Why the "double hollow"'grind on old 110s?

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pinnah

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Older 110s like some of the 2 dot 110s have a peculiar hollow grind that gets thicker just above the edge.

Here's one of several old threads on the subject .

The question is, Why did Buck use this grind?

I really like it. Better than the current grind for wood, IME. But I'm wondering about why Buck might have used it?
 
Because bucks theory was to strengthen the edge, they made throes old knives to be used hard. I agree with u also on liking the grind more, I wish they still used it. But.... I thought it was a convex grind?? I may be wrong.
 
I carry a old two dot 112, and it's the same grind you describe. Imo they cut lots better, they don't slice like the new grind. But the new grind is just plain wimpy. Again it's just my opinion.
 
Interesting question, Pinnah. I have a 112 and 110, both two-dots. The 112 appears (and feels) to have a straight "single hollow" hollow grind — it was also reprofiled by some previous owner — but the 110 has the double-hollow one you speak of. I have no idea as to their age, apart from the general two-dot age range.

You can see the two grinds in the image below — note the sleeks on the 110, which show where the ridges are. (Both knives are auction-site buys, so I have no idea of their histories.)

tumblr_muq7ygz6Fd1r4zf5xo2_1280.jpg
 
First off, before a WRong Term gets going: that is not what Buck called this grind. Should you care to do a little reading and research you'd easily find in Buck's own literature it's called a semi-hollow grind. Later in Buck's research it was found that a full hollow grind cut better. DM
 
According to the catra test yes. My personal experience no. My old ones will out cut any new grind buck has.
 
I've run these different grinds thru cutting tests on 1/4" sisal rope and found that the edge 2000 cuts much quicker and hangs up less. It's very evident in cutting cold, thick meat. Such as a whole brisket. It requires less effort to push the blade in, making deep cuts. "Data in the real world beats lab data any day." From Jeff Hubbard, a long term Buck Knives employee. DM
 
You would have to see how I sharpen the old blades to see what I'm talking about, it seems to cut better for me anyway.
 
Thanks for the responses so far. Proper names and cutting performance issues aside, does anybody have any insight on the question of why Buck used this grind? What was the design goal?

Was it related to the driving blades through bolts demonstrations and the need for more edge strength?
 
pinnah said:
Thanks for the responses so far. Proper names and cutting performance issues aside, does anybody have any insight on the question of why Buck used this grind?
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Pinnah, why do you think that Buck made this grinding?
I think someone did it after sale.

Haebbie
 
buckman110 said:
Well I posted why above.
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Sorry, I should have been more clear. You did, indeed, say why.

buckman110 said:
Because bucks theory was to strengthen the edge, they made throes old knives to be used hard. I agree with u also on liking the grind more, I wish they still used it. But.... I thought it was a convex grind?? I may be wrong.
Click to expand...

Perhaps the better, more precise question is, to strengthen the edge against breakage from what? Was Buck seeing breakage prior to that? What sort of "hard use" were they anticipating? Was there any other reason they were using it? For example, were there any other makers at the time who were using/experimenting with that type of grind that might have caught Buck's interest or perhaps customer interest?

@Haebbie, the grind is definitely from the factory. The most obvious aspect of it (to me) is the swelling of the material between the low point in the hollow and the edge. It gets *thicker* there, and noticeably so. Very easy to feel even by hand. My old 2 dot has always had this.

This shot of my 2 dot gives some indication if you look at the shading/glare just in front of the tang. You can see where the material thickens above the edge. The glare in this shot indicates the deeper part of the hollow and it is thinner above the swell.
Buck 110 by Pinnah, on Flickr
 
Well as far as any other makers using that grind, I don't know for sure. But buck was striving for the strongest knife in every aspect possible. I've actually took a wore out 112 and drove it through a 16 penny nail like the depiction in the 300 series embilum. Withvery minimum damage. Ok, now about the grind being made/created on your knife...... no, anyone that has ever picked up a 2 dot knows that's how thoes blades were made. That was there best Damn blade ever made by buck of that time period in my opinion. Idk why they changed it. I would rather have edge strength as opposed to "cutting" better. I put such a hair popping edge on my stuff it don't matter, its gonna be cut clean regardless. Some things are just to technical I think.
 
Buckman110, was that grind used on any of the fixed blades of that era like the 103?

I very much prefer it too, btw. I think there's a big difference between slicing and cutting. More particularly, a big difference at slicing self-separating material like rope, meat and CARTA gel, slicing non-separating materials like potatoes and cutting wood - each requiring different edge geometries.
 
pinnah said:
Buckman110, was that grind used on any of the fixed blades of that era like the 103?

I very much prefer it too, btw. I think there's a big difference between slicing and cutting. More particularly, a big difference at slicing self-separating material like rope, meat and CARTA gel, slicing non-separating materials like potatoes and cutting wood - each requiring different edge geometries.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure about all of them. I've seen a 119 like that, I have a 124 that has that same grind. Its 440c to the thing is a Damn BEAST!!!! I wanna use it bad lol. But I would assume so. They switched the grind in the late 80's if I'm not mistaken.
 
I've got a 20degree edge on my 2 dot 112 I last sharpened it about a month ago, I've cut evvverything with it, it keeps the edge just fine. They just made better knives back then in my opinion.
 
I remember the little care brochure in my first Buck 110's box cautioned against laying the blade too flat against the stone when sharpening lest you flatten the "shoulders".It even had a line drawing of a cross section illustrating the flaring out right before the edge that it said was to strengthen the edge.I think that was in 1982.This 1977 2 dot has it though I could not get it to show in this pic very well,the 112 is a 100 yr Buck anniversary model.

 
Willis, i think the picture does an excellent job of showing it if you what to look for. Very similar to mine.

Thanks for the reference to the care instructions. Wonderful.

FWIW, here's a recent discussion in the Maintenance forum in which I asked for insight as to why this semi-hollow grind does so well making wood shavings. Short version is that the width near the edge makes it act more like a Scandi or convexed Scandi grind where that large "shoulder" creates a fulcrum that allows for easy edge angle control. My later Bucks and my Case with thinner traditional hollow grinds slice meat better but the old 2 dot 110 makes better shavings.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...Blade-and-edge-design-and-curly-wood-shavings
 
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