Wicked Edge: Microbevels

halden.doerge

halden.doerge

I'll Sharpen Your Knife
Gold Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2014
Messages
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I've been sharpening on the Wicked Edge for several years now, but I've never gotten into microbevels. Honestly, I never really found the need and so I just never went down that road.

Well... I was sorta thinking of messing around with some, so tell me fellow sharpeners, how do YOU like to go about applying a good microbevel?
 
Increase the angle 2 or 3 degrees per side (dps) and make no more than 10 passes per side, alternating after each pass. I typically use just two grits, so coarse is at the lower angle, fine at the higher. Grit is relative, as some of my knives start at 4000 grit and finish with a few passes at the Sharpmaker fine white ceramic.
 
I tried to add a micro-bevel to a convex-ground fixed blade. I ended up sending it to Josh at Razor Edge.
 
I think micro bevels are a mistake and only sharpen my knives single bevel (usually after an agressive reprofile).
The exception FOR ME would be if I over did the reprofile and the shallow angle wasn't holding up to an abusive task.
So far, with my folders, that has never happened.
If it did I would start with one degree per side.
Sharpening in the field with say two stones, a very coarse and a much finer stone, then yes do the refining at a steeper micro bevel.
Once I got back from the trip though I would go back to the original shallower bevel and four or five stones finishing at the same angle.
 
Why do you think they're a mistake?

If I had the angle control to make repeatable 1 degree changes, I might not use them, but probably would. I'm hoping to build an Edgepro type wooden sharpening jig, but even then I don't know if 1 degree control can be expected.
 
I dont do micro bevels often. But when i do i go about 5-7 or even 10 degrees more than the bevel on my lansky guided system. I use my fine stone and/or ceramic stone. I use no more pressure than the weight of the stone. 4-6 strokes per side and check the edge with my finger. Usually thats enough.
 
I only apply a micro-bevel if I'm having a lot of trouble removing a particularly stubborn burr. Nine times out of ten I find that this isn't necessary.
 
I use Edge Pro and now practice single stone sharpening with a coarse diamond or silicon carbide stone.
With this, I don't really need a microbevel, as the edge can be easily maintained.
If I put a polished edge, I would probably go for a microbevel.
 
All my knives Hollow / Scandi / Saber / Flat grinds have a micro-bevel with a couple of exceptions because of the primary grind did not allow a secondary bevel without removing too much material. Some have a convex edge some don't. And NO micro-bevel on Convex blades.

I always sharpened my blades this way because it is simply faster to sharpen only the secondary bevel instead of the whole primary one. And it creates a thicker support behind the apex. Gives you much more control on the angle you want on your edge without re-profiling the whole blade. And finally is a breeze to maintain on the field.
 
I love them .. Use them all the time. There are 3 reasons I use them.

1. Crisp, clean, and strong apex (because no wire edge)
2. Allow you to sharpen your knife to lower angles than you otherwise would so your cutting ability is enhanced
3. Touch ups are a breeze and can be done in seconds vs minutes.
 
im learning to like them, especially for the daily kitchen knives - makes for quick retouches, with a full resharpen every 6 months plus
 
I typically do a micro bevel on most of my knives simply because it allows for quick touch-ups. For example my Sebenzas are re-profiled to 18dps and I do a few quick swipes weekly on my fine and ultra-fine Spyderco Sharpmaker at 20dps. That way I'm ensuring that I'm hitting the apex without really changing too much of the original 18dps angle. When that stops working well then I'll take the knife back to my WE for an 18dps sharpen. I will add that since I very recently upgraded my WE to the new Gen3 clamp I may just go back to a using it for touch-ups since clamping FFG and smaller blades is so much easier.
 
I use them more and more. Most often as a simple bridge between a fairly coarse stone and a much finer one. Approx 2° increase per side on a guide, freehand I make a few light passes at the original angle to feel it out, and elevate the spine a little to create the micro.

I do not normally continue to work the micro angle for touchups, preferring a hard strop surface instead.

I used to not appreciate them very much but after using them for a time, I'm not seeing a downside except for very coarse utility edges or on factory edges that I'm not reprofiling and come with overly broad angles to begin with.
 
I always use them. I start by profiling at 12-15 dps to a high polish then adding a 18-20 dps microbevel with my diamond grit of choice. Afterwards, I lower the angle by 2dps and do 1-2 light passes per side to knock the shoulder off the microbevel to reduce cutting friction.
 
Hi,
Wowbagger said:
I think micro bevels are a mistake
Click to expand...
me2 said:
Why do you think they're a mistake?
Click to expand...
Soapboxes are slippery? :p



me2 said:
I'm hoping to build an Edgepro type wooden sharpening jig, but even then I don't know if 1 degree control can be expected.
Click to expand...

1 degree control with a wooden edge pro type jig? I dont see why not :)

If the run is two foot (609.6mm)
then the rise change to change 1 degree is always over 10mm/0.4inch

So even if stone wear during sharpening is +-1mm wobble, its still within 1 degree

just gotta mark/note and clamp/backstop everything consistently to within 1mm

It should work even with 5mm rise / 12inch run

Side 1: 304.8 opposite angle: 71°
Side 2: 322.363 opposite angle: 90°
Side 3: 104.951 opposite angle: 19°
+5mm
Side 3: 110.938 opposite angle: 20°


Side 1: 304.8 opposite angle: 89°
Side 2: 304.846 opposite angle: 90°
Side 3: 5.32 opposite angle: 1°
+5mm
Side 3: 10.644 opposite angle: 2°




Hmm $5 worth of new wood and new screws, 10 cuts (saw or baton) and about a dozen screws screwed , the triangle apex , angles only go from 0 to 20 cause its for knives :p




 
bucketstove said:
1 degree control with a wooden edge pro type jig? I dont see why not :)
If the run is two foot (609.6mm)
then the rise change to change 1 degree is always over 10mm/0.4inch
Click to expand...
Here is a simpler machine , an advanced PaulSellersKnifeSharpeningSystem.png,
If you thought systems were overpriced before ;)
The final apex the $2-$3 snap together knife sharpener

To change angles slide the riser pivot along the base run.
Closer to the edge/knife for higher angle, further away for lower angle.
Image depicts 10 degrees angle.

Commercial version would retail for 3x the price
and be 3x as beefy (same dimensions but cut from plywood? )

$1.05 Common: 1 in. x 2 in. x 8 ft;
Actual: 0.656 in. x 1.468 in. x 96 in.
stoneholder hypotenuse 20" + 20" + 2" + 2"
base run 13" + 3" + 3"
angle riser pivot 4.5" + 4" + 1" + 1"
wood used 73.5" wood remaining 22.5"

single flat angle riser pivot 3°-14° dps
3° rise( 16.66) run(317.93) hypo(318.37) rundiff( 159.2)
14° rise( 16.66) run( 66.83) hypo( 68.87) rundiff( 5.3)
16° rise( 16.66) run( 58.11) hypo( 60.45) rundiff( 4.1)

single UP angle riser pivot 7°-21° degrees per side
7° rise( 38.00) run(309.49) hypo(311.81) rundiff( 52.1)
21° rise( 38.00) run( 98.99) hypo(106.04) rundiff( 5.4)
22° rise( 38.00) run( 94.05) hypo(101.44) rundiff( 4.9)

the final apex the $2-$3 snap together knife sharpener

hmm, maybe switch base run wings (green in picture) from 3" to 2.5"

### 16.662mm single flat

angle( 3) rise( 16.66) run(317.93) hypo(318.37) rundiff( 159.2)
angle( 4) rise( 16.66) run(238.28) hypo(238.86) rundiff( 79.7)
angle( 5) rise( 16.66) run(190.45) hypo(191.18) rundiff( 47.8)
angle( 6) rise( 16.66) run(158.53) hypo(159.40) rundiff( 31.9)
angle( 7) rise( 16.66) run(135.70) hypo(136.72) rundiff( 22.8)
angle( 8) rise( 16.66) run(118.56) hypo(119.72) rundiff( 17.1)
angle( 9) rise( 16.66) run(105.20) hypo(106.51) rundiff( 13.4)
angle(10) rise( 16.66) run( 94.49) hypo( 95.95) rundiff( 10.7)
angle(11) rise( 16.66) run( 85.72) hypo( 87.32) rundiff( 8.8)
angle(12) rise( 16.66) run( 78.39) hypo( 80.14) rundiff( 7.3)
angle(13) rise( 16.66) run( 72.17) hypo( 74.07) rundiff( 6.2)
angle(14) rise( 16.66) run( 66.83) hypo( 68.87) rundiff( 5.3)

angle(15) rise( 16.66) run( 62.18) hypo( 64.38) rundiff( 4.6)


### 37.2872mm single UP
angle( 7) rise( 37.29) run(303.68) hypo(305.96) rundiff( 51.1)
angle( 8) rise( 37.29) run(265.31) hypo(267.92) rundiff( 38.4)
angle( 9) rise( 37.29) run(235.42) hypo(238.36) rundiff( 29.9)
angle(10) rise( 37.29) run(211.47) hypo(214.73) rundiff( 24.0)
angle(11) rise( 37.29) run(191.83) hypo(195.42) rundiff( 19.6)
angle(12) rise( 37.29) run(175.42) hypo(179.34) rundiff( 16.4)
angle(13) rise( 37.29) run(161.51) hypo(165.76) rundiff( 13.9)
angle(14) rise( 37.29) run(149.55) hypo(154.13) rundiff( 12.0)
angle(15) rise( 37.29) run(139.16) hypo(144.07) rundiff( 10.4)
angle(16) rise( 37.29) run(130.04) hypo(135.28) rundiff( 9.1)
angle(17) rise( 37.29) run(121.96) hypo(127.53) rundiff( 8.1)
angle(18) rise( 37.29) run(114.76) hypo(120.66) rundiff( 7.2)
angle(19) rise( 37.29) run(108.29) hypo(114.53) rundiff( 6.5)
angle(20) rise( 37.29) run(102.45) hypo(109.02) rundiff( 5.8)
angle(21) rise( 37.29) run( 97.14) hypo(104.05) rundiff( 5.3)


### 20.6248mm single UP w/single flat for kniferest ( 37.2872mm - 16.6624mm)
angle( 4) rise( 20.62) run(294.95) hypo(295.67) rundiff( 98.6)
angle( 5) rise( 20.62) run(235.74) hypo(236.64) rundiff( 59.2)
angle( 6) rise( 20.62) run(196.23) hypo(197.31) rundiff( 39.5)
angle( 7) rise( 20.62) run(167.98) hypo(169.24) rundiff( 28.3)
angle( 8) rise( 20.62) run(146.75) hypo(148.20) rundiff( 21.2)
angle( 9) rise( 20.62) run(130.22) hypo(131.84) rundiff( 16.5)
angle(10) rise( 20.62) run(116.97) hypo(118.77) rundiff( 13.3)
angle(11) rise( 20.62) run(106.11) hypo(108.09) rundiff( 10.9)
angle(12) rise( 20.62) run( 97.03) hypo( 99.20) rundiff( 9.1)
angle(13) rise( 20.62) run( 89.34) hypo( 91.69) rundiff( 7.7)
angle(14) rise( 20.62) run( 82.72) hypo( 85.25) rundiff( 6.6)
angle(15) rise( 20.62) run( 76.97) hypo( 79.69) rundiff( 5.7)
angle(16) rise( 20.62) run( 71.93) hypo( 74.83) rundiff( 5.0)

angle(17) rise( 20.62) run( 67.46) hypo( 70.54) rundiff( 4.5)
 
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