999).]
 
There are some incredible custom knives out there. In fact, there are some incredible custom knives right in the Sebenza's price range. So why would I buy a Sebenza, now that it's just a production piece?

A few reasons:

- Production piece or not, the Sebenza continues to display custom-like tolerances.

- The Sebenza's edge geometry is excellent, easily outcutting the gaggles of thick-edge sabre-ground cool-looking tactical customs out there. There *are* customs out there that can cut with the Sebenza, but the Sebenza's cutting ability is at least as good as most tacticals.

- The Sebenza's integral lock is rock solid. Most of those custom knives are liner locks. I've easily popped the liner locks of all the big names -- Terzuola (white knuckle failure), Elishewitz (white knuckle and liner too long failures), Crawford (liner too long failures), Emerson, Carson -- at one time or another. Never done that to a Sebenza, and I've handled way more of 'em.

In summary, the Sebenza easily bests most customs lock-reliability-wise, and probably edges many of them out cutting-performance-wise. The high-end custom makers reach a level of aesthetics and fit&finish that the Sebenza can't quite reach, but the Sebenza is still pretty solid in that regard.

Is a production Sebenza worth $325 when you can get a Point Guard for $375? Tough call, but the answer is NOT obvious to me.

Joe
jat@cup.hp.com

[This message has been edited by Joe Talmadge (edited 05 January 1999).]
 
joe et al.,
why is it that everyone says the pointguard is $375? is the aluminum version which if i remember correctly is $300 that much inferior to the titanium version? after all, the blade is still the same on the 2 isn't it?
just wondering,
ard
 
The Titanium Point Guard is $375. I have not handled the Aluminum Point Guard. I do have the Titanium Model, it is a beautiful knife, silk smooth action, perfect craftmanship, razor sharp. Both models do come with an ATS-34 Blade.. Well Worth the Money.. Murr
 
It is very appropriate that the Ti Point Guard should come up in conversation about the Sebenza. Pat and Wes put a very wide hollow grind on the Point Guard blade with a moderately thin edge, that when sharpened properly, can provide cutting efficiency very similar to that of the Sebenza. The in-line point, thickly ground tip, and ergonomic handle shape make it the "tactical" Sebenza in my opinion. The lock might not be as reliable as the Sebenza lock though. I had the Ti lock spring on my PG replaced with a stronger stainless steel spring, and it is now one leaf lock that I have 100% confidence in.

A lot of makers of "bench made" knives use some machinery in the manufacture of their knife parts. Some have blades and liners plasma cut. The lines between hand made, cutom made, bench made, and even semi-production are getting very blurry these days, especially in the case of liner or leaf locks where the precision of modern production technology can actually offer a better finished product. Unless the maker's name has some dollar value, like Emerson, it is hard to see what advantage the "custom" knives have in terms of quality.

Harv

[This message has been edited by Steve Harvey (edited 12 January 1999).]
 
From reading the post from Chris Reeve, it seems that his knives are also partialy handmade. So that would be the reason for the price. I am expecting one in anytime so stop saying that its a factory knife. I have to find some reason to justify spending 325 for a knife. Its partly custom, its partly custom, its partly custom,... everyone now!
smile.gif


 
forgive me as I join this thread late. I have been agonizing over this same subject for days now. I've got a special "gentleman's" knive I carry in suit, and I've got some nice pieces I won't carry, but what I'm really looking for is a pickuptruck-witha-bedliner knife for my jeans pocket. Everytime I get ready to order a Sebenza I choke. I read all the critical stuff and I go back to looking at customs. I almost said the hell with it and ordered a BM Axis! Then I took a few deep breaths. By the way... does anybody find anything remotely appealing in the decorated sebenzas?
 
I don't really see the controversy myself. The Sebenza costs a little less than almost all "handmade"/"benchmade"/"custom" folders, is as strong and indestructible as any of them or more so, and has about the best cutting edge of any knife I've ever handled. That adds up to one of the best values in the knife market to me. In addition, the Sebenza has a lock that is extraordinarily reliable, which puts it in the buy category for me, along with the Benchmade 710, Wood Irie swivel lock folders, and the REKAT Pioneer, while every leaf lock or liner lock folder on the market is in the sell category.

Custom schmustom, I say. The notion has almost no value for me since I don't buy knives based on the maker's name. Quality, as evidenced by fit, function, and durability, is my metric of value, and I don't see the term "custom" as a reliable indicator of quality.

Harv
 
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