Why is your knife the best "Survival" knive??
- Thread starter Les Robertson
- Start date
Richard
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Lets all try to remember one thing, Walter Brend DID NOT enter this thread. Les has a way of thinking he knows everything, and generally thinks anybody who disagrees with him is some kind of moron. Dont aim any anger at Brend, he is a maker of very fine knives(never owned one, but his reputation is good) Les just happens to be mentioning Brend while taking pot shots at others.
Les, you generally start off your responses with "Guys, blah blah blah..." and proceed to ramble on correcting all of us dorks about the subject of custom knives. Well, no doubt you know quite a bit, you do have a small habit of NOT doing your homework. Remember the thread recently in which you told where when and how the guild got started? Remember also how AG Russell responded and had to correct your information? Now you tell a story about Busse that is twisted and unfair, so Jerry fills in the true facts. Now I suppose you wonder what the guild story and Busse story have to do with anything. Well Les, "YOU" are the one who is constantly telling us to "DO OUR HOMEWORK". I just figure maybe you oughta do the same, dont ya think?
Back to the knife content, you list everything you did while you carried the Brend. I would be willing to bet that there are other military men who have done more and harder things for a longer time than you did who carried a Randall, EK, or even the inexpensive Ka-Bar. SO, does that make their knives the "best"? Probably to them it does.
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Les, you generally start off your responses with "Guys, blah blah blah..." and proceed to ramble on correcting all of us dorks about the subject of custom knives. Well, no doubt you know quite a bit, you do have a small habit of NOT doing your homework. Remember the thread recently in which you told where when and how the guild got started? Remember also how AG Russell responded and had to correct your information? Now you tell a story about Busse that is twisted and unfair, so Jerry fills in the true facts. Now I suppose you wonder what the guild story and Busse story have to do with anything. Well Les, "YOU" are the one who is constantly telling us to "DO OUR HOMEWORK". I just figure maybe you oughta do the same, dont ya think?
Back to the knife content, you list everything you did while you carried the Brend. I would be willing to bet that there are other military men who have done more and harder things for a longer time than you did who carried a Randall, EK, or even the inexpensive Ka-Bar. SO, does that make their knives the "best"? Probably to them it does.
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Richard Todd - Digital knife photography
icq 61363141
My WebSite
Do your site a favor, get quality digital images!!!
New photos added!!!
Bronco
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Richard,
You make an excellent point by stating that none of the "emotion" present in this thread should be directed against Walter Brend. One thing we've all been able to agree upon up until this point is that Walter makes some very nice blades.
Beyond that, let's all try our best to keep this discussion friendly and focused on blade performance (as difficult as that might be under the circumstances
).
Les,
No doubt punching into 55 gallons drums and cutting the straps off of banded pallets are handy things to be able to do with your blade when in the military. But as Richard alluded to, these are things that I successfully accomplished on many occasions (at FARP sites, for example) with nothing more than a $35 Kabar.
I think it would be more helpful for many of the participants in this thread, if you could give some examples of those instances where you really felt like you were pushing your Brend to the absolute limit, and perhaps speculate on how you feel other, lesser, knives might have failed under similar circumstances. In this way forumites who don't have our military experience will at least have a frame of reference on which to better judge the suitability of their own blades.
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Semper Fi
-Bill
You make an excellent point by stating that none of the "emotion" present in this thread should be directed against Walter Brend. One thing we've all been able to agree upon up until this point is that Walter makes some very nice blades.
Beyond that, let's all try our best to keep this discussion friendly and focused on blade performance (as difficult as that might be under the circumstances
Les,
No doubt punching into 55 gallons drums and cutting the straps off of banded pallets are handy things to be able to do with your blade when in the military. But as Richard alluded to, these are things that I successfully accomplished on many occasions (at FARP sites, for example) with nothing more than a $35 Kabar.
I think it would be more helpful for many of the participants in this thread, if you could give some examples of those instances where you really felt like you were pushing your Brend to the absolute limit, and perhaps speculate on how you feel other, lesser, knives might have failed under similar circumstances. In this way forumites who don't have our military experience will at least have a frame of reference on which to better judge the suitability of their own blades.
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Semper Fi
-Bill
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WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
not2sharp
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Perhaps the best way to get through this is to look at the artifacts. Lets see pictures of those tortured Busse and Brend knives. These are both excellent knives and we can expect them to hold up well. But, like everything else, knives wear. I have seen alot more wear on Randalls, and Ka-bars than I have seen on anything else.
It is unfair to ask Les, or Cliff, or anyone else to list everything they have ever done with their knives. I mean who can remember enough to provide a realistic catalog of activity. But a picture can capture the entire story, with every detour from the graceful lines of a mint knife an indication of the damaged sustained during use.
N2S
It is unfair to ask Les, or Cliff, or anyone else to list everything they have ever done with their knives. I mean who can remember enough to provide a realistic catalog of activity. But a picture can capture the entire story, with every detour from the graceful lines of a mint knife an indication of the damaged sustained during use.
N2S
Cliff Stamp
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The posts in this thread concerning the knives from Busse Combat were regarding the INFI models. To make a statement about the greater durability of Brends work using an example of two broken Busse blades as you have worded it strongly implies that they were with INFI blades and the customer was burnt by Busse Combat.
And I am pretty sure that this was the impression that many people had, I for one, and would have continued to have except that Busse stepped in and cleared the matter up. As it turns out this was a gross misrepresentation of the facts.
One return was due to the failure of a bolt in the handle and another with a *prototype* in D2 - and both blades were replaced.
The obvious question to consider is that why did Busse switch from D2 in the prototype to A2 in the regular line and then to INFI later on. Extrapolating from the performance of a prototype in a different steel to the performance of the final product which is significantly different is just wrong on so many levels.
What about if I had Brend make me a #2 in M2 and leave it at 64 RC. I could then break it easily with little shock (or flex). Now what about if further I brought this up when someone was discussing the durability of Brends #2. If I left out the fact that mine was in a different steel they could certainly get a very bad (and very wrong) impression of Brends work.
One more thing concerning the high rate of failures of the production knives and the zero problems with customs. How many people did you see using production vs custom knives and furthermore how many people will use a $500 custom knife with the same frequence and intensity as a $35 production knife - especially when the custom is *not* covered under breakage during prying and other similar work.
-Cliff
And I am pretty sure that this was the impression that many people had, I for one, and would have continued to have except that Busse stepped in and cleared the matter up. As it turns out this was a gross misrepresentation of the facts.
One return was due to the failure of a bolt in the handle and another with a *prototype* in D2 - and both blades were replaced.
The obvious question to consider is that why did Busse switch from D2 in the prototype to A2 in the regular line and then to INFI later on. Extrapolating from the performance of a prototype in a different steel to the performance of the final product which is significantly different is just wrong on so many levels.
What about if I had Brend make me a #2 in M2 and leave it at 64 RC. I could then break it easily with little shock (or flex). Now what about if further I brought this up when someone was discussing the durability of Brends #2. If I left out the fact that mine was in a different steel they could certainly get a very bad (and very wrong) impression of Brends work.
One more thing concerning the high rate of failures of the production knives and the zero problems with customs. How many people did you see using production vs custom knives and furthermore how many people will use a $500 custom knife with the same frequence and intensity as a $35 production knife - especially when the custom is *not* covered under breakage during prying and other similar work.
-Cliff
Les Robertson
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Richard,
First, the story about the Busse knives is not twisted or unfair. Jerry Emailed me and I sent him the information to him.
As well I received a phone call from the client who did break the blades. There is one correction, he did buy other Busse blades.
As for Blah Blah Blah, when people ask questions I like to answer them as completely as I can. Sometimes I go farther in depth than some people would like.
As for doing homework. Yep, I got stumped on the first Guild Show. Good thing AG was there to square me away.
Richard, again your right, I have no doubt that there have been others who have done more with their knives. This thread was started to hear from those people, sadly you showed up.
As since you did not tell us what knife you own and examples of why it was the best survial knife (see title of thread). It would appear you are not one of these individuals.
So Richard either provide some information about the thread topic or shut up.
Big Tex, I think you will agree that this also hit the nail on the head. So we will be looking for your post on your knife and why it is the best "survival knife".
Richard and Tex, please try to keep your posts on track. If you want to Whine and Snivel, plese go to the Whine and Cheese forum.
You don't like what I am writing fine. Then use the scroll function and go past what I have to say. I will tell you that you are confused about pot shots. I don't do that. I name names and stand behind everyting I say.
This is what this thread was designed for. To bring out those who have used their knives, to an extreme. Personally, I don't care if you carry a factory knife or a production knife.
I just wanted to hear why you think yours is the best.
However, thread like this and "best fighting knife" as usual turn into a pissing contest. The flames are fanned by those with little or no actual experience with custom knives.
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Les Robertson
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
First, the story about the Busse knives is not twisted or unfair. Jerry Emailed me and I sent him the information to him.
As well I received a phone call from the client who did break the blades. There is one correction, he did buy other Busse blades.
As for Blah Blah Blah, when people ask questions I like to answer them as completely as I can. Sometimes I go farther in depth than some people would like.
As for doing homework. Yep, I got stumped on the first Guild Show. Good thing AG was there to square me away.
Richard, again your right, I have no doubt that there have been others who have done more with their knives. This thread was started to hear from those people, sadly you showed up.
As since you did not tell us what knife you own and examples of why it was the best survial knife (see title of thread). It would appear you are not one of these individuals.
So Richard either provide some information about the thread topic or shut up.
Big Tex, I think you will agree that this also hit the nail on the head. So we will be looking for your post on your knife and why it is the best "survival knife".
Richard and Tex, please try to keep your posts on track. If you want to Whine and Snivel, plese go to the Whine and Cheese forum.
You don't like what I am writing fine. Then use the scroll function and go past what I have to say. I will tell you that you are confused about pot shots. I don't do that. I name names and stand behind everyting I say.
This is what this thread was designed for. To bring out those who have used their knives, to an extreme. Personally, I don't care if you carry a factory knife or a production knife.
I just wanted to hear why you think yours is the best.
However, thread like this and "best fighting knife" as usual turn into a pissing contest. The flames are fanned by those with little or no actual experience with custom knives.
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Les Robertson
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
Cobalt
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Yes, your story was twisted, since you did not know all the facts and made an attempt to slam Busse's latest line of knives, of which the one that broke did not have any relation to. Also, the broken Busse was D-2 (isn't that what Brend uses). So there is more than one correction. Including the fact that only ONE blade broke.
As for Blah Blah Blah, when people ask questions I like to answer them as completely as I can. Sometimes I go farther in depth than some people would like. [/QUOTE] Seem to me that you went in no depth at all and infact made more erroneous comments than complete statements.
Richard, again your right, I have no doubt that there have been others who have done more with their knives. This thread was started to hear from those people, sadly you showed up.[/QUOTE] The problem is that your post had a double meaning. The real meaning of your original question sounded more like, "who in here is more qualified than me to talk about survival knives"
You don't like what I am writing fine. Then use the scroll function and go past what I have to say. I will tell you that you are confused about pot shots. I don't do that. I name names and stand behind everyting I say. [/QUOTE] You do and did take pot shots. You have done it in the past with Randall and now are doing it with Busse. Well if Busse hadn't come in here to state the truth, a lot of people would have though that it was an INFI or A-2 Busse that broke, not an experimental Busse in D-2.
This is what this thread was designed for. To bring out those who have used their knives, to an extreme. Personally, I don't care if you carry a factory knife or a production knife.[/QUOTE]Yes you do. If you can sell some customs from your posting, then you care.
However, thread like this and "best fighting knife" as usual turn into a pissing contest. The flames are fanned by those with little or no actual experience with custom knives.
[/QUOTE]Sorry, but inexperience comes from the military as well as civilian circles. Some of the most unknowing knife people I have met were military SF, FR, Rangers and Seals, and some were quite knowledgeable, but none have seen as many factory knives break as you have, Les. In fact all their experiences put together have not seen as many factory knives break.
I have one family member who was a ranger and carried a Randall the entire time. He used it to open ammo crates, clear zones, skinning, quartering animals and a host of other uses for over 6 years. All his buddies thought he was crazy using an "expensive" Randall for heavy chores. Imagine what they would have said about a Brend
I have another family member who used an old sog style knife in vietnam and never had it fail and did many of the same things mentioned above.
And yet another family member who has used a Busse SH to hack into wood hutches, hack through thick bamboo, thick vines and trees, pry house doors open, etc. Not once did this knife fail. Did he try other knives and did they fail? yes. But just a couple and it was already known that they would break.
One final question for Les. Why is it that you have seen tons of factory knives break, but have not seen one Custom knife break? this sounds kind of strange to me.
Do you think that maybe if there were 1000 Brends being used in the field all over the world, that there might be several that broke. I would say yes, wouldn't you. Any knife can be broken if you try hard enough including the best, so does that make brend a poor choice no, but neither does it make Randall or a Busse a poor or lesser choice than a brend. NO
The Brend displays many design features that do not go well in survival situations. Cliff touched on a few of them. I really do not think a Brend would out last a Busse, in fact I would say the other way around and would rather trust my life to a Busse than an unknown quantity like a Brend. I say unknown because, they have not really been tested hard out there by anyone, except Les. If I am wrong on this, then let's hear from other Brend owners who have thouroughly abused their $1000 knife by Prying with it and hard chopping, etc. This is not meant as a slam against brend, but his knife has not been tested as hard as other known knives.
Les, had you mentioned the Carson, U-2, I you might have had some more background, since there are several gov people who have used them hard and that knife has developed a reputation for toughness. And it's not the only one. Congrats T.Rinaldi on some fine looking knives. I guess they will get a wringing out soon.
Les Robertson
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Cobalt,
I stand by my statement about Busse knives. I have talked with Jerry about this.
Yes, there are probably 1000 Brends out there being used by Military and Law Enforcement people all over the world. Have any broke, not to my knowledge.
I never said I have never seen custom knives fail.
However, I have seen a lot more factory knives fail.
You are correct, lots of SF types no nothing about knives. Again, I never said the people in the Military or LEO's were knife experts.
Cobalt, you seem to be doing a lot of infering of your own. You like to use all my quotes. How about you stick to the facts as well.
You carried a Randall and it worked for you. Great. Go back and read the title of this thread.
You will note, that I did comment that Randall's not Busse's or Brends were the most field tested knives out there.
Does it help me to sell knives because I get involved with threads like this. Yes it does. Just like it helps all the makers who post here or those who post comments about how great there new (insert name here) knife is.
Surely you don't think Mike Turber started Blade Forums out of the kindess of his heart.
Mike is a smart buiness man, he started this forum to make money.
One thing often overlooked by factory knife buyers (as ususally it has no real relevance) and novice custom knife buyers. Is that by buying the "right" custom knives, your knives will maintain and possibly appreciate in value.
Is that a big deal for a $250 Randall? No. Might this be a factor in purchasing a $1,000 Brend? Yes, it will be.
One of the reasons I defend the knives I sell, is that I do have that return policy. So with every knife I sell, I put my money where my mouth is. With EVERY KNIFE.
Part of my job is to insure my customers get the best quality they can for the money.
Regarding the U-2, next time you get a chance look at a LDC F-3.
Cobalt, do I occasionally make mistakes, yes. I thought the first Guild Show was in KC in 72. Now I know better.
However, long term Im right a lot more than I am wrong.
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Les Robertson
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
I stand by my statement about Busse knives. I have talked with Jerry about this.
Yes, there are probably 1000 Brends out there being used by Military and Law Enforcement people all over the world. Have any broke, not to my knowledge.
I never said I have never seen custom knives fail.
However, I have seen a lot more factory knives fail.
You are correct, lots of SF types no nothing about knives. Again, I never said the people in the Military or LEO's were knife experts.
Cobalt, you seem to be doing a lot of infering of your own. You like to use all my quotes. How about you stick to the facts as well.
You carried a Randall and it worked for you. Great. Go back and read the title of this thread.
You will note, that I did comment that Randall's not Busse's or Brends were the most field tested knives out there.
Does it help me to sell knives because I get involved with threads like this. Yes it does. Just like it helps all the makers who post here or those who post comments about how great there new (insert name here) knife is.
Surely you don't think Mike Turber started Blade Forums out of the kindess of his heart.
Mike is a smart buiness man, he started this forum to make money.
One thing often overlooked by factory knife buyers (as ususally it has no real relevance) and novice custom knife buyers. Is that by buying the "right" custom knives, your knives will maintain and possibly appreciate in value.
Is that a big deal for a $250 Randall? No. Might this be a factor in purchasing a $1,000 Brend? Yes, it will be.
One of the reasons I defend the knives I sell, is that I do have that return policy. So with every knife I sell, I put my money where my mouth is. With EVERY KNIFE.
Part of my job is to insure my customers get the best quality they can for the money.
Regarding the U-2, next time you get a chance look at a LDC F-3.
Cobalt, do I occasionally make mistakes, yes. I thought the first Guild Show was in KC in 72. Now I know better.
However, long term Im right a lot more than I am wrong.
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Les Robertson
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
After reading this thread in its entirety, I was trying to decide what my favorite quote was. I think the one above pretty well sez it all.
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Hoodoo
I get some pleasure from finding a relentlessly peaceful use for a combative looking knife.
JKM
This was really interesting for a while, until it started into the unfortunate ad hominem "pissing". Can it be put back on track? I hope so.
I can't blame Jerry for coming in to address a couple of points, albeit colourfully. I must say that it was my impression from Les' posts that the two Busses that failed were infi and that probably the blades failed catastrophically. That mistaken impression has been corrected, I'm happy to say.
Infi blades did NOT fail, if they had they would have been covered by warranty and that same customer has bought more Busses. I think Les accepts that. I'm sure he and Jerry have discussed the misunderstanding initally created between themselves like the gentleman they are. Les took it to email, which was the right thing to do. Jerry posted what he felt he needed to, which is his perogative. I think the issue is closed for the rest of us, but that's just my opinion. Noone appointed me boss.
And it's just my opinion that the pissing part should end right there.As to the knife content:
Les, you are one of the very few I've seen who actually advocates the use of double edge blades for "utility" or "survival". I always thought I was alone. But I don't use double edged blades for this much now. Using a piece of wood on the top edge to make it possible to push or "hammer" as a spine is exactly right, but
that is rarely possible when you're north of the treeline in the arctic, where I try to get for at least a few weeks a year. [amazingly, there sometimes is driftwood even north of 80!] A longer knife is very useful for ice, among other tasks. I certainly can see how if you have one knife, are in the south and are in a combat or near-combat situation the choice would be a double edge.
But I disagree about losing the knife. That is a real hazard, or possibility, in whitewater canoeing, arctic kayacking and climbing. You can't always wear a big knife in a canoe or kayak and I lash it in front of me whenever I'm using a sprayskirt. If I have to get out onto a floe or if I take a swim [heaven help me, but it happens] or even if I'm chopping or cutting and part of the berg I'm beside splits off [which has happened to me] and the last thing on my mind is holding on to my knife [it's staying afloat or rolling so I don't die], it is possible to lose the knife. That's why I always have a neck knife [if I'm wearing a survival/floater suit] or a river knife lashed to my PFD [Neil Blackwood is making me a new one in Stellite as we speak] and a spare, bigger knife, if I can spare the room and the weight. In 30 years I've never lost a knife [although I've broken many]. Maybe I've just been lucky. Obsessed, more likely.
I've been really, really pleased with my Busse's. But I can't believe that there aren't even better performing customs out there and although I don't have data that would convince someone like Cliff, I'm personally convinced my Hayes in 52100 would qualify. If I were to pick one knife as my mainstay to stake my life on, it would be the best damn knife I could afford, because I think my life is worth it. But a knife like that is more than performance alone - it's also a personal statement or relationship. As I've said before, maybe it's just that if I go out, I'd rather go out in style
. And no - it's not a matter of status. I guarantee you that more people are impressed by a Busse than by a custom maker they never heard of. Impressing people has nothing to do with it. In fact, I'd rather people not react to my knife at all [unless I want them to back off...]
I began using Busses because I wanted to be able to beat up on them rather than my very expensive and collectible customs [even though I bought my first big Hayes based on performance alone] They are more than good enough for everything I do, which is canoeing, kayaking. scrambling and camping in remote areas. But if I were dropping out of airplanes and in combat or near-combat situations [the only "combat" I might see is with a walrus or a bear, in which case without a gun I'm a snack anyways], I wouldn't prefer a Busse, with all due respect to Jerry. I don't like the balance, weight and feel of the Busses for fighting when compared, say, to a Trailmaster or a Lightfoot or a Crawford fixed blade. I didn't hear that point addressed yet at all.
corrected for typos only
[This message has been edited by HJK (edited 05-05-2001).]
I can't blame Jerry for coming in to address a couple of points, albeit colourfully. I must say that it was my impression from Les' posts that the two Busses that failed were infi and that probably the blades failed catastrophically. That mistaken impression has been corrected, I'm happy to say.
Infi blades did NOT fail, if they had they would have been covered by warranty and that same customer has bought more Busses. I think Les accepts that. I'm sure he and Jerry have discussed the misunderstanding initally created between themselves like the gentleman they are. Les took it to email, which was the right thing to do. Jerry posted what he felt he needed to, which is his perogative. I think the issue is closed for the rest of us, but that's just my opinion. Noone appointed me boss.
And it's just my opinion that the pissing part should end right there.As to the knife content:
Les, you are one of the very few I've seen who actually advocates the use of double edge blades for "utility" or "survival". I always thought I was alone. But I don't use double edged blades for this much now. Using a piece of wood on the top edge to make it possible to push or "hammer" as a spine is exactly right, but
that is rarely possible when you're north of the treeline in the arctic, where I try to get for at least a few weeks a year. [amazingly, there sometimes is driftwood even north of 80!] A longer knife is very useful for ice, among other tasks. I certainly can see how if you have one knife, are in the south and are in a combat or near-combat situation the choice would be a double edge.
But I disagree about losing the knife. That is a real hazard, or possibility, in whitewater canoeing, arctic kayacking and climbing. You can't always wear a big knife in a canoe or kayak and I lash it in front of me whenever I'm using a sprayskirt. If I have to get out onto a floe or if I take a swim [heaven help me, but it happens] or even if I'm chopping or cutting and part of the berg I'm beside splits off [which has happened to me] and the last thing on my mind is holding on to my knife [it's staying afloat or rolling so I don't die], it is possible to lose the knife. That's why I always have a neck knife [if I'm wearing a survival/floater suit] or a river knife lashed to my PFD [Neil Blackwood is making me a new one in Stellite as we speak] and a spare, bigger knife, if I can spare the room and the weight. In 30 years I've never lost a knife [although I've broken many]. Maybe I've just been lucky. Obsessed, more likely.
I've been really, really pleased with my Busse's. But I can't believe that there aren't even better performing customs out there and although I don't have data that would convince someone like Cliff, I'm personally convinced my Hayes in 52100 would qualify. If I were to pick one knife as my mainstay to stake my life on, it would be the best damn knife I could afford, because I think my life is worth it. But a knife like that is more than performance alone - it's also a personal statement or relationship. As I've said before, maybe it's just that if I go out, I'd rather go out in style
I began using Busses because I wanted to be able to beat up on them rather than my very expensive and collectible customs [even though I bought my first big Hayes based on performance alone] They are more than good enough for everything I do, which is canoeing, kayaking. scrambling and camping in remote areas. But if I were dropping out of airplanes and in combat or near-combat situations [the only "combat" I might see is with a walrus or a bear, in which case without a gun I'm a snack anyways], I wouldn't prefer a Busse, with all due respect to Jerry. I don't like the balance, weight and feel of the Busses for fighting when compared, say, to a Trailmaster or a Lightfoot or a Crawford fixed blade. I didn't hear that point addressed yet at all.
corrected for typos only
[This message has been edited by HJK (edited 05-05-2001).]
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This was an interesting thread. I'm moved to make one comment about Busse...
I have a SH II, an A2 model I guess because I bought it a few months before INFI was announced. I even corresponded with Jerry B. a few times, and I think I pissed him off because I told him I thought he could do better than micarta for the price
. Jerry, I want you to know I've come to appreciate the "grippyness" of micarta since then!
But my comment has to do with his warranty. Jerry told me that the warranty was absolutely unconditional. He would replace my knife even if I cut it in half with a torch! Now I've never known anyone else to make such an offer. Guaranteed, not only for hard use, but even after outright abuse! This is a very very clever move on his part. First of all, it is very unlikely that anyone will break a Busse, no matter what they do with it. The few people who might break one - those doing destructive testing, and the handfull in a human lifetime who might actually break one using it in the field, might cost Jerry a few thousand dollars in replacement knives. In exchange, his guarantee has likely already sold a hundred times more knives than he will ever be called upon to replace, and it will keep on doing it for as long as he makes that absolute offer!
What really supprises me is not that Jerry makes such an offer, but that more knife makers don't do the same! Interestingly, and as compared to any other product, they have almost nothing to loose and everything to gain by doing so. Way to go Jerry!
Edited to correct some spelling errors!
[This message has been edited by matthew rapaport (edited 05-08-2001).]
I have a SH II, an A2 model I guess because I bought it a few months before INFI was announced. I even corresponded with Jerry B. a few times, and I think I pissed him off because I told him I thought he could do better than micarta for the price
But my comment has to do with his warranty. Jerry told me that the warranty was absolutely unconditional. He would replace my knife even if I cut it in half with a torch! Now I've never known anyone else to make such an offer. Guaranteed, not only for hard use, but even after outright abuse! This is a very very clever move on his part. First of all, it is very unlikely that anyone will break a Busse, no matter what they do with it. The few people who might break one - those doing destructive testing, and the handfull in a human lifetime who might actually break one using it in the field, might cost Jerry a few thousand dollars in replacement knives. In exchange, his guarantee has likely already sold a hundred times more knives than he will ever be called upon to replace, and it will keep on doing it for as long as he makes that absolute offer!
What really supprises me is not that Jerry makes such an offer, but that more knife makers don't do the same! Interestingly, and as compared to any other product, they have almost nothing to loose and everything to gain by doing so. Way to go Jerry!
Edited to correct some spelling errors!
[This message has been edited by matthew rapaport (edited 05-08-2001).]
Les Robertson
BANNED
- Joined
- Oct 10, 1998
- Messages
- 3,565
Cobalt,
I love your quote of:
"The other Busse did not break at all, just the handle did".
Oddly, enough I consider the handle part of the knife, don't you?
------------------
Les Robertson
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
I love your quote of:
"The other Busse did not break at all, just the handle did".
Oddly, enough I consider the handle part of the knife, don't you?
------------------
Les Robertson
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
not2sharp
Platinum Member
- Joined
- Jun 29, 1999
- Messages
- 19,876
Wow, I always thought the survival knife catagory was a little broader than Brend, Busse, Randall, and Reeves. Are there any other worthy maker out there? You gotta wonder how the rest of the world survives. What did we ever do before Randall?
Cobalt
Gold Member
- Joined
- Dec 23, 1998
- Messages
- 17,262
Les, yes, the handle is part of the knife. However, you can get along without the handle in a pinch on a full tang knife. You can't get along without the blade. Micarta is micarta is micarta....It is interesting what you consider a broken knife. If the sheath breaks does that also qualify as a broken knife
OK. I confess that by "broken knife" I thought it was the blade, and a broken blade is, to me, more serious than a broken handle. Hell, the Japanese didn't even regard the handle as an important part of their swords. The blade was the thing.
I'm not a Samurai and a busted handle is a busted knife nonetheless. There still is a difference, and the difference is worth noting, but in the context Les was using I think his comment is fair. Hey, even Les can get lucky sometimes
No, I don't think a broken sheath is the same thing - although that should also be under warranty. Busse makes great production knives. Many of the sheaths aren't nearly as good. Cold Steel, for example, has delivered garbage sheaths. Does that mean they make lousy knives? Do you average them out and say the Busse "knives" are so-so? Nah. I like semantics as much as the next guy but this is silly. OK. Let's resolve it. 50,451 angels can dance on the head of a pin. Happy?
[me corect louzy spelink ounly]
[This message has been edited by HJK (edited 05-09-2001).]
I'm not a Samurai and a busted handle is a busted knife nonetheless. There still is a difference, and the difference is worth noting, but in the context Les was using I think his comment is fair. Hey, even Les can get lucky sometimes
No, I don't think a broken sheath is the same thing - although that should also be under warranty. Busse makes great production knives. Many of the sheaths aren't nearly as good. Cold Steel, for example, has delivered garbage sheaths. Does that mean they make lousy knives? Do you average them out and say the Busse "knives" are so-so? Nah. I like semantics as much as the next guy but this is silly. OK. Let's resolve it. 50,451 angels can dance on the head of a pin. Happy?
[me corect louzy spelink ounly]
[This message has been edited by HJK (edited 05-09-2001).]