Why don't we see more DC53 blades?

dirc said:
I'm just curious, is DC53 going to catch on more?

it's really quite a lot better than D2
http://www.titussteel.com/our-products/mould-and-die-steels/dc-53/

I know it's not a 'super powder' steel, but it seems really nice toughness wise, and hardens to 64 easily...
I hope it gets some more attention for the 'value' knives
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It sounds good from the specs... I usually prefer steels with a tad more Chromium for my Culinary Knives but I’m interested to hear if you have made any cutters/ Choppers/Skicers and what application?
 
It looks like D2 with some carbon taken out. ( 1.5% vs 1%) so I get the tougher claim. If it is more wear resistant than they are getting it from the heat treat and final hardness not the steel chemistry. It should be a good clean steel that works and heat treats well but I wouldn't see any reason to pay higher prices than for regular ingot D2 if cutlery is the intended use.

Joe
 
I have an American Standard Tanto by Ivan Campos in D3, a 1/4" thick chisel ground blade that is one of the toughest steels I have come across. I chopped through a 2 x 4 with it and it was still hair-popping sharp. A real chore to grind, though, Ivan said.
 
Titus steel only sells in Canada.



This place sells DC53 out of Kentucky

http://www.imsteel.com/steelstore/index.ht

They are very friendly and knife friendly too. They said people use it for knives all the time but they didn't have the thickness I was looking for. They stock 3/8 and 1/2. I guess guys are forging it.

I like the composition, it's like Vascowear ,(non pm cruwear)
But not as much wear and finer structures.

I think I'll stick with CPM cruwear, PD1 and Zwear.
DC53 isn't going to outcut those steels.
Powdering keeps it nice and fine with the added bonus of more carbides.

Id probably rather buy PSF27 and CPM D2 as well.
Those are more structurally refined D2 steels.
They are also available in the sizes I want and affordable.

What I like about DC53 is that it looks like a knife sharpeners steel.
 
It would be interesting if CPM did a DC53 also, the addition of vanadium etc should really help the edge retention and it should be much tougher than D2 (based on what is said about the non-CPM versions of each)

I am not sure how this is achieved - DC53 has much smaller carbides according to this, probably due the addition of V.
http://www.moldsteel.com/cold_work_die_steels/dc53/dc53_home.htm

also, notice the toughness is way higher than D2, basically on the same level as A2
 
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dirc said:
It would be interesting if CPM did a dc53 also, the addition of vanadium etc should really help the edge retention and it should be much tougher than d2 (based on what is said about the non-CPM versions of each)
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They do, it's called CPM Cruwear
 
but Cruwear is quite a bit different composition wise

Typical Chemistry
Carbon 1.10%
Manganese 0.35%
Silicon 1.10%
Chromium 7.50%
Vanadium 2.40%
Tungsten 1.15%
Molybdenum 1.60%

while DC53
Comp.jpg


They are definitely similar, but cru has much more V. Also, I'm guessing it costs much more.. the original reason I wanted to see DC53 used more is for value/budget & hard use blades. If CPM-cru is available for the same price as DC53, I'd be all over it ;)
 
dirc said:
but Cruwear is quite a bit different composition wise

Typical Chemistry
Carbon 1.10%
Manganese 0.35%
Silicon 1.10%
Chromium 7.50%
Vanadium 2.40%
Tungsten 1.15%
Molybdenum 1.60%

while DC53
Comp.jpg


They are definitely similar, but cru has much more V. Also, I'm guessing it costs much more.. the original reason I wanted to see DC53 used more is for value/budget & hard use blades. If CPM-cru is available for the same price as DC53, I'd be all over it ;)
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Yes, correct, they are not exact but neither is m390/20cv/204p but they are direct analogs of each other.


The price they wanted for DC53 was higher then cruwear and they don't make it in the right size for knives unless the steel is being forged, surface ground or hot rolled thinner it's not usable.

Call imsteel and see

You asked for a powdered version with more Vanadium, that's Cruwear and it's $17 per foot.

Raw material doesn't purely factor the finished product cost
 
thanks bear, that is rather crazy... I expected that DC53 should be only about 25-50% more than D2... It doesn't make sense really
 
The advertising says they achieve the toughness and finer structure by doing a second refining process on the melt to help remove impurities and inclusions.

The toughness also comes from the HUGE drop in carbon to 1.00 from 1.50 found in D2.

The steel looks alot like A2
FnCcATL.png


Also Sleipner

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Lastly, let's throw in cruwear for fun

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I think at the end of the day good steel with great heat treatment beats great steel with good heat treatment so I would be more concerned with chasing microstructures with steel that's available rather then chasing alloys that I'd have to start from scratch to figure out and cost more because of how obscure they are.
 
Had used and shapened several DC53 knives.

The steel gets its reputation for its rockwell hardness and better performance compared with "Chinese D2".
Moreover, the edge retention is not bad and could beat most carbon steel I had tried like 1095, sk5.

As far as I know only Chinese brands and knifemakers are frequently use this steel...and that is another long story.
 
I've seen DC53 offered in some larger Chinese knives. My understanding is that it would make a good affordable, tough steel for that application. It has some similarities with sleipner.

Here's a nice article on the development of low carbide tool steels like DC53 where the lower volume of carbides (no primary carbides) allows for both higher hardness (than steels like D2 with massive carbides) and better impact strength among other things:

https://www.thefabricator.com/article/stamping/new-low-carbide-tool-steel-doubles-triples-tool-life

I was going to get a Chinese DC53 chopper to beat the hell out of, but it sold out or the seller just stopped selling it before I could get it. I did end up getting this nice drop point hunter in DC53, but I've decided to sell it instead of sharpening it and testing it. I am fairly sure it is DC53 as I've seen another knife from this brand tested (S35VN) via PMI gun and it came back legit.

PxxFx6S.jpg

izsBiUS.jpg
 
Kreese said:
I've seen DC53 offered in some larger Chinese knives. My understanding is that it would make a good affordable, tough steel for that application. It has some similarities with sleipner.

Here's a nice article on the development of low carbide tool steels like DC53 where the lower volume of carbides (no primary carbides) allows for both higher hardness (than steels like D2 with massive carbides) and better impact strength among other things:

https://www.thefabricator.com/article/stamping/new-low-carbide-tool-steel-doubles-triples-tool-life

I was going to get a Chinese DC53 chopper to beat the hell out of, but it sold out or the seller just stopped selling it before I could get it. I did end up getting this nice drop point hunter in DC53, but I've decided to sell it instead of sharpening it and testing it. I am fairly sure it is DC53 as I've seen another knife from this brand tested (S35VN) via PMI gun and it came back legit.

PxxFx6S.jpg

izsBiUS.jpg
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DC53 has "undissolved" carbides in the tempered martensite matrix for wear resistance, they're just smaller than D2 because of the lower volume in the steel. Now I'm aware of what they said in that article and the semantics of primary vs secondary (k1/M23C6-k2/M7C3) but I feel can lead to hype and confusion with folks thinking we get fully dissolved Carbides and only sub micron temper carbides which is also something not desirable either. They have a micrograph and you can see side by side with D2 the white clusters of M7C3 carbide in DC53. D2 also has these Carbides but the volume is heavy and no PM is used to prevent segregation so it's a clumpy mess. It has its merits such as being cheap and great for toothy edges though but there are better steels available now.
Volume of carbide forming elements and carbon has a significant effect on carbide size with non PM grades. A good example of this is AEBL, which is finer than most PM grades thanks to the volume and carbon,chromium balance.

It's 2019, we have CPM Cruwear widely available. No reason to use DC53 except for novelty, it's not widely available, it's not readily found in the right sizes for knives or the cheapest. So that's why its defunct.
Also, CPM Cruwear smokes this steel.
 
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Nice. I was thinking that in Asia they might use it simply due to availability and cheapness, but yeah if I were to make a knife there'd be no reason not to use something better like Cruwear. BTW love the knife steel nerds discussions you have with Larrin (forget the spelling, don't kill me L).
 
Kreese said:
Nice. I was thinking that in Asia they might use it simply due to availability and cheapness, but yeah if I were to make a knife there'd be no reason not to use something better like Cruwear. BTW love the knife steel nerds discussions you have with Larrin (forget the spelling, don't kill me L).
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I haven’t killed anyone over the way my name was spelled...yet.
 
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