Why the talk about specfifc steels for fixed blades vs folding?

A

Aldebaran

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Sep 18, 2004
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I understand that knives can be used in different circumstances. I also understand that a fixed blade will most likely be used to do things a folding will not be asked to do. I have seen many discussions asking which steel to use for a fixed blade and which steel to use for a folding knife.

To me there are two main categories of steels, stainless and not. Whether you want to use stainless depends entirely on the environment and the chance of corrosion.

Any other considerations for the steel composition seems to come down to personal choice and cost.

Whether a knife is to be used to skin a boar, or cut down boxes, or hack down a tree, there seems to be no "best" steel for any of these. Obviously some special uses can be best met by a narrower range of steels, but everyone here seems to have an opinion most of the time on the exact scenarios which steel is best.

So a fixed blade might do some chopping that a folder probably won't do. But the same criteria will need to be met by both blades according to the preferences of the user. Some like easy to sharpen over ultimate edge retention that is hard to sharpen especially in the field. Some prefer more ductile than brittle. Some prefer toothy over smooth grain structure on the edge. There seems to be no real benefit for a steel for fixed blade use vs folding blade.

What am I missing?
 
Interesting topic. Off the top of my head.....

A fixed blade would likely be used for push cutting through wood,where a polished edge would be favored. Whereas a folder would more often be used as a slicer, where a toothy edge is more effective.

As you say, a fixed blade usually is used more aggressively, like chopping & batoning, where a tough steel is well suited. A folder used for slicing may be more efficient with a finer blade.

Even outdoor knives can vary based on this. If I'm out for the weekend, I may prefer a great edge holding steel so that I don't have to touch it. But if I'm thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail, then I want something easily & quickly sharpened.

Of course corrosion needs are influenced by the environment.

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It isn't just the blade that you have to think about. High carbon steels tend to rust more; if you're running a knife with bearings (or even PB washers) there's a chance that rust can penetrate the pivot and gunk it up. Camp knives are used for different things too, like hacking and slashing, actions which put undo pressure on folding knives which are primarily for daily slicing activities. Also, camp and survival knives aren't as intricate as folders and are made to take abuse, so using a cheaper but still decent steel (like 1095) that's easily available keeps costs down, so you don't mind beating it up. And a multitude of other reasons which the "which steel" threads love to dissect if you actually read them.

So no, there's a reason most folder manufacturers don't use 1095 and other high carbon steels in their folders, and vice versa. Stainless knives with their rust inhibiting properties help protect the pivot, the undisputed weakest point of any folder, and the different types that are coming out nowadays (supersteels and the like) make a cutting edge even sharper but often at the cost of increased hacking/slashing wear.

Hence why people tend to use specific steels for specific jobs.
 
1095 would pretty much do it all, and its probably the only Steel available in everything from slipjoints to hunting knives and big choppers.
I don't really worry about Steel though, and would never have any issues because knives are for cutting and axes are for chopping.
 
Very, very broadly speaking, fixed blades (particularly larger ones) tend to be made of tougher steels, while folders tend to be made with more wear resistant steels. This is because typically fixed blades are used for tasks like chopping, batoning, prying, digging that require more impact resistance/toughness. Folders typically don't chop or baton, so they don't need as much toughness. Instead, they generally need more wear resistance for tasks like cutting cardboard, etc.

If there was only one steel that could be used for knives, I think we could manage by adjusting heat treat and geometry. You'd end up with some strange geometry though, depending on what that one blade steel was.

For instance, using steels with high toughness like cpm 3v, S7, or L6 allows a blade with fairly normal geometry/thickness to be incredibly tough as a chopping type knife. A blade made for the same use as the above steels, but made out of something wear resistant but not tough like ZDP189 would have very strange geometry (i.e., very thick, and possibly low hardness) in order to survive its intended use.
 
I would rather have stainless or semi-stainless in my folders, and 1095 or similar carbon steel in large fixed blade knives that may see Batoning use. VG-10 is an example of a steel I like in folders, but wouldnt neccesarily want as a field knife. I have been testing many different steels on fixed blades alone in the field to find out exactly what works best for me. in the pic, all knives have different steels as well as grinds, and performed very differently at all tasks.
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caseknife64 said:
Sorry, but you are wrong.
Click to expand...
That was an extremely insightful and helpful response. Thank you

MAD777
You basically are agreeing with what I said. It is more the use and your preference on what type of maintenance you want to do rather than the fact that it is a fixed blade or not.

SaraLikesKnives
As I said, it is more a matter of the environment rather the type of blade. I see your point regarding the construction difference dictating stainless more for folders, but that does not mean there aren't tough stainless steels suitable for fixed blades. Fixed blades also benefit from being stainless in many environments. As you said, the choice to use 1095 is probably for cost rather than being the most apt steel type.

ocnLogan
I have a few knives, folding and fixed, that use VG10 to good effect. It is hard to argue that an Endura or Delica is a bad knife and the steel is poor. It would also be hard to argue against the VG10 Fallkniven F1, S1, A1, and A2. They work very well too in all environments. I am not saying that everyone should use VG10 but it is definitely a good all purpose all weather steel.

Remember that I am talking about blade type. Of course I would not use a folder made out of 1095 to clean fish all day just as I would not use AUS6 in a heavy chopping scenario.
 
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Aldebaran said:
That was an extremely insightful and helpful response. Thank you

MAD777
You basically are agreeing with what I said. It is more the use and your preference on what type of maintenance you want to do rather than the fact that it is a fixed blade or not.

SaraLikesKnives
As I said, it is more a matter of the environment rather the type of blade. I see your point regarding the construction difference dictating stainless more for folders, but that does not mean there aren't tough stainless steels suitable for fixed blades. Fixed blades also benefit from being stainless in many environments. As you said, the choice to use 1095 is probably for cost rather than being the most apt steel type.

ocnLogan
I have a few knives, folding and fixed, that use VG10 to good effect. It is hard to argue that an Endura or Delica is a bad knife and the steel is poor. It would also be hard to argue against the VG10 Fallkniven F1, S1, A1, and A2. They work very well too in all environments. I am not saying that everyone should use VG10 but it is definitely a good all purpose all weather steel.

Remember that I am talking about blade type. Of course I would not use a folder made out of 1095 to clean fish all day just as I would not use AUS6 in a heavy chopping scenario.
Click to expand...

actually, ocnLogan said nothing about VG10, that was me :)
 
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