Why isn't M4 more commonly used?

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Feb 22, 2014
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I'm interested in experiencing the steel but the only 3 knives I know of that use it are the Benchmade Contego (which is way too big and tactical for me), the Spyderco Air (which is a bit too lightweight for me), and the Spyderco Gayle Bradley (which I know is getting a redesign relatively soon-ish)

It seems like a very tough high performance steel, albeit not stainless. I'm surprised that it isn't used more often.


Are there any I'm missing?
 
I'm interested in experiencing the steel but the only 3 knives I know of that use it are the Benchmade Contego (which is way too big and tactical for me), the Spyderco Air (which is a bit too lightweight for me), and the Spyderco Gayle Bradley (which I know is getting a redesign relatively soon-ish)

It seems like a very tough high performance steel, albeit not stainless. I'm surprised that it isn't used more often.


Are there any I'm missing?

Spyderco is doing a sprint run of the pm2 in m4 and th delica in hap40 which I've heard is similar. I want to try the steel too. I'm looking at the delica.
 
I have one in M4 made by Phil Wilson, and in his words (via email), "it eats belts like no other."

I'm guessing the difficulty/wear and tear in producing the blades coupled with the fact that it's not a stainless steel.

I have gotten the impression before that enough people believe a non stainless requires a lot of maintenance to prevent it from ending up a heap of rust. I personally have had zero issues using all day I the woods for various tasks, cutting limes before work (bartend), cleaning out a friend's turkey recently. I clean it off and make sure it's completely dry. I don't keep it oiled either. As with most things, ymmv.
 
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@Shotgun, Yeah I'm looking forward to the P2 sprint run, doubt I'll be quick enough though.

@trevitrace, I'm surprised by what Mr. Wilson said, I wasn't aware it was that hard! From what I heard it's relatively easy to sharpen compared to how long it holds an edge
 
There is a ZT 0770 in M4 as well. At $239 it is $59 more than the Elmax 0770 with CF. M4 is about 20% more than Elmax.

That's big chunk of machining cost.
 
I have a test knife in m4 from luong (bluntcut) that is scary. He ran it at 65-66hrc and it just keeps cutting. I have lightly sharpened it once on a DMT eef once since january and I have used it a ton. Little stropping on diamond slurry on a legal pad brings it back to frightening after a ton of cardboard. Russ. I think it should be more widely used for sure.
 
I carry a Contego on duty. It is not a knife I would have picked out for myself, but it was a gift. Its a beast of a folder and very strong. It has the best factory edge of any knife I own hands down and has maintained it for a solid year with nothing more than a few a light stroppings on compound loaded leather. Being carried on duty this knife sees plenty of sweat and rain and I have not had any issues with rust even on the edge or where the coating has worn through. If you don't store it wet it should be fine. If it gets soaked I just shake it out and lay it out open so it can air dry.
 
I've got a grip in the stuff. Steel gets very sharp and it didn't take too much effort for me to sharpen it.
I did have it rust on me from my sweat, but I was able to take off the rust easily with some sandpaper. Don't really care about how it looks, so I don't mind using sandpaper.
 
#1 - (relatively)Tough on production equipment compared to other stainless steels at similar selling prices
#2 - Casual consumers typically prefer stainless/low maintenance steels at similar price points and similar performance points

Regardless of the above, IM(very)HO, properly heat-treated and ground M4 is one of the very best knife steels on the planet. With just a minimal amount of care, it will perform wonders. Why do you think so many cutting competitors use it?
 
I carry a Contego on duty. It is not a knife I would have picked out for myself, but it was a gift. Its a beast of a folder and very strong. It has the best factory edge of any knife I own hands down and has maintained it for a solid year with nothing more than a few a light stroppings on compound loaded leather. Being carried on duty this knife sees plenty of sweat and rain and I have not had any issues with rust even on the edge or where the coating has worn through. If you don't store it wet it should be fine. If it gets soaked I just shake it out and lay it out open so it can air dry.

Good info that I've been looking for...from a cop.
Thanks, and thank you for your service. As per your note...WHAT knife would you have picked out for yourself?
 
I'm interested in experiencing the steel

As other people said, grinding it is difficult and it's not a true stainless. That said, I wouldn't let that deter you from giving it a try. Given that its burr management alleviates its grinding difficulties so it's not that bad to sharpen, as well as the fact that it's not a serious rust risk like carbon steels, it's well worth the tradeoff for its performance.
 
Good info that I've been looking for...from a cop.
Thanks, and thank you for your service. As per your note...WHAT knife would you have picked out for yourself?

For years I carried either a Gerber Gator or a Leatherman in a pouch on my belt.

I use a blade on duty very little but find a multitool very useful. Seems there is always a Philips or flat screw needing tightening. I now prefer a dedicated knife that can act as a backup weapon if needed and keep a small toolkit in the car or in my bike's saddle bag.
 
Like other people here have said, most of the reason will be the wear it puts on machinery and tooling equipment when used, and the other reason is probably the fact that the majority of the market would prefer a steel that was stainless (myself included honestly), so there is a smaller market for it than most production companies would like for some of their designs.

I would like to see more blades in M4 as well, but I also don't like taking care of steels that corrode easily, and patina is not my thing, so I have to stick to blades with a coating on them when I want M4. I'm thinking about getting a Gayle Bradley and having someone cerakote the blade for me, because I really love the design, but the satin finish has been holding me back.

Another thing to take into consideration is the fact that M4 is not as widely used in general, and so it is not as easy to get a hold of large amounts of it in general. In addition to the higher production costs, the raw steel itself is more expensive and less available than other alternatives like S30V, S35VN, VG10, etc.
Not only that, but when Spyderco has a knife made in Taiwan with M4 steel, they have to ship a load of the steel over to Taiwan in order to do that, since Crucible CPM-M4 is made in the US. They also have to do this for Carpenter's steels, but they can ship those over in larger amounts since they have more shipments from Carpenter anyway. Spyderco doesn't use as many Crucible steels now besides mainly S30V, so they don't have as many opportunities to send M4 over to their production facilities out of the country I imagine. It would likely be a smaller reason in general for them, but it's something to think about as well.
 
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